Gaming pc - Supposedly made by experts

[Deleted]

Hi guys,

In the Netherlands there's a website called Tweakers(.net). No point in linking it, as most people here won't be able to read dutch.
Tweakers tends to make 'Best Buy Guides' for self-built rigs monthly, based on the best price/performance ratios. A bang for your buck rig, so to speak. It's what I used as a baseline before I started frequently browsing these MMOC forums.

This month's 'Best Buy Guide' had a few odd suggestions here and there, and I'm real curious what you guys' opinions are on the following builds. Note: A few items aren't listed on purpose. They're just easy picks, like an optical drive, monitor, etcetera. Also, the dollar prices can be taken with a grain of salt. I've listed the total (local) price that it would cost to purchase the items here in Holland.

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Budget System

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant / Benchmarks

Motherboard: ASRock FM2A75 Pro4-M Micro ATX FM2 Motherboard ($73.98 @ Newegg)
Memory: Corsair 4GB (2 x 2GB) DDR3-1333 Memory ($28.99 @ Newegg)
Storage: Western Digital Caviar Blue 500GB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive ($59.99 @ Newegg)
Video Card: Sapphire Radeon HD 7850 1GB Video Card ($174.99 @ Newegg)
Power Supply: Corsair Builder 430W ATX12V Power Supply ($44.98 @ Outlet PC)
Total: $382.93
(Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available.)
(Generated by PCPartPicker 2013-03-01 07:53 EST-0500)

Can't find these items on pcpartpicker, missing in this list is the:
CPU: AMD Athlon II X4 740 (60 euros)
Case: Cooler Master K280 (32 euros)

Bringing the local total amount to: 418 euros. (Came in 7 euros under the stated budget: 425 euros)

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Basic Game System

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant / Benchmarks

CPU: Intel Core i5-3350P 3.1GHz Quad-Core Processor ($180.98 @ Newegg)
Motherboard: ASRock B75 PRO3-M Micro ATX LGA1155 Motherboard ($76.98 @ SuperBiiz)
Memory: Corsair 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR3-1333 Memory ($52.99 @ Newegg)
Storage: Western Digital Caviar Blue 500GB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive ($59.99 @ Newegg)
Video Card: Gigabyte Radeon HD 7950 3GB Video Card ($297.98 @ SuperBiiz)
Power Supply: XFX 550W 80 PLUS Bronze Certified ATX12V / EPS12V Power Supply ($69.98 @ Newegg)
Total: $738.90
(Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available.)
(Generated by PCPartPicker 2013-03-01 08:03 EST-0500)

Case: Cooler Master K280 (32 euros)

Bringing the local total amount to: 635 euros. (Came in at 15 euros under the stated budget: 650 euros)

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High End Gaming System

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant / Benchmarks

CPU: Intel Core i5-3570K 3.4GHz Quad-Core Processor ($189.99 @ Microcenter)
Motherboard: MSI Z77A-G45 ATX LGA1155 Motherboard ($116.99 @ Amazon)
Memory: Corsair Vengeance 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR3-1600 Memory ($52.98 @ Amazon)
Storage: Crucial M4 256GB 2.5" Solid State Disk ($186.98 @ SuperBiiz)
Storage: Seagate Barracuda 2TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive ($89.98 @ Outlet PC)
Video Card: Gigabyte Radeon HD 7950 3GB Video Card (2-Way CrossFire) ($297.98 @ SuperBiiz)
Video Card: Gigabyte Radeon HD 7950 3GB Video Card (2-Way CrossFire) ($297.98 @ SuperBiiz)
Case: Fractal Design Define R4 (Black Pearl) ATX Mid Tower Case ($109.99 @ Amazon)
Power Supply: SeaSonic M12II 650W 80 PLUS Bronze Certified ATX12V / EPS12V Power Supply ($115.17 @ Newegg)
Total: $1458.04
(Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available.)
(Generated by PCPartPicker 2013-03-01 08:11 EST-0500)

Missing in the list is:
CPU Cooler: Scythe Mugen 3 @ 40 euros.

Bringing the local total to: 1360 euros. (Came in 140 euros under the stated budget: 1500 euros)

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I know this is a very long post, but I just see some recommended items in here that don't make any sense to me. Like the corsair CX series (I've been told not to bother with their builder series) - and the recommendation to get crossfire 7950s on a high-end gaming system. Not to mention telling someone to go get the 7950 (middle build) instead of a 7870 XT.

Am I in the wrong here? Would you suggest the same thing? I feel the guru's on MMOC and the guru's on tweakers wouldn't really see eye to eye. o.O - I've always had great respect for that website, but the odd builds this month (and previous months) make me second-guess my opinion.

[Deleted]

They are made on the forums, just as much as people do here. So you can discuss it aswell over there, thing is tho only a couple of people make suggestions i think. So they are as much experts as we are on these forums

Also, this is still a MMO forum which affects choices made.

The CX line is ok-ish for budget builds.

[Deleted]

I know zeara, I made an account to make sure I can get in on the conversation before their next BBG.

However, in hindsight, I can't do much other than reply on the actual BBG they made. Which I did. On page three. Same username.

Just curious if I'm tunnel visioning on what people here always recommend.

Edit.

Reading through more comments on there.... there's people complaining on things in nearly every build. I guess they made this when they were sleepy or something. >.> - There's several things linked wrongly, several components recommended that don't really go well together, etcetera.

[n0cturnal]

There are several things that can be changed or tweaked but it is pretty hard without knowing exactly the prices and stores they are looking at. The prices and also availability can vary a lot between US and EU sites.

Take PSUs as an example, in US you can get Seasonic pretty cheap compared to most countries in EU, in Sweden you can get cheap Silverpower PSUs that are made by Seasonic, in Germany you can get cheap Superflower instead.

I myself am looking to get a new PSU and while I almost always recommend Seasonic for others I will probably get a platinum rated Fractal Design PSU for myself.

Also you must keep in mind that picking parts for a computer is no exact science, it will always be influence by personal preference.

[Deleted]

I know zeara, I made an account to make sure I can get in on the conversation before their next BBG.

However, in hindsight, I can't do much other than reply on the actual BBG they made. Which I did. On page three. Same username.

Just curious if I'm tunnel visioning on what people here always recommend.

Edit.

Reading through more comments on there.... there's people complaining on things in nearly every build. I guess they made this when they were sleepy or something. >.> - There's several things linked wrongly, several components recommended that don't really go well together, etcetera.

People always complain there :P Just get in the discussion for the next one in two months time. But looking at your response, they were always pro SLI/Crossfire.
But people always have different opinions, for example with the budget gaming build. I would ditch the 7950, get a 7870 XT/LE or w/e its called and get a 3570k.

But they are going with the assumption, that the GPU will bottleneck earlier than the CPU. Which I find perfectly reasonable.
I find it more weird that they said that the titan competes with the 7970...... -.-

But im gonna look at the actual forum posts :P

[Deleted]

I would ditch the 7950, get a 7870 XT/LE or w/e its called and get a 3570k.

Things like that are hardly opinions, really. At the moment, price vs performance, the 7870 XT is a better choice. Period. (Having myself bought the 7950 a few weeks ago... ugh.)

I'll agree on other things being heavily influenced by opinions, but yeah... guess there's no other way to go about it other than actually chiming in on the forum post in two months time. Whats your username there, anyway?

[Deleted]

Things like that are hardly opinions, really. At the moment, price vs performance, the 7870 XT is a better choice. Period. (Having myself bought the 7950 a few weeks ago... ugh.)

I'll agree on other things being heavily influenced by opinions, but yeah... guess there's no other way to go about it other than actually chiming in on the forum post in two months time. Whats your username there, anyway?

Same as it is here I have been looking at the 650 system. And there it was a intel/AMD discussion. And to be fair, after looking at the arguments, I might personally pick a 8320 + 7870 XT over the 3350/7950. Also the choice for the Boost version was that its 10% faster or something, but that isnt worth 60 euros to me :P

But at the end of the day there is still one person who makes the list. And that person said he would name the 8320 as an alternative but he didnt.

And im about to make a system for a friend tonight, and that discussion has me doubting wheter or not go pick a 8350 over a 3570k. Just because he also wants to do some video editing...... Really picking a GPU is so easy compared to a CPU (on a budget)

[Deleted]

So how much are you spending?

[Deleted]

1000 euro.

But I made a tread about it, right here

http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/...d-for-a-friend

[chazus]

Like the corsair CX series (I've been told not to bother with their builder series)

The issue I've been understanding with the CX series is that it has somewhat poor amp distribution. So, say, a 500w is really more like a 400w. Now, on a build that's in the 400w range, having a 500 thats more like a 400 can be... dicey. Especially if overclocking. If you have, say, a 700w CX series on a system that won't even clear 500w, you're probably fine. I recently bought a bunch of CX430's on sale for like $15, to put into old systems that won't even break 200w.

As far as I'm aware (and correct me people, if I'm wrong), but there are not any actual QUALITY issues with the CX series. It's simply a matter of the ~500w range ones are dicey to use on systems, you really dont want to go below 450w on anything, and anything over 550w can be had for cheaper, or simply not needed, or you'll get something nicer for a few bucks more.

and the recommendation to get crossfire 7950s on a high-end gaming system. Not to mention telling someone to go get the 7950 (middle build) instead of a 7870 XT.

This could be a few things
1) They simply aren't aware of the 7870 XT
2) They aren't comfortable with the 7870 XT yet, due to having no options from Gigabyte, Asus, or MSI
3) The 7950's have more vram, which might be desireable for multi-monitor/eyefinity setups
4) There is no decent ~$600 video card setup besides 2x7950 (2x 660ti or 2x 670 perform slightly worse, and better, respectively, but both cost MUCH more). This also doesn't take into account why the 7870 XT is ignored. Maybe it's an older post?

[vesseblah]

The issue I've been understanding with the CX series is that it has somewhat poor amp distribution. So, say, a 500w is really more like a 400w. Now, on a build that's in the 400w range, having a 500 thats more like a 400 can be... dicey. Especially if overclocking. If you have, say, a 700w CX series on a system that won't even clear 500w, you're probably fine. I recently bought a bunch of CX430's on sale for like $15, to put into old systems that won't even break 200w.

As far as I'm aware (and correct me people, if I'm wrong), but there are not any actual QUALITY issues with the CX series. It's simply a matter of the ~500w range ones are dicey to use on systems, you really dont want to go below 450w on anything, and anything over 550w can be had for cheaper, or simply not needed, or you'll get something nicer for a few bucks more.

430W model is made by Seasonic and is actually 430W capable. 500W and 600W models are made by CWT and lower quality. Those can actually deliver about 50-100W less than promised and are not 80+ certified.

Corsair's CX PSUs are not crap per se, but those clearly ride on the fame of HX/TX/AX series and are lower quality than you might expect from the brand. Because there are available 80+ certified much higher PSUs at the same price, CX series is not good value for money unless those are on really big discounts.

[Deleted]

This could be a few things
1) They simply aren't aware of the 7870 XT
2) They aren't comfortable with the 7870 XT yet, due to having no options from Gigabyte, Asus, or MSI
3) The 7950's have more vram, which might be desireable for multi-monitor/eyefinity setups
4) There is no decent ~$600 video card setup besides 2x7950 (2x 660ti or 2x 670 perform slightly worse, and better, respectively, but both cost MUCH more). This also doesn't take into account why the 7870 XT is ignored. Maybe it's an older post?

I know this is something you cant/wont do, but i read the forum posts. Someone actually posted the 7870 XT, but someone else posted a benchmark (i think) where the 7950 boost was 10% faster. For me that 10% isnt worth 60 euros. And neither should it have been for them, as it is a best buy guide.
And as it is for a mid range gaming setup, they arent taking multi monitors in account when making the build.

The end choice was something along these lines i think. Either go for the i5 + 7950, or take the FX 8320 (maybe even 8350) + 7870 XT, and the guy making them picked the i5 + 7950

[Lemmiwink]

Best buy is very opinionated tbh. If someone thinks that 5-10% extra performance is worth 200 euros more then they are allowed to think so. Heck, people buy iPhones. At least they picked an AMD card in their best buy setup, which is admirable in itself seeing many people would never touch an AMD card with a 10 feet pole. How someone can recommend a CF setup over a 7970GHz is beyond me though, if compatibility issues and microstuttering is your thing, go right ahead. I would never take SLI or CF over a powerful single GPU, it's only good for one thing tbh and that's benchmarking.

[Danno]

AMD's microstutter with Crossfire this generation was a big deterrent for me, which is why I went Nvidia 2-way SLI for 1440p.

Newer drivers may have helped AMD's issues, but I would still only go AMD if it was for a single GPU build.