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  1. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by Grimord View Post
    If you have a Disc Priest you can 2-heal it easily. Just make sure he always pops SS for Rain of Blades and have backup cooldowns in case he can't get it off on time.

    Oh, and I forgot, make sure your Paladin tank is using SoI + Battle Healer + Holy Prism. He'll do a fuckton of healing. Holy Prism is specially powerful if your melee are slow and often get hit by the boomerang attack-thing, one swing of the prism is enough to top them all off.
    Light's Hammer is considerably better for aoe fights. It does considerably more damage, and scales better, and doesn't have a cap if you run with a lot of melee. You won't be moving the boss around much and burst healing on dps isn't especially valuable on this fight.

  2. #42
    Quote Originally Posted by tuesday the paladin View Post
    Light's Hammer is considerably better for aoe fights. It does considerably more damage, and scales better, and doesn't have a cap if you run with a lot of melee. You won't be moving the boss around much and burst healing on dps isn't especially valuable on this fight.
    You're part right, burst healing is valuable when rain of blades happens after adds are dead. You're all right when you're talking about lights hammer being better for this fight because it coincides with rain of blades.

  3. #43
    Herald of the Titans Grimord's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tuesday the paladin View Post
    Light's Hammer is considerably better for aoe fights. It does considerably more damage, and scales better, and doesn't have a cap if you run with a lot of melee. You won't be moving the boss around much and burst healing on dps isn't especially valuable on this fight.
    I prefer Holy Prism since it's more burst while Light's Hammer is pretty slow, so Holy Prism will usually help top off the melee much faster allowing the healers to focus more on the ranged.


  4. #44
    Quote Originally Posted by Grimord View Post
    I prefer Holy Prism since it's more burst while Light's Hammer is pretty slow, so Holy Prism will usually help top off the melee much faster allowing the healers to focus more on the ranged.
    We actually have everyone stack up right after the last wind bomb before rain of blades which means you're not boned by the target cap of holy prism.

  5. #45
    Just killed it (stuck on Garalon for a while) after 3 or so tries.
    1 tank 2 healers. 3 healers works too, I'd suggest against 2 tanks.

    If you have a paladin tank, let him glyph battle healer and he can almost keep himself up. He had more healing done than our second healer.

    CC 1 of each mob, this way you can manage everything without issue. Have 2 people watching a mender to make sure it gets interrupted (I believe Mending has a 33s cd). If you focus target it, BigWigs will give you a timer bar and warn you when it's casting. It can't get easier than that...

    P1 should be no issue healingwise. P2, make sure your ranged are always somewhat in range of healers. Make sure they are topped and use personal CD"s for the rain of blades. Proceed to loot.

  6. #46
    Moderator Sonnillon's Avatar
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    As I've said. We cannot 2 heal with the selection of healers we have. As for one tank or two, we'll see hopefully tonight how we do with 2. We both (tanks) do better DPS in out tanking specs while in our OS (I know that I can go over 100k as feral in p2 (at least on LFR), but on all the adds together I can't keep that nice DPS up). And in p2 we both have around 60k vengeance.

    We got him down once with 3 healers and 2 tanks, so it should work again. Paladin is against of him being the solo tank as he is afraid that his own healing and a "dedicated" healer can't keep him up. The usage of his healing hammer/talent discussion he found useful for ideas.

    Keeping only 3 CC'd is not an option as well. We have 2 Trappers, 1 Blade, 1 Mender CC'd. We have decent people to interrupt Menders. I need to have a chat with spriest (as we have only 1 along for tonight to concentrate on dispelling and using his vamp.touch and dispersion if needed). Having 2 Trapper up will lead to people being stuck in trap for long time, but I guess people just need to wake up. But if the dispels still keep failing we have to try the other way around, by CC'ing the menders.

    I have few additional questions though by reading few posts in this topic.
    So far we have killed all the adds around the same time. Should we kill the type of add first of which 2 are CC'd or is still better to kill them at the same time?
    When do use BL? So far we pop it when we hit p2. Should we start with BL to get adds down faster?
    Last edited by Sonnillon; 2013-01-31 at 08:57 AM.
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  7. #47
    Quote Originally Posted by Sonnillon View Post
    I have few additional questions though by reading few posts in this topic.
    So far we have killed all the adds around the same time. Should we kill the type of add first of which 2 are CC'd or is still better to kill them at the same time?
    When do use BL? So far we pop it when we hit p2. Should we start with BL to get adds down faster?
    with adds we do maybe a bit overcomplicated strategy - we have assigned primary targets for each dps so that while aoe goes off the single target spells hit different add group. when all 3 adds are around 70% we call to switch from blademasters to menders and continue the nuke. so when menders go down, amber trappers are lowish (20%, since two dps were primarily on them) and blademasters are a bit higher sice those were hit only by aoe and cleves. we then nuke trappers asap and finish off blades - id say trappers die 30-40s after menders and blades die soon after trappers.

    we cc two trappers, one blade and one mender. after menders die we reapply cc on *one* trapper and one blade and nuke trappers then blades

    BL in ph1 is damage wasted on adds rather then on boss imho. we use it late in phase2 in execute range. our resto druid pops HoTW then and helps out with nuke.

  8. #48
    We always kill the menders first, then the trappers and blademasters around the same time. I'd recommend focusing down whichever add type you've CC'd two of (you do the trappers, right? we do menders), then doing more or less even dps on the whole pack. That way you free two of your CC'ers to focus only on damage. So assign your CC'ers with a lot of channeled spells to the guys who die first.

    We BL when the windbombs start coming out, when the tank's vengeance is beginning to fade and the healers start needing help on the rain of blades. When we were learning the fight we BL'd at the beginning, but it didn't seem to make the fight any shorter and it distracted the dps into focusing on their damage numbers rather than remembering to CC their target. Oops, did I say that out loud?

  9. #49
    Herald of the Titans Grimord's Avatar
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    Yea, like Ninotchka said, we also kill Menders -> Blademasters -> Trappers, but it might depend on your team. IF you see people getting one-shot by blademasters often then take them out first. If offensive dispelling / interrupting is an issue then make Menders die asap.

    We begin the fight by tanking all the adds near the back of the room, a few yards in front of the door that leads to the next boss. Once all the adds are dead (or usually, a few seconds earlier) I move the boss to center of the room and tank him there for the rest of the fight. Also, if you're not *too* melee intensive you can always have a healer or two stand in melee without triggering wind bombs. I know there's a number that allows you know how many you can have doing that but I can't remember it, yet we always have our monk healer in melee or, when he isn't in the raid, our disc priest.


  10. #50
    Quote Originally Posted by Cakers View Post
    We single tanked and 2 healed it without an issue, and that wasn't in any crazy gear either. The first phase you can have your healers literally afk, the second rain of blades just require some coordination with raid cooldowns, just make sure you have a healer cd and a damage reduction (or smaller cd) for each one. e.g we used Tranq + Devo Aura, Hymn + Vamp Emb., Shaman Ele Healing Cooldown and Monk Damage reduction (can't remember the names of those) on rotation and had no issues surviving last phase.
    Devotion Aura is a waste on rain of blades...rain is physical damage, Aura reduces magic damage.

  11. #51
    From what i can see in your logs

    (1) make sure you are dispelling - shadow cannot go oom on this fight just put VT on on multiple targets when you get low and roll in 6K mana per tick x several mobs = unlimited mana. Also i noticed your priests have higher mind flay damage than SWP and VT how is that possible?? multi-dot + mind sear during P1 then normal rotation for P2.
    (2) Don't hit wind bombs - I noticed in a number of you attempts they are being set off, a ton of avoidable damage
    (3) set up a CD rotation for rain of blades sub 70% you have tranq, revival, healing tide, ascendance?, plus 2x VE more than enough to get through several sets rain of blades. just rotate between them. The boss cannot throw wind bombs during rain of blades so dps can move in closer to the boss to make healing easier as long as they move back out during as soon as it ends.

  12. #52
    Quote Originally Posted by Hybr1d View Post

    If you have a paladin tank, let him glyph battle healer and he can almost keep himself up. He had more healing done than our second healer.
    .
    You don't know what the glyph does do you? It heals others. A good paladin on this fight will heal themselves for about half the damage they take. While I'm a paladin and a paladin fan your post is just misleading.


    Quote Originally Posted by Sonnillon View Post

    We got him down once with 3 healers and 2 tanks, so it should work again. Paladin is against of him being the solo tank as he is afraid that his own healing and a "dedicated" healer can't keep him up. The usage of his healing hammer/talent discussion he found useful for ideas.

    I have few additional questions though by reading few posts in this topic.
    So far we have killed all the adds around the same time. Should we kill the type of add first of which 2 are CC'd or is still better to kill them at the same time?
    When do use BL? So far we pop it when we hit p2. Should we start with BL to get adds down faster?

    If you are the raid leader then tell the pally to grow a pair and tank it on his own. Seriously, just follow conventional wisdom. I've killed this fight plenty and 1 tank is more than enough. Just front load your CD's. Holy avenger (20sec), guardian of the ancient kings (12 sec), ardent defender (10 sec), unglyphed divine protection (10sec), barkskin from symbi (6?) sec. Thats about a minute of damage reductions while his venegeance ramps up to Jesus like proportions and he becomes a healing and dps machine.

    Seriously, tanking this solo should be every tanks wetdream. If he does it right he will be close to top heals and dps. If he does it wrong he dies and he gets to improve.

    The same goes for you. If you aren't doing excellent dps on those adds as a feral then you need to learn to do good damage, not avoid the problem by tanking your way out of it. In theory can't you just weapon swop to an int weap and then HotW hurricane the shit out of everything for 45 seconds? It's what our feral does and he pulls over 300k for that period of time afaik.

    We BL at the start of the fight. I'm not sure it matters, we just find it cleaner that way. As to the adds, you want to balance dps so they die close together in order of annoyingness, usually trappers > menders > blademasters. Anything more than 20 seconds or so between first add death and last death I'd say is messy but it shouldnt be a deal breaker.

  13. #53
    Moderator Sonnillon's Avatar
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    Don't have any int weapon. As for my DPS... I out DPS the pallys retri spec by miles, but just I suck at doing AoE as feral. On LFR I hovered around 70ish k on add pack and once boss nuking time came I got 105k DPS. I DPS rest of the one tank fights anyway x_x.

    But we'll see what happens tonight.
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  14. #54
    Quote Originally Posted by Sonnillon View Post
    Is the healing shit or is everyone doing things wrong?

    http://worldoflogs.com/reports/bgsx3zcc8evmrlt8/

    guardian/prot pala tanking (yes we 2 tank it, just to make it bit easier for healers), shaman/monk/druid healing (and 3 healers as with 2 we are dead).

    I know that I as guardian, should be keeping my SD up, but I can't do so. I got all healers complaining that I was too hard to keep up or heal. As soon as I went using FR >>> SD the healing on me started being a none issue.

    Other, paladin, tank focuses more on healing as well, as if he doesn't healers complain that he takes too much damage. Paladin uses Seal of Insight to survive.

    My question is should we be really focusing on self healing, when we are 3 healing? I know that I get hit once in a while by the blade, as I fail to see what direction is the boss aiming (I'm tanking the adds, other tank is tanking boss on top of adds) <- that is my issue what I need to fix, no argument.

    But outside my own fuckups with the blade and ppl not paying attention to wind bombs in p2, should tanks focus on self healing or DPS?

    As a healer, I'll tell you that your 2 tanking it makes it harder, not easier. Less dps means you have to heal for longer in the fight, plus now there are TWO tanks to heal instead of just one. Your prot pally will heal a ton by himself. Let him tank everything.
    Humans are the only species on the planet smart enough to be this stupid.

  15. #55
    Quote Originally Posted by Sonnillon View Post
    Don't have any int weapon. As for my DPS... I out DPS the pallys retri spec by miles, but just I suck at doing AoE as feral. On LFR I hovered around 70ish k on add pack and once boss nuking time came I got 105k DPS. I DPS rest of the one tank fights anyway x_x.

    But we'll see what happens tonight.
    Its a tip for the future then :P This isn't a dps check. Stand there and mash swipe and call out the dbm timers or something, the focus should be perfect execution and not dps.

    If you raided in cata this fight is a bit like ultraxion in a way. People used to see the incoming damage and yell "3 healers!" whereas reducing the healers made the fight easier. It's the same kind of thing here, one tanking it sounds wrong but as long as you madd dispel and make sure the pally loads up his CD's and refreshes SS then he'll be good.

  16. #56
    A paladin tank will be top heals if you solo tank it by the end of the fight. the only healing intensive part is in part 2 when the boss does raid of blades where you should have proper cooldown orders established.

    Other than that, like others said, you need to mass dispell boss/adds prior to any strikes or rain of blades in part 1, otherwise the damage taken is amplified like crazy, and interrupt the healers.
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  17. #57
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    mass dispell is likely your issue, but a tip - have the pala solo tank it, mega vengeance=mega dps. paladins also have a glyph that does something like heals a nearby player for x% of damage done, which will on its own almost cover the raid healing for that phase leaving your healers to focus only on keeping the tank alive and saving mana for P2.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X6q1OqZDP1I

    also has a funny rant at the end if you care to listen to it
    Last edited by Viggers; 2013-02-01 at 01:32 AM.

  18. #58
    Moderator Sonnillon's Avatar
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    It died, I just respeced to feral and told paladin that he will be tanking (with bleeding heart, but meh, it is a kill and we can proceed forward), even after the first try when he forgot to move the boss... People moving from the Blade + being boxed in by windbombs = dead raid.

    Spriest needed some convincing that his dispelling >>>> his DPS, but as you see from the logs he did his job well.

    Though pala said that all the healing he did was mainly overhealing and rather pointless. But you can check the logs and decide for yourself.
    http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/m...?s=1362&e=1805

    Had bit different setup as well, melee heavy mainly - 2x warrior, 1 rogue, 1 feral. Also a different rdruid was along ^^

    We still had 1 mender, 1 blade, 2 trappers CCd. All died roughly the same time.
    Last edited by Sonnillon; 2013-02-01 at 06:37 AM.
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  19. #59
    Gz on the kill. Despite your protests it seems like one tanking it worked a treat :P

    Good luck with empress, its probably a bit easier than amber shaper. Pre-emptive advice, the fight revolves around handling the dissonance fields correctly and the tanks not getting trucked by the adds at the start of p2. Sort that and you will have a kill.

  20. #60
    Dispelling was the issue from what I can see. Without dispels, the rain of blades was killing people left right and centre.
    Gz on the kill though.

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