how does everyone feel about 5.0 raids being opened to cross realm raiding in 5.2?

[Stir]

I do. Regularly. In fact I just spent a year in afghanistan protecting your right to a different opinion.

Not my right, thank you very much.
And while I don't question your personal motives, what armies do in Afghanistan is twofold:
1: Protect locals and warlords from religious extremists,
2: Safeguard a nifty supply of copper for Western needs.

Your statement of being a soldier and having served in Afghanistan had absolutely zero relevance to my statement that pride is not to be had in a game we play for fun.

[Deleted]

so just to let me understand your position OP. your worried that opening crz will allow top guilds to sell their services to boost guilds that cant handle the content themselves? and you beleive that teams of 2 people for 10man and 5-7 people for 25 man will be able to help guilds who are failing currently to clear heroic content?

Because of this youd like to see a feature that allows people to pug with friends from other realms removed.

Be sensible here the more likely result to this will be good guilds bringing along one or two peeps along when they anihilate old content but even that will be tricky to negotiate considering you cant trade gold when cross realming. You may find a small amount negotiating rl money for runs but i seriously doubt its going to be as wide spread as your worried about

[Ijoemomma]

I don't understand why CURRENT Raid content is not CRZ. I certainly won't be doing 5.0 content after 5.2. But It would help a lot to have CRZ for 5.2 raids during 5.2, not after 5.4.

Totally in agreement here. My raid group is 10, if one of them is out, we need to pug. I have friends on other servers that I trust more then strangers in chat.

[DeadmanWalking]

I do. Regularly. In fact I just spent a year in afghanistan protecting your right to a different opinion.

We honor you for your service but no one is going to honor you for having progressed further than them in warcraft raiding. 99.99999% of the rest of the world does not care about how high your ilevel is. Worry about your own guilds progression and don't worry about people using CRZ to bring in ringers when they can do that on the server they already play on.

[zEmini]

I personally feel that it is pretty crappy. You will have guilds that are incapable of downing content basically purchasing progression, albeit through irrelavant content, which in my opinion is the worst. However it will just make recruiting even more challenging to the guilds that do put in the effort as less skilled guilds continue to hold on to their one or two more skilled players because "hey we can clear it now".


Just looking for opinions.

Actually I think it is awesome.

Guilds will always do better, but at least now more and more people will get experience and improve their own raiding potential. It will be a long time before a random group of people will be able to clear Heroic Mode.

My only fear is that at a certain point, these CRZ folks will only take people who have the achievement. Works that way with Heroic DS and FL.

[Socialhealer]

exactly. so lets say that Dream Paragon or any top echelon guild has some players that zip through the content and then want to make a little money, ingame or live money doesn't matter. They hire themselves out in pairs to 10 man guilds or as a group of 7 to 25 man guilds and carry them through content. If CRZ were to move to relavant content this is exactly what would happen next taking all the legitimate competition out of the game. How is this in any way fair to the players who are putting honest effort into competing?

this is why casuals who haven't even cleared normal like you shouldn't really post about such things involving clearling heroic content through CRZ, you really think 2 people from paragon can just carry a 10man through heroic modes? or 7 people join a 25man and bam heroic sha 25man is just pure faceroll?

because thats just totally clueless, and if you mean normal mode...you really think paragon will get like 250k gold from casuals to help clear normal? (and if it wasn't a huge sum of gold those guilds won't bother for even 100k) no...that just aint happening, and heroic 7 people can't carry 18 others, just not possible.

so i don't see your problem? 22 people could probably boost 3 people on 25 heroic to heroic sha etc but that's always been happening, and there's no feat theres no mount there's not even good loot its 509, vs 522 in 5.2.....so really what is the issue here?

[Gurbz]

arguably untrue. two world rated healers can carry a ten man raid.

Assuming healing throughput was the problem, yes. But that is assuming a lot of things, primarily the fact that every other aspect of the fight is being executed properly. And still does not change the fact that if 2 people alone are the difference between a guild clearing a fight or not, then the 10% nerf and higher iLvl gear that will be available would serve just as well.

And again, why do you care? It is outdated content. Even if it wasn't, if Blizzard allowed this for current content, any guild that is doing this is not in any way competitive in the first place and are likely months behind. Because the ringers they need are too busy taking care of their own guild's priorities.

When I say it won't matter as much as you think it will, I am actually speaking from personal experience here. Back in Ulduar, my guild just could not get a Yogg kill. We had been working on it for weeks. One day, the GM of the top guild on our severs, which was a world 200+ guild at the time, offered to bring himself and his entire officer core to help us out, just because I guess. They never really explained WHY and we didn't care at the time. Guess what happened? We still failed on the exact same crap, even though we had 5 world rated players trying to help us. It didn't even allow us to get past phase 2, let alone get us a kill. It literally had zero measurable impact.

[Mission]

Quote Originally Posted by judgementofantonidas View Post
exactly. so lets say that Dream Paragon or any top echelon guild has some players that zip through the content and then want to make a little money, ingame or live money doesn't matter. They hire themselves out in pairs to 10 man guilds or as a group of 7 to 25 man guilds and carry them through content. If CRZ were to move to relavant content this is exactly what would happen next taking all the legitimate competition out of the game. How is this in any way fair to the players who are putting honest effort into competing?
Whats stopping them from doing a server transfer now and doing this?

The amount of in game gold or live money would be so high per boss kill, noway youd be able to afford it.

Xrealm current tier would be awesome for smaller dead realms tho.

[judgementofantonidas]

Not my right, thank you very much.
And while I don't question your personal motives, what armies do in Afghanistan is twofold:
1: Protect locals and warlords from religious extremists,
2: Safeguard a nifty supply of copper for Western needs.

Your statement of being a soldier and having served in Afghanistan had absolutely zero relevance to my statement that pride is not to be had in a game we play for fun.

no it deflected to inference that I do nothing out of game to be proud of.

[Deleted]

also how would the guilds be paying the gold? cant trade gold through CRZ. I think you seriously overestimate the number of people willing to pay real life money to get help doing out dated content that drops loot with a comparable ilvl to the new raid finder

[Stir]

no it deflected to inference that I do nothing out of game to be proud of.

In that case, I wish to assure you that I had no intention of making such implications. I merely wanted to point out that being good at a game is just that: Being good at a game.

[judgementofantonidas]

Assuming healing throughput was the problem, yes. But that is assuming a lot of things, primarily the fact that every other aspect of the fight is being executed properly. And still does not change the fact that if 2 people alone are the difference between a guild clearing a fight or not, then the 10% nerf and higher iLvl gear that will be available would serve just as well.

And again, why do you care? It is outdated content. Even if it wasn't, if Blizzard allowed this for current content, any guild that is doing this is not in any way competitive in the first place and are likely months behind. Because the ringers they need are too busy taking care of their own guild's priorities.

Why I care is that I feel they are working up to making crz the norm rather than the exception and as previously stated I am completely against crz, have been, and have seen nothing to support a change in my oppinion as it slowly creeps into all areas of game play.

For instance on day ONE of MOP release I was fighting to farm mobs for motes of harmony with someone from off of my server because he was smart enough to get a freind to invite him to a group because his realm was too populated. At least I think that is how he ended up in a BRAND NEW ZONE on day one of launch which is not what blizzard stated was the purpose of crz.

---------- Post added 2013-02-14 at 12:15 PM ----------

also how would the guilds be paying the gold? cant trade gold through CRZ. I think you seriously overestimate the number of people willing to pay real life money to get help doing out dated content that drops loot with a comparable ilvl to the new raid finder

again, my consern is more about the incremental creep of crz into all aspects of game play which IMO will lead to relavant content.

[Deleted]

Killing old content is not progression, this isn't really an issue.

[judgementofantonidas]

Killing old content is not progression, this isn't really an issue.

with the early release of 5.2 and the escalated level of gear required to complete it 5.0 will remain progression for many normal mode players for some time.

[Algearond]

What's the problem with this? You've had almost five months to clear it realm only. If you need more time then that your doing it wrong.

[Deleted]

so your main concern OP is you dont want people from different realms to be able to work/play together? Regardless of the fact that its not possible to use ingame gold to pay top guilds to crz boost you. Not to mention the fact that IF crz was available to current content the 'top guilds' would be too busy killing it themselves to send out teams to bolster other guilds.

All in all there are already some guilds out there that will sell one or two spots in their heroic raid runs. A tiny, and i do mean tiny, portion of the wow playerbase have been known to pay their way into such guilds . When yer payin $300+ to get a heroic run $15 to transfer to the realm isnt an issue. This sorta thing has been around since vanilla you can hardly blame it on CRZ

[judgementofantonidas]

What's the problem with this? You've had almost five months to clear it realm only. If you need more time then that your doing it wrong.

on many levels I agree with you.

It is wrong for players to comit to a raid schedule then not show up.
It is wrong for players to not know how to effectively maximize their class.
It is wrong for players hop from guild to guild seeking the easiest kills.

but these are the people we deal with on a weekly basis.

---------- Post added 2013-02-14 at 12:32 PM ----------

so your main concern OP is you dont want people from different realms to be able to work/play together? Regardless of the fact that its not possible to use ingame gold to pay top guilds to crz boost you. Not to mention the fact that IF crz was available to current content the 'top guilds' would be too busy killing it themselves to send out teams to bolster other guilds.

All in all there are already some guilds out there that will sell one or two spots in their heroic raid runs. A tiny, and i do mean tiny, portion of the wow playerbase have been known to pay their way into such guilds . When yer payin $300+ to get a heroic run $15 to transfer to the realm isnt an issue. This sorta thing has been around since vanilla you can hardly blame it on CRZ

You are correct. What I am saying is why remove all hinderance whatsoever? Why not just unite the servers and get it over with. I for one PREFER to be on a low pop server.

[Xeraxis]

again, my consern is more about the incremental creep of crz into all aspects of game play which IMO will lead to relavant content.

Cross realm raiding has been available before CRZ. If you're going to argue against something at least get your facts straight.

[judgementofantonidas]

Cross realm raiding has been available before CRZ. If you're going to argue against something at least get your facts straight.

never said it wasn't. get your's strait.

[Xeraxis]

never said it wasn't. get your's strait.

again, my consern is more about the incremental creep of crz into all aspects of game play which IMO will lead to relavant content.

Once again I'd learn what CRZ actually is and when it was implemented before crying foul over something that was in game before it.