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  1. #221
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skytotem View Post
    I'm saying that if Thrall wanted peace it's not something he should have allowed, and it made little sense for Sylvanas to order it if she wants to take down the Scourge, weakening the Night elves is not conducive to that end.
    Likewise who said Thrall directly ordered it? As far as I know all those early BGs were border clashes and what not

    As to the Forsaken, its neither conducive to be attacked by Night Elves from time to time
    Last edited by Dreknar20; 2013-03-05 at 02:57 AM.
    We have faced trials and danger, threats to our world and our way of life. And yet, we persevere. We are the Horde. We will not let anything break our spirits!"

  2. #222
    Quote Originally Posted by Skytotem View Post
    Strawman, that's not my argument at all.

    I'm saying that 'well we had to have conflict so having Thrall not reign in the Warsong can be excused!" is bunk because Blizz could write the conflict without having Thrall advocate peace and it would've been fine.
    Horde needed the lumber, the Elves weren't going to let them have it. Yea there's a bunch of extra antagonizing that was done, but bottom line is that there was nothing much Thrall could do. Each side was already pissed off at each other.
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    I'm determined to someday make Med'an awesome. (MickyNeilson)
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    ´So.. sorry to bring this up but..you know that .."thing" (Med'an).. is that "thing" cannon still?
    ...as much have some have wished otherwise, yes. (Loreology)

  3. #223
    The Lightbringer Skytotem's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aquamonkey View Post
    Horde needed the lumber, the Elves weren't going to let them have it. Yea there's a bunch of extra antagonizing that was done, but bottom line is that there was nothing much Thrall could do. Each side was already pissed off at each other.
    And yet it took Garrosh all of a few months to crack open a path to Azshara and log there, at the very least it would've been strategically more viable because you can freaking BOTTLENECK azshara.


    I also challenge the idea that they need the lumber.

    What the hell are they using it for?

    To stay warm? you can burn coal, oil or even dung for that. Hell, get some goblins and electrify the city.

    To build? You can do that with stone and adobe, and such, you didn't see American settlers or plains indians logging tons of trees, and we saw the Mag'har building clay buildings, they don't need MASSIVE amounts of lumber, they could get it from the Tauren (who carve giant totems anyway they've got lumber to spare and live just fine in tents seriously)

    We never even see the Lumber USED for anything.

    Blizz's storytelling is bunk.

    ---------- Post added 2013-03-04 at 09:36 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Dreknar20 View Post
    Likewise who said Thrall directly ordered it? As far as I know all those early BGs were border clashes and what not

    As to the Forsaken, its neither conducive to be attacked by Night Elves from time to time
    1.Read the bloody quests and you'll know otherwise, movement in ashenvale is FREQUENTLY referred to as expansion, there are quests to go and murder elves and their animal friends.

    2. The forsaken wouldn't get attacked they live in the bloody eastern kingdoms, unless the orcs asked them there's no reason they'd be over there.
    You are now future Jack Noir.

    Presently, you are trapped in a single moment, which increasingly feels like an eternity. Your boredom is surpassed only by your all consuming rage and contempt for existence itself.

  4. #224
    Quote Originally Posted by TheFNK View Post
    Now all that being said I am of the opinion that the "rise" of Lor'themar as a candidate is only there to distract from Saurfang being appointed warchief. The reasoning I use behind Saurfang is that 1) He specifically told Garrosh that he would take care of him himself if he took the orcs towards a dark path; 2) Reluctant leaders make excellent story material; 3) The orcs v. humans mythos would be continued

    Thoughts?
    Saurfang isn't the only one that has threatened Garrosh. Vol'jin said he would personally shoot an arrow into Garrosh's "dark heart" (in fact, he said this to Garrosh himself in a vision of the past int eh Troll starting area). Jaina has threatened to take down Garrosh so hard his ancestors would be reeling. Varian has threatened to take down Garrosh as well. Everyone wants his head. Lor'themar's reasons for hating Garrosh are just new and well-written. However, his reasoning (as well as Varian, Jaina, and Vol'jin's) are all valid at this point. He decimated Theramore, tried to have Vol'jin killed off, nearly killed Anduin, and due to his spies many of Lor'themar's people died in the tension caused in Dalaran. One could argue that, yes, Jaina killed the Blood Elves, but, it was because of Garrosh that Jaina became so power-hungry and angry in the first place.

    It was stated that Sylvanas would be integral to the ousting of Garrosh's corruption. Just a hunch, Sylvanas will come to Pandaria, point out his corruption, thus leading to the events of Siege of Orgrimmar. IF Lor'themar were to become Warchief, I would guess that Sylvanas would be the first to suggest that as well, perhaps to hold something over Lor'themar's head (as she has been known to do, like in his short story) or simply to show support to have a supporter in a group of spiritual people that she doesn't exactly belong with.

    But, as far as I see it, any leader in the Horde is entitled to be a candidate for Warchief, whether they want Garrosh's head personally or not. Lor'themar is only getting new lore and a new voice actor for badassity's sake, and I wouldn't expect Blizzard to actually make him Warchief in the end...just an integral part of what is going to happen when we take Garrosh down.

  5. #225
    The Lightbringer Skytotem's Avatar
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    The sylvanas stuff was scrapped.
    You are now future Jack Noir.

    Presently, you are trapped in a single moment, which increasingly feels like an eternity. Your boredom is surpassed only by your all consuming rage and contempt for existence itself.

  6. #226
    Quote Originally Posted by Skytotem View Post
    The sylvanas stuff was scrapped.
    Do you have a source on that claim? There are still some leaders that have not even made an appearance on Pandaria yet so their stories could still continue.

  7. #227
    The Lightbringer Skytotem's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Punisher069 View Post
    Do you have a source on that claim? There are still some leaders that have not even made an appearance on Pandaria yet so their stories could still continue.
    http://www.gamebreaker.tv/mmorpg/gam...source=twitter

    In there somewhere is all I know.
    You are now future Jack Noir.

    Presently, you are trapped in a single moment, which increasingly feels like an eternity. Your boredom is surpassed only by your all consuming rage and contempt for existence itself.

  8. #228
    The Lightbringer Kathranis's Avatar
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    He doesn't say Sylvanas was "scrapped," just that it's hard to choose where to put focus, as they want anything happening in-game to have both gameplay and to fit into the overarching plot.

    To me, the vibe he gives off is that they want to develop her storyline in Lordaeron and Gilneas, preferably from a worgen point-of-view, without having to drag the story away from the Eastern Kingdoms and tie it all into the Pandaria storyline. That makes it difficult to justify dealing with that plotline right now, while the plot is focused on Pandaria.

    There have been hints in these interviews that the plot in 5.3 and beyond will involve returning to Azeroth proper and seeing how the war is playing out for the rest of the world.

  9. #229
    He's a Blood Elf leader, not a Warchief.

  10. #230
    Quote Originally Posted by Skytotem View Post
    And yet it took Garrosh all of a few months to crack open a path to Azshara and log there, at the very least it would've been strategically more viable because you can freaking BOTTLENECK azshara.
    A big project like carving through the mountain can only happen after a base economy is established.

    Quote Originally Posted by Skytotem View Post
    To build? You can do that with stone and adobe, and such, you didn't see American settlers or plains indians logging tons of trees, and we saw the Mag'har building clay buildings, they don't need MASSIVE amounts of lumber, they could get it from the Tauren (who carve giant totems anyway they've got lumber to spare and live just fine in tents seriously).
    They would need it for scaffolding on the big gate and the larger buildings.

    In regards to the Tauren supplying it. Originally, it was the Bloodhoof clan that joined the Horde. They were nearly extinct and had no land.

    Maybe they use it for food. It did somehow save Orgrimmar from famine.
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    I'm determined to someday make Med'an awesome. (MickyNeilson)
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    ´So.. sorry to bring this up but..you know that .."thing" (Med'an).. is that "thing" cannon still?
    ...as much have some have wished otherwise, yes. (Loreology)

  11. #231
    The Lightbringer Skytotem's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aquamonkey View Post
    A big project like carving through the mountain can only happen after a base economy is established.


    They would need it for scaffolding on the big gate and the larger buildings.

    In regards to the Tauren supplying it. Originally, it was the Bloodhoof clan that joined the Horde. They were nearly extinct and had no land.

    Maybe they use it for food. It did somehow save Orgrimmar from famine.
    A big economy like the one that was in ruins after rebuilding org...?

    Okay but in Vanilla we had Mulgore, and not just the Bloodhoof clan, this wasn't WC3.

    So yeah, Blizz storytelling is bunk
    You are now future Jack Noir.

    Presently, you are trapped in a single moment, which increasingly feels like an eternity. Your boredom is surpassed only by your all consuming rage and contempt for existence itself.

  12. #232
    Let me get this straight

    If Theron is gonna be made warchief then silvermoon will have to become the capital of the horde because he aint gonna hang out in grommosh hold

    At the end of the day we all know blizzard is just trolling and that thrall WILL regain his position as warchief

  13. #233
    Quote Originally Posted by Skytotem View Post
    Okay but in Vanilla we had Mulgore, and not just the Bloodhoof clan, this wasn't WC3.

    So yeah, Blizz storytelling is bunk
    Mulgore is mostly grasslands. Not exactly lumber country. Most of their buildings are tents. In regards to those massive totems that are larger than any of the trees that grow there: a wizard did it.
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    I'm determined to someday make Med'an awesome. (MickyNeilson)
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    ´So.. sorry to bring this up but..you know that .."thing" (Med'an).. is that "thing" cannon still?
    ...as much have some have wished otherwise, yes. (Loreology)

  14. #234
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    As i said before, Blood Elf as a warchief is against Horde concept as a savage,primal, barbarian faction. It has to be Orc,Troll or Tauren, hell i even prefer Thrall to wear back Orgrim Armor and become warchief again, but blood elf...it's just don't fit

  15. #235
    Quote Originally Posted by Felarion View Post
    As i said before, Blood Elf as a warchief is against Horde concept as a savage,primal, barbarian faction. It has to be Orc,Troll or Tauren, hell i even prefer Thrall to wear back Orgrim Armor and become warchief again, but blood elf...it's just don't fit
    A shot of demon blood at the inauguration after-party and Lor'themar will be good to go.
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    I'm determined to someday make Med'an awesome. (MickyNeilson)
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    ´So.. sorry to bring this up but..you know that .."thing" (Med'an).. is that "thing" cannon still?
    ...as much have some have wished otherwise, yes. (Loreology)

  16. #236
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    Quote Originally Posted by Combooticus View Post
    Let me get this straight

    If Theron is gonna be made warchief then silvermoon will have to become the capital of the horde because he aint gonna hang out in grommosh hold

    At the end of the day we all know blizzard is just trolling and that thrall WILL regain his position as warchief
    Pretty much this. If theron bacame new warchief, blizzard would need to revamp entire silvermoon city, not only the kael'thas statues in already used part but also rework the ruin part of it. That would require to rework eversong to fit current timeframe and that would require to rework ghostlands as well. And then they would need to give something for alliance players too. I simply can't see how would they want to redo 4 starting zones at the moment.

  17. #237
    The Insane Trassk's Avatar
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    Why is anyone even trying to imagine a non-orc as warchief? Really, consider what your thinking for a moment. The head of the horde, the thing that started it all, the race that begun the horde, and the one that brought the concept of a warchief into the genre has, and always will be an orc.

    On top of that, you are suggesting that the orcs will be lead by a non-orc character after the fall of Garrosh, seriously? Do you see any other race in warcraft that is lead by a none representation of there own race as its leader. Gnomes are lead by a gnome, undead are lead by an undead, worgen are lead by worgen, trolls are lead by a troll. What, you think blizzard are going to suddenly be controversial and make it that orcs are the ONLY race in wow that isn't lead by a racial leader who isn't one of there own?

    And if lor'themar or any other faction leader in the horde did become the warchief, are you honestly suggesting that the character now has to be in command of the orcs, there own people and the horde in one go? Do you have any idea how contrived that sounds storywise? Do you think orcs will just bend over for an elf warchief, while he still tries to lead his own people.

    Face reality please. Each Racial leader of each horde faction is focused on there own people and there own lands. Durotar is orcish land, orgirmmar is the orcish city, You cannot have a non-orc leading it.

  18. #238
    Quote Originally Posted by Trassk View Post
    Why is anyone even trying to imagine a non-orc as warchief? Really, consider what your thinking for a moment. The head of the horde, the thing that started it all, the race that begun the horde, and the one that brought the concept of a warchief into the genre has, and always will be an orc.

    On top of that, you are suggesting that the orcs will be lead by a non-orc character after the fall of Garrosh, seriously? Do you see any other race in warcraft that is lead by a none representation of there own race as its leader. Gnomes are lead by a gnome, undead are lead by an undead, worgen are lead by worgen, trolls are lead by a troll. What, you think blizzard are going to suddenly be controversial and make it that orcs are the ONLY race in wow that isn't lead by a racial leader who isn't one of there own?

    And if lor'themar or any other faction leader in the horde did become the warchief, are you honestly suggesting that the character now has to be in command of the orcs, there own people and the horde in one go? Do you have any idea how contrived that sounds storywise? Do you think orcs will just bend over for an elf warchief, while he still tries to lead his own people.

    Face reality please. Each Racial leader of each horde faction is focused on there own people and there own lands. Durotar is orcish land, orgirmmar is the orcish city, You cannot have a non-orc leading it.
    So why not have a separate leader for the orcs while the Horde is lead by someone from a different race?
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    I'm determined to someday make Med'an awesome. (MickyNeilson)
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    ´So.. sorry to bring this up but..you know that .."thing" (Med'an).. is that "thing" cannon still?
    ...as much have some have wished otherwise, yes. (Loreology)

  19. #239
    The Insane Trassk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aquamonkey View Post
    So why not have a separate leader for the orcs while the Horde is lead by someone from a different race?
    For the same reason humans are always the defacto main body of the alliance. For the same reason the alliance has always been spearheaded by one human commander or king or general. Thats how it works.

    Orcs are the main body of the horde just as humans are the main body of the alliance, all the other races is just flavor-text

  20. #240
    Not going to happen, dream on BE lovers...

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