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  1. #301
    Warchief Voyager's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deja Thoris View Post
    It affects my enjoyment of the game
    No it doesn't. In fact it's none of your business even.
    All I can see is lvl 90s who are bitter that lvl 80 is the peak of character power (even during the entirety of Cataclysm they were), and those 90s are too lazy to lvl a new char to 80.

  2. #302
    Quote Originally Posted by Voyager View Post
    No it doesn't. In fact it's none of your business even.
    All I can see is lvl 90s who are bitter that lvl 80 is the peak of character power (even during the entirety of Cataclysm they were), and those 90s are too lazy to lvl a new char to 80.
    It's not about "peak of power"

    It's about a lvl 80, 10 levels below the contents intended level, soloing said content. Their is going to be nothing stopping them from going straight into the new raid in 5.2 and soloing things that a full 10 man raid can't do. If you claim that's working as intended then i would presume you're the type who claim that if you can dupe in game it's blizzards fault and it's working as intended.

  3. #303
    Warchief Voyager's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by alucardtnuoc View Post
    Their is going to be nothing stopping them from going straight into the new raid in 5.2 and soloing things that a full 10 man raid can't do.
    All they need to do is to fix the lvl check for MoP content instance portals so that lower lvls can't enter even after a 90 did. There's no need to fix cataclysm raid portals though, as that's old content.

  4. #304
    High Overlord Aelo's Avatar
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    Vengeance is now capped at max HP (tested this on an EU realm).

    Edit: And a response about the 409 items: https://twitter.com/Ghostcrawler/sta...86044846915586
    Last edited by Aelo; 2013-01-08 at 05:25 AM.
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  5. #305
    Bloodsail Admiral Splosion's Avatar
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    It's fixed, vengeance caps at Max HP. Expect a better fix later. Whee!

  6. #306
    the ammount of stupid ppl in this thread makes me sad.

    This is a bug, no matter what you say or do will change it, and we want it fixed. Dont call me jelly or hater or what ever. I got a 80 paladin my self and can do this, I haven't as i think its wrong.

    Edit: yey for fix
    Last edited by LuxyEU; 2013-01-08 at 05:04 AM.
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  7. #307
    Mechagnome Bodom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jaylock View Post
    I ask this question again and to everyone else QQing about this:

    What does this have anything to do with your personal enjoyment of the game? How does this affect you in ANY way? Simple answer: it does nothing to affect you, other than make you jealous.

    Same goes for everyone else "upset" about this feature.
    I have a 80 paladin myself I've been soloing on, which I happen to play a lot. It sure does affect me.

  8. #308
    Mechagnome
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    Quote Originally Posted by LuxyEU View Post
    the ammount of stupid ppl in this thread makes me sad.

    This is a bug, no matter what you say or do will change it, and we want it fixed. Dont call me jelly or hater or what ever. I got a 80 paladin my self and can do this, I haven't as i think its wrong.

    Edit: yey for fix
    I bet you were one of those students who always squealed on the other students, informing the teachers about every prank your classmates did.

    People don't like that, you know?

  9. #309
    Quote Originally Posted by Splosion View Post
    It's fixed, vengeance caps at Max HP. Expect a better fix later. Whee!
    Well done for fucking things up for lvl 90's, hope you are proud of yourself. You and the other guy have completely ruined the game for some players, and for what? This weird power trip that you had to be the one that got it fixed? Really?

    Oh well, guess I'll just use my weekly LK 25 hc save to ninja the mount if it ever drops. I'll just send them to your Youtube account if they want to vent their rage <3
    Last edited by quikbunny; 2013-01-08 at 08:30 AM.

  10. #310
    Quote Originally Posted by Rinnegan View Post
    I bet you were one of those students who always squealed on the other students, informing the teachers about every prank your classmates did.

    People don't like that, you know?
    i was the one doing all the pranks :|
    - Thanks Axalicious for this awesome sig.

  11. #311
    Quote Originally Posted by quikbunny View Post
    Well done for fucking things up for lvl 90's,
    Uhhhhhhhhhhhhh
    What?
    I have a relatively low health pool for a 90 tank, ~520k HP. I can honestly say I've never gotten my vengeance that high legitimately, and of the few times I have, most were with decimation blade (I.E. I was doing baleroc and thus had extra HP).

    This changes nothing for 90s. Only possible exception I can imagine is maybe 25H empress p2, but even then I don't believe tanks actually get THAT much vengeance.

  12. #312
    Quote Originally Posted by Braindwen View Post
    Uhhhhhhhhhhhhh
    What?
    I have a relatively low health pool for a 90 tank, ~520k HP. I can honestly say I've never gotten my vengeance that high legitimately, and of the few times I have, most were with decimation blade (I.E. I was doing baleroc and thus had extra HP).

    This changes nothing for 90s. Only possible exception I can imagine is maybe 25H empress p2, but even then I don't believe tanks actually get THAT much vengeance.
    As a Brewmaster tanking the 6 small adds on Grand Empress Heroic, I've had over 1 million vengence. In raid, I have around 560k HP.

    I've never really policed my vengence on Windlord, but I'm sure that I have had over 500k for that fight.

  13. #313
    Quote Originally Posted by Satiel View Post
    As a Brewmaster tanking the 6 small adds on Grand Empress Heroic, I've had over 1 million vengence. In raid, I have around 560k HP.

    I've never really policed my vengence on Windlord, but I'm sure that I have had over 500k for that fight.
    This "fix' Is going to bite blizzard in the ass.

    Simple fix: Put a level req on the raids and make the gear level 90 or like 88+ or just outright delete the gear from the game they have done that before. the vengence setup dose not work unless the player has the twink MOP gear so just change it or remove it.

  14. #314
    Quote Originally Posted by Satiel View Post
    As a Brewmaster tanking the 6 small adds on Grand Empress Heroic, I've had over 1 million vengence. In raid, I have around 560k HP.

    I've never really policed my vengence on Windlord, but I'm sure that I have had over 500k for that fight.
    Bleh, that's bad news then (admittedly, I'd only checked 1 log for empress. Was only seeing ~800k Shield barriers or ~400k vengeance, but likely that just means low rage barriers).

    Worse still because not all tanks are created equal in terms of health.

    (Although at some point, the amount of vengeance people can get just gets to the point of "how are you taking that much damage and living", but I still do agree it's an annoying bandaid fix)

  15. #315
    Quote Originally Posted by quikbunny View Post
    Well done for fucking things up for lvl 90's, hope you are proud of yourself. You and the other guy have completely ruined the game for some players, and for what? This weird power trip that you had to be the one that got it fixed? Really?
    That's basically it.

  16. #316
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    Vengeance was working as they intended it to work, they just never expected a level 80 to survive a hit from a level 93 boss.

    You (were) seeing this bug because of the server lag or some other bug involved with incorrect ordering which allowed the sacred shield to be calculated as if the damage was taken before the damage is actually taken, and thus absorbs the hit it was itself calculated on.

    Capping vengeance at max HP is a mistake. The design was sound at end-game, tank DPS is an important thing in progression raiding, especially in finding that balance between mitigation and DPS. This will effectively nerf warrior damage, but more importantly nerf pally/bear self-healing, which is an important part of their mitigation. They should have just band aid fixed it with a level restriction on the raid, but apparently that must be tied to the raid grouping requirement or something equally absurd.

    To be clear, I have no problem with 80s soloing old content. I think the soloing of current max-level content, even when T14 becomes obsolete and we're raiding T15, is a bad thing.

  17. #317
    Herald of the Titans T Man's Avatar
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    Funny how Ownedcore are fighting over if its a bug or exploit, good reading.

  18. #318
    Quote Originally Posted by eschatological View Post
    Vengeance was working as they intended it to work, they just never expected a level 80 to survive a hit from a level 93 boss.

    You (were) seeing this bug because of the server lag or some other bug involved with incorrect ordering which allowed the sacred shield to be calculated as if the damage was taken before the damage is actually taken, and thus absorbs the hit it was itself calculated on.

    Capping vengeance at max HP is a mistake. The design was sound at end-game, tank DPS is an important thing in progression raiding, especially in finding that balance between mitigation and DPS. This will effectively nerf warrior damage, but more importantly nerf pally/bear self-healing, which is an important part of their mitigation. They should have just band aid fixed it with a level restriction on the raid, but apparently that must be tied to the raid grouping requirement or something equally absurd.

    To be clear, I have no problem with 80s soloing old content. I think the soloing of current max-level content, even when T14 becomes obsolete and we're raiding T15, is a bad thing.
    New boss ability for all fights:
    Code:
    If player character level is less than x (replace as necessary) then instantly kill player character.
    
    x= 70 for TBC raid instances, 80 for WotLK raid instances, 85 for Cataclysm raids and 90 for MoP raids.
    There. If a non-intended player engages a boss fight, it kills them. Done. No need to fuck around with max-level balance, no need to rebuild the instance transfer mechanic. Uses the InstantKill mechanic to avoid people circumventing it with damage reduction or immunity effects.
    Last edited by Butler Log; 2013-01-08 at 10:52 AM.
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  19. #319
    Quote Originally Posted by Butler Log View Post
    New boss ability for all fights:
    Code:
    If player character level is less than x (replace as necessary) then instantly kill player character.
    
    x= 70 for TBC raid instances, 80 for WotLK raid instances, 85 for Cataclysm raids and 90 for MoP raids.
    There. If a non-intended player engages a boss fight, it kills them. Done. No need to fuck around with max-level balance, no need to rebuild the instance transfer mechanic. Uses the InstantKill mechanic to avoid people circumventing it with damage reduction or immunity effects.
    I'm sure people would still find ways around that since the death mechanic is server side. A better solution would obviously be to block off those instances completely.

    And yeah, the vengeance 'fix' is definitely going to break level 90 to some extent.
    Vereesa of Paragon, formerly of Depraved
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  20. #320
    The fix is fine for the time being, it's a quick band-aid to prevent more shenanigans and not a long-term fix. There is only one situation where you can legitimately get more than your max HP as Vengeance anyway (Empress p2), and it barely affects that situation.

    A more clean fix will have to happen in the future to prevent the bug itself and not just its most absurd consequences. hopefully in 5.2 if they can work on it quickly.

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