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  1. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Validity View Post
    I'd like to see Shuffle's duration increased, if only slightly. Maybe 7-8 seconds. As it is, spending Chi on something other than blackout kick can start a dangerous snowball. At least that's the way I've felt about it.
    This is the biggest roadblock to my learning of Brewmaster after the other two specs. You are constantly GCD locked. Worse yet, unlike DKs, getting GCD locked doesn't mean you're constantly self-healing, you're just throwing out whatever button has priority and hoping someone saves you if you're dying.
    Gone until the next expansion.

  2. #22
    we want to have shuffle up all the time, would be great, but like mr. GC said, their intention was to have shuffle up like 80%. and this is bullcrap, because without the shuffle, we take too much dmg imo. so more spells to procc shuffle and not just 2 (and 1 is a talent) OR increase the duration to 12 seconds.

    things like "converts an XY amount of agi into parry or dodge or blabla" would be nice to have

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by siccora View Post
    we want to have shuffle up all the time, would be great, but like mr. GC said, their intention was to have shuffle up like 80%. and this is bullcrap, because without the shuffle, we take too much dmg imo. so more spells to procc shuffle and not just 2 (and 1 is a talent) OR increase the duration to 12 seconds.

    things like "converts an XY amount of agi into parry or dodge or blabla" would be nice to have
    Doesn't Agi give Dodge by default?

    I don't think Shuffle would be so much of a problem if, say, they made Tiger Palm give you 1.5 seconds of Shuffle, or especially the level 30 healing talents.

  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Validity View Post
    Doesn't Agi give Dodge by default?

    I don't think Shuffle would be so much of a problem if, say, they made Tiger Palm give you 1.5 seconds of Shuffle, or especially the level 30 healing talents.
    yeah it does, but maybe then other migrationstats

  5. #25
    Honestly, once you reach higher levels of haste in combination with the ascension change, keeping shuffle up is not that difficult. Main change I would like to see is a shorter GCD for WW, and a change to their mastery. As of right now mastery is so garbage with the energy regen. I really hope his mention of changing monks for 5.2 was not just for MW.
    Nerdrage-15 Minute Cooldown. You enter a berserker rage, increasing typing speed by 75%, chance to hit CAPS LOCK by 50% and decreasing chance to get laid by 100%. You feel no pity or remorse and can not be stopped unless banned.

  6. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by JabJack View Post
    Honestly, once you reach higher levels of haste in combination with the ascension change, keeping shuffle up is not that difficult. Main change I would like to see is a shorter GCD for WW, and a change to their mastery. As of right now mastery is so garbage with the energy regen. I really hope his mention of changing monks for 5.2 was not just for MW.
    i think it's hard when u need to clear your stagger every 5 secs

  7. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by JabJack View Post
    I would like to see is a shorter GCD for WW
    With the way our skills work, a 0.5 second GCD would nearly double our DPS. They'd nerf us so fast it's not even funny. What I'd want for our mastery, (yes, this again) is for Rising Sun Kick to have a proc change where it will do pure magic damage. (and potentially with a small % boost on top of that) It would fit the mastery's name a lot better.
    Last edited by TheWindWalker; 2012-12-13 at 09:04 AM.
    Gone until the next expansion.

  8. #28
    They will need to fix WW mechanics eventually. GCD capping is already a concern and it's only the first tier of the expansion.
    I can't imagine how bad it will be 2 tiers from now. You can only reforge out of mastery/haste so much.

    Basically mastery needs a complete revamp so haste doesn't become a terrible stat.

    ---------- Post added 2012-12-13 at 04:17 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by TheWindWalker View Post
    With the way our skills work, a 0.5 second GCD would nearly double our DPS. They'd nerf us so fast it's not even funny. What I'd want for our mastery, (yes, this again) is for Rising Sun Kick to have a proc change where it will do pure magic damage. (and potentially with a small % boost on top of that) It would fit the mastery's name a lot better.
    While I agree lowering the gcd is not the way to go there is no way it would double our dps.

  9. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Jayma View Post
    While I agree lowering the gcd is not the way to go there is no way it would double our dps.
    Why not? I'm not being hyperbolic here. We stay GCD locked the entire time and because our "rotation" is "Jab->(gcd)->any other instance move->(gcd)->repeat" we'd have an enormous leap of damage. It would at least be 75% more.
    Gone until the next expansion.

  10. #30
    To add to BM, i would love to have the OX Statue NOT TO PULL AGGRO when putting down. this so sucks....

  11. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by siccora View Post
    i think it's hard when u need to clear your stagger every 5 secs
    If you need to clear your stagger every 5 seconds, you're doing it wrong. Are you being stubborn about using PB when hitting Moderate stagger? Sometimes that's not ideal, far from it. It's a balancing act, and you need to adjust your PB usage according to the fight you're on.

    For example, on Feng, you can clear for every Moderate Stagger no problem since it's a low tank damage fight. On the other hand, on a fight such as Wind Lord Mel'jarak, if you try to clear ever Moderate Stagger then you're going to run out of Chi incredibly quickly. You're much better off waiting for Heavy Stagger and clearing that, and leaving Moderate Stagger up. Overall, that will mean you take less damage.

    It's a balancing act and I absolutely do not want to see it changed. I love the stagger mechanic as it is.

    Quote Originally Posted by Validity View Post
    Doesn't Agi give Dodge by default?

    I don't think Shuffle would be so much of a problem if, say, they made Tiger Palm give you 1.5 seconds of Shuffle, or especially the level 30 healing talents.
    I think more stuff could give you Shuffle, but I don't think increasing the duration of the Shuffle provided is the right way to go (as per a previous post of yours). As it is currently I am able to keep Shuffle up nearly 100% of the time when tanking. The only exception is during heavy AoE and I want to use Breath of Fire, which doesn't provide Shuffle. So really, I end up not bothering with Breath of Fire, instead using SCK to keep aggro and using BoK to keep Shuffle up. This is an absolute shame because BoF is such an iconic Brewmaster ability. We absolutely should be using it, but as it is currently we can't.

    I've commented on BoF before and my ideas prior were to make it do more damage so you'd essentially choose, even on single target: do you want to mitigate more damage (BoK) or deal more damage (BoF). Problem is, as a Tank that's never a choice: if you don't choose to mitigate damage, you're doing it wrong. The choice instead should be in how you mitigate that damage, e.g. the choice between using PB more often or using BoK more often. That's good, interesting choice.

    As such, to bring it back to your own point, I would add Shuffle to BoF, same duration as BoK (6 seconds). I'm fine with the 6 second duration, I find that at just the right level of not too demanding to keep up, but you still have to be aware of it. Even just adding 1-2 seconds of duration to each application of Shuffle would make it far too easy to keep up.

    I would also like to see further changes to maybe allow BoF to be used on single targets too, but I'm unsure of how to go about doing that. I wouldn't want to replace BoK entirely, but I do want to use BoF. As I said, it's an iconic Brewmaster ability and very cool, it's a shame to see it mostly unused.

    Quote Originally Posted by siccora View Post
    To add to BM, i would love to have the OX Statue NOT TO PULL AGGRO when putting down. this so sucks....
    But then I can't hax the pull on Lei Shi and ignore the first Spray cast entirely while I get into position!

    Nah, I'm actually ok with the aggroing of the statue. It just takes a GCD to put it up early in the fight, not really a big deal. I can also imagine it being used to easily position bosses in certain places at the pull... Not important for any boss currently (that I'm aware of), but it may be important later on. Who knows.

    I mean, it's thematically appropriate, no? I mean, we're tanks. We're meant to be all about the aggro.

  12. #32
    So we have to wait months for 5.2 for those essential changes??

  13. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by Kisho View Post
    If you need to clear your stagger every 5 seconds, you're doing it wrong. Are you being stubborn about using PB when hitting Moderate stagger? Sometimes that's not ideal, far from it. It's a balancing act, and you need to adjust your PB usage according to the fight you're on.

    For example, on Feng, you can clear for every Moderate Stagger no problem since it's a low tank damage fight. On the other hand, on a fight such as Wind Lord Mel'jarak, if you try to clear ever Moderate Stagger then you're going to run out of Chi incredibly quickly. You're much better off waiting for Heavy Stagger and clearing that, and leaving Moderate Stagger up. Overall, that will mean you take less damage.

    It's a balancing act and I absolutely do not want to see it changed. I love the stagger mechanic as it is.



    I think more stuff could give you Shuffle, but I don't think increasing the duration of the Shuffle provided is the right way to go (as per a previous post of yours). As it is currently I am able to keep Shuffle up nearly 100% of the time when tanking. The only exception is during heavy AoE and I want to use Breath of Fire, which doesn't provide Shuffle. So really, I end up not bothering with Breath of Fire, instead using SCK to keep aggro and using BoK to keep Shuffle up. This is an absolute shame because BoF is such an iconic Brewmaster ability. We absolutely should be using it, but as it is currently we can't.

    I've commented on BoF before and my ideas prior were to make it do more damage so you'd essentially choose, even on single target: do you want to mitigate more damage (BoK) or deal more damage (BoF). Problem is, as a Tank that's never a choice: if you don't choose to mitigate damage, you're doing it wrong. The choice instead should be in how you mitigate that damage, e.g. the choice between using PB more often or using BoK more often. That's good, interesting choice.

    As such, to bring it back to your own point, I would add Shuffle to BoF, same duration as BoK (6 seconds). I'm fine with the 6 second duration, I find that at just the right level of not too demanding to keep up, but you still have to be aware of it. Even just adding 1-2 seconds of duration to each application of Shuffle would make it far too easy to keep up.

    I would also like to see further changes to maybe allow BoF to be used on single targets too, but I'm unsure of how to go about doing that. I wouldn't want to replace BoK entirely, but I do want to use BoF. As I said, it's an iconic Brewmaster ability and very cool, it's a shame to see it mostly unused.



    But then I can't hax the pull on Lei Shi and ignore the first Spray cast entirely while I get into position!

    Nah, I'm actually ok with the aggroing of the statue. It just takes a GCD to put it up early in the fight, not really a big deal. I can also imagine it being used to easily position bosses in certain places at the pull... Not important for any boss currently (that I'm aware of), but it may be important later on. Who knows.

    I mean, it's thematically appropriate, no? I mean, we're tanks. We're meant to be all about the aggro.
    thanks for that stagger stuff. i was under the impression i have to kill my moderate stagger as soon as possible. is get your point sir, try to implement it into my playstyle

  14. #34
    I think just making jab and/kegsmash crits contribute to EB stacks would do fine for me, Keg smash not giving more because you crit multiple targets... Or (not sure if it is like this) when we do that strike from when we parry and it crits it gives us an extra stack :P
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  15. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by siccora View Post
    thanks for that stagger stuff. i was under the impression i have to kill my moderate stagger as soon as possible. is get your point sir, try to implement it into my playstyle
    Yeah, I think it's a point that most Brewmasters meet; since in 5 mans you'll never hit heavy stagger and rarely hit moderate, so you'll get into the habit of going 'omg yellow, purify immediately!'. But that ends up not being very effective in raids.

    My personal moment is when I started tanking heroic stone guard, which has a fair bit of tank damage in the form of the bleed DoT. I was dutifully purifying every moderate stagger, only realising I was difficult to heal when my healer complained on Ventrilo. Made me realise 'er, hang on, I'm not keeping shuffle up... Something's wrong here'.

    So yeah, I wouldn't worry too much. Happens to us all really at some point, I think!

    And that's enough off-topic from me, I think :P

  16. #36
    1) Path of Blossoms - not useful atm, good for casting while running away or breaking stealthies. Add a fire damage over time or snare stack
    2) Zen Sphere - not useful in pve or pvp for any spec..... increase the HoT
    3) Would like to see RSK get buffed in a way where we could use it for a short duration with no cd (but still costing 2 chi) or adding it as part of our mastery.
    4) Reduce the CD and increase the stun duration on Charging Ox Wave to make it compatible with the tier
    5) Remove the melee thing on Zen Meditation which would make it more useable on more encounters
    6) All brew/tea stacks removed before raid fight or rbg/arena, but give us a new shiny ability that gives a full stacks on a 2-3 minute cd
    7) Improve Healing Elixirs in a way where any extra heals becomes a HoT or Absorb since it ALWAYS proc every 18 seconds even if you have full health
    8) The 5 stack tiger palm buff for mistweavers should last an x duration instead of just being one cast. therefore improving our ability to single target heal without going oom so fast
    9) A new shiny CD ability that changes our melee attacks into nature damage because right now Casting 2 SFB instead of 1 BOK does more damage to plate/mail so I find myself going into melee to gain chi then rolling into range to cast SFB
    10) no more need to stance dance for the extra renewing mist & haste buff as MW
    11) A new shiny CD ability that detonates all healing spheres with a 1-2 mn cd
    Last edited by bigfootbigd; 2012-12-13 at 07:56 PM.
    "I hate to advocate drugs, alcohol, violence, or insanity to anyone, but they've always worked for me." -Hunter S. Thompson

  17. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by bigfootbigd View Post
    6) Give us full brew/tea stacks before arena/bg. Right now you have to build it up to get the full potential although i see a lot a lot of lazy monks right now
    It clears stacks when an Arena starts too, not sure about BGs.

    That said, I'd rather they just re-work Energizing Brew into a class-wide cooldown that gives 10 stacks of Tigereye Brew, Elusive Brew, and maybe 4 stacks (that one would need some testing) of Mana Tea depending on your spec. Re-adjust it 2 or 3 minute cooldown, and boom needing to stack something to use it is no longer an issue.

  18. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by Totaltotemic View Post
    It clears stacks when an Arena starts too, not sure about BGs.

    That said, I'd rather they just re-work Energizing Brew into a class-wide cooldown that gives 10 stacks of Tigereye Brew, Elusive Brew, and maybe 4 stacks (that one would need some testing) of Mana Tea depending on your spec. Re-adjust it 2 or 3 minute cooldown, and boom needing to stack something to use it is no longer an issue.
    i like that idea if they're going to reset before a raid encounter or rbg/arena, but just give it to us as a new shiny ability instead of replacing windwalker's energizing brew
    "I hate to advocate drugs, alcohol, violence, or insanity to anyone, but they've always worked for me." -Hunter S. Thompson

  19. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by bigfootbigd View Post
    i like that idea if they're going to reset before a raid encounter or rbg/arena, but just give it to us as a new shiny ability instead of replacing windwalker's energizing brew
    Personally I don't think that Energizing Brew fits in WW's toolkit. You have a spec that energy-caps a lot more easily than Rogues and Ferals, yet give them an energy cooldown? Tigereye Brew fits the 45 second to 1 minute cooldown damage boost ideal, so why do we have another 1 minute cooldown? On top of all of that, at the end of the day, Energizing Brew is only worth an extra mastery proc or two. It doesn't even give you a lot of damage for using it and punishes you for using FoF or getting "unlucky" with mastery procs during it. It's a really awkward cooldown and I'd rather it just be a straight damage cooldown because that's the one thing WW really lacks.

    I also have a suspicion that if we got an on-demand way to use TEB it might end up being OP with Energizing Brew, but that's just speculation.

  20. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by Totaltotemic View Post
    Personally I don't think that Energizing Brew fits in WW's toolkit. You have a spec that energy-caps a lot more easily than Rogues and Ferals, yet give them an energy cooldown? Tigereye Brew fits the 45 second to 1 minute cooldown damage boost ideal, so why do we have another 1 minute cooldown? On top of all of that, at the end of the day, Energizing Brew is only worth an extra mastery proc or two. It doesn't even give you a lot of damage for using it and punishes you for using FoF or getting "unlucky" with mastery procs during it. It's a really awkward cooldown and I'd rather it just be a straight damage cooldown because that's the one thing WW really lacks.

    I also have a suspicion that if we got an on-demand way to use TEB it might end up being OP with Energizing Brew, but that's just speculation.
    Thats why I avoid Ascension.
    Tigereye Brew is more of a different story since it doesnt matter when you use it as long as it never caps; you'll be doing the same amount of damage [unless a specific phase/mechanic]
    I see energizing brew as a way to chi build back up, not a way to help with damage (directly). There's always a point where you're low on energy and thats when you pop it (or FoF)
    "I hate to advocate drugs, alcohol, violence, or insanity to anyone, but they've always worked for me." -Hunter S. Thompson

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