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  1. #1

    Warlock PvP discussion - Season 13

    Allright, with the help of warlocks interested in PvP this thread could turn into the regular hang out for all things PvP. Use it for questions, to bounce theories off other players, best world PvP locations, musings about spec intricacies or just to tell others how much you'd like to see ability X buffed or changed for usefulness.

    To at least give you guys a starting point to discuss early on: The new patch should be in by now (or is going to be in a matter of hours) so the obvious question is:

    what spec will you play for season 13?

    And in what niche will you play it, 2's, 3's, RBG or just screwing around doing world PvP on the new island?

  2. #2

    Seeking Advice re PVP Spec for Undergeared Lock in Random BGs

    Hi all,

    I just returned to WoW after a 2-year absence and have leveled my Lock up to 88 so far. I have always really enjoyed PVP but could use some advice/direction given my lengthy absence.

    I don't have a group of people to PVP with (at least not now), so I'll be doing a lot of random BGs over the next month or two (while finishing my leveling to 90) in order to get some decent gear (will get the crafted gear at 90).

    With that in mind, what spec would you suggest I go? I've played all 3 in the past and don't really have a favorite. But since (i) i'll be undergeared and trying to gear-up and (ii) will mostly be doing random BGs, I wanted to get some opinions on the matter.

    Many thanks!

  3. #3
    Random thoughts about 3v3 arena (mostly)
    I've been playing a lot of Affliction for arena on the PTR against the R1s and such, and it seems to be in a much better place for the simple fact that warriors are going to decline in popularity.

    The biggest issue with warlocks last season is that warriors and KFC took a dump on any warlock team (by killing the warlock or his healer since Fear isn't an effective peel vs a warrior or a BM hunter with multiple Fear breaks). Monks and rogues look to be FOTM and those are definitely easier melee for warlocks to deal with than warriors and DKs.

    The Blood Fear nerf is a big one. It's really the only thing that made us barely playable last season after the Demo CW nerf. But I've actually been using all 3 talents in that tier now on the PTR. Having spammable Fear again is nice, but against a good shaman or a team that trains you is definitely going to make getting CC off harder. That being said, UW is very nice against caster teams, and Burning Rush is actually pretty useful with KJC if your teammate can keep melee slowed. Blood Horror is a good dueling/solo PvP talent since it's essentially a stun on a different DR, but feels a bit awkward in 3s or an RBG.

    Demo and Destro seem playable with the damage buffs, but it'll be interesting to see how they function without Blood Fear since a big part of their playstyle was get easy CC and burst in that window. Now you have to setup the burst and be able to get off the CC. Demo still it's unique niche with the knockoff and being the best spec when being trained due to not having much to cast, and Destro has the most survivability with the Ember Tap + glyph and still good burst. Destro just doesn't feel right to play without Sac though, maybe it's just me.

    Anyway those are my random thoughts about arena this season. Here's to hoping DKs weren't overbuffed.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Simplexity View Post
    The Blood Fear nerf is a big one. It's really the only thing that made us barely playable last season after the Demo CW nerf. But I've actually been using all 3 talents in that tier now on the PTR. Having spammable Fear again is nice, but against a good shaman or a team that trains you is definitely going to make getting CC off harder. That being said, UW is very nice against caster teams, and Burning Rush is actually pretty useful with KJC if your teammate can keep melee slowed. Blood Horror is a good dueling/solo PvP talent since it's essentially a stun on a different DR, but feels a bit awkward in 3s or an RBG.
    Against melee teams I actually really like the new Blood Fear, it becomes an extra melee peel that doesn't DR you actual fear. It is a bit more situational though I guess, instead of just "always take blood fear".

  5. #5
    [/COLOR]
    Quote Originally Posted by zinnin View Post
    Against melee teams I actually really like the new Blood Fear, it becomes an extra melee peel that doesn't DR you actual fear. It is a bit more situational though I guess, instead of just "always take blood fear".
    I agree. And also, I've never understood how people thought Blood Fear was so incredible. I mean, you blood fear someone, he wills it or trinkets it or tremors it - what do you do then? You wait for your fear to come off CD. With regular fear, you know he's going to get out somehow, and you're already casting the re-fear before he's had time to trinket. Yeah, you get a DR'ed fear on him, but that's usually better than sitting around looking at your blood fear CD.
    Last edited by Viridis; 2013-03-05 at 05:56 PM.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Viridis View Post
    [/COLOR]

    I agree. And also, I've never understood how people thought Blood Fear was so incredible. I mean, you blood fear someone, he wills it or trinkets it or tremors it - what do you do then? You wait for your fear to come off CD. With regular fear, you know he's going to get out somehow, and you're already casting the re-fear before he's had time to trinket. Yeah, you get a DR'ed fear on him, but that's usually better than sitting around looking at your blood fear CD.
    1v1 it wasn't too broken. In a setting with multiple dispellers (RBGs), it wasn't bad either. It was completely overpowered in arena though when trying to Fear a healer. There is no full duration, 8 second INSTANT CC on such a short CD as Blood Fear. It made CCing healers a joke, and was really unavoidable since all you needed was LoS. The downside of not being able to Fear someone's trinket (remember you would have to CAST both those Fears as well) once every 2 minutes isn't nearly as good as being able to instant fear every 10 seconds. It also made it a joke to set up cross CC. Say that the healer was on DR. Well I could blanket spell lock or Axe Toss the healer while instant Fearing a DPS. Or if I needed to peel I could howl the DPS and instant fear the healer to prevent dispels. Granted it took more skill to set up meaningful cross CC, but the fact that it's all instant and on such a short CD is pretty broken.

    Another point too is that having the ability to instantly Fear means that you can focus more on damage. I don't have to waste time juking interrupts to get CC out - I press Blood Fear and bam. Think about other instant long, duration CC and CDs on them. I know Fear has specific counters - tremor/WotF/Lichborne/Fear Ward/Zerker Rage, but against non-resto shaman teams it was too easy to get the healer in an 8 second CC.

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Morictan View Post
    Hi all,

    I just returned to WoW after a 2-year absence and have leveled my Lock up to 88 so far. I have always really enjoyed PVP but could use some advice/direction given my lengthy absence.

    I don't have a group of people to PVP with (at least not now), so I'll be doing a lot of random BGs over the next month or two (while finishing my leveling to 90) in order to get some decent gear (will get the crafted gear at 90).

    With that in mind, what spec would you suggest I go? I've played all 3 in the past and don't really have a favorite. But since (i) i'll be undergeared and trying to gear-up and (ii) will mostly be doing random BGs, I wanted to get some opinions on the matter.

    Many thanks!
    Moved your thread to the new and shiny PvP thread.

    In random BG's the surprise Chaosbolt to the face and self healing of Destro are hard to match, I feel. Affliction and Demo both work too, but I've been more succesful and enjoyed more when I went Destro then Affli (not tried Demo myself).

  8. #8
    Hey guys nice to see a thread like this! I just got done reading all the patch notes for warlocks and I must say blizzard impressed me All demo dmg has been increased by 15% which is awesome!!! Unstable affliction is always a crit and the dmg has been increased!! Targets with haunt and fully dotted take more dmg now and the glyph of drain health increases healing by 30% when casting drain health which is awesome!!

    Ill deff be playing both affliction and demonology and have no means into even looking at destruction again! Cant wait for the servers to come back up!! Good Luck to all!!

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Nakamuraa View Post
    Hey guys nice to see a thread like this! I just got done reading all the patch notes for warlocks and I must say blizzard impressed me All demo dmg has been increased by 15% which is awesome!!! Unstable affliction is always a crit and the dmg has been increased!! Targets with haunt and fully dotted take more dmg now and the glyph of drain health increases healing by 30% when casting drain health which is awesome!!

    Ill deff be playing both affliction and demonology and have no means into even looking at destruction again! Cant wait for the servers to come back up!! Good Luck to all!!
    good luck to you too naka!

    affliction 90% / destro 10% ofc.

    didnt arrive at affliction lightly.. played PTR exclusively for 2 weeks because we're sitting both my teams sooo, what else to do?

    honestly tho bro - i feel like your better off with UA/Health stone/Swap for affi instead of DL but maybe thats only because i abuse port/soulburn and get starved for shards.

    destro is really immortal with that new ember glyph omg. gonna be a good bg grind spec for the next couple weeks.


    still can't bring myself to play demo.. lets call it personal preference.

    ps ; none of you will miss the old blood fear after the first week or so.

    Quote Originally Posted by Shahada View Post
    The devs aren't stupid.

  10. #10
    Thinking of trying out Destro again with the buffs to incinerate and pets being more viable. Still probably going to stay Demo though. I'm hoping there will be less brainless instant casting until you go into Meta though.

    ---------- Post added 2013-03-05 at 07:23 PM ----------

    Also, am I the only one that finds Demo's mobility outweighing Destro's self healing?
    Destruction cataclysm arena video

  11. #11
    I'm going to try out Afflic for my RBG team. It doesn't have the same overwhelming burst as a fully charged Destro or Demo, but in exchange there's no need to charge up the same way. Afflic can burst from a cold start and gets a lot of it back on a kill. Plus UA looks to be punishing enough to matter, now.

    Blood Horror is kind of tempting, but I may stay UW for RBG play. Too often it's important to have the CC break when there's an objective that matters more than hastening my own death, like breaking up a node tag or keeping up pressure on an EFC.

  12. #12
    BGs: Demonology Dark Apotheosis all the way. Call me crazy but I love it. Super gimped damage but it let me faceroll melees (yes even wars on live). It's the only thing I care for after years of suffering against them. Over 50% Pdamage reduc from armor, a sleep CC, anti caster aura, a leap, a cone knockback, 100% instants and finally jumping to 700k hp with crazy % life regen from glyped HS,dark regeneration and grimoire of sacrifice. Nomnomnom. Sad damage is so low though.

    The new tanking blood fear design kinda works for this spec too.
    Last edited by Gratlim; 2013-03-05 at 07:33 PM.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Simplexity View Post
    1v1 it wasn't too broken. In a setting with multiple dispellers (RBGs), it wasn't bad either. It was completely overpowered in arena though when trying to Fear a healer. There is no full duration, 8 second INSTANT CC on such a short CD as Blood Fear. It made CCing healers a joke, and was really unavoidable since all you needed was LoS. The downside of not being able to Fear someone's trinket (remember you would have to CAST both those Fears as well) once every 2 minutes isn't nearly as good as being able to instant fear every 10 seconds. It also made it a joke to set up cross CC. Say that the healer was on DR. Well I could blanket spell lock or Axe Toss the healer while instant Fearing a DPS. Or if I needed to peel I could howl the DPS and instant fear the healer to prevent dispels. Granted it took more skill to set up meaningful cross CC, but the fact that it's all instant and on such a short CD is pretty broken.

    Another point too is that having the ability to instantly Fear means that you can focus more on damage. I don't have to waste time juking interrupts to get CC out - I press Blood Fear and bam. Think about other instant long, duration CC and CDs on them. I know Fear has specific counters - tremor/WotF/Lichborne/Fear Ward/Zerker Rage, but against non-resto shaman teams it was too easy to get the healer in an 8 second CC.
    It's too bad you can't argue your way to a glad title.


    Edit: I wasn't 'calling out' the poster specifically. We see a lot of arguments for how op blood fear is but it availed them all nothing for the glad titles that were just handed out.


    Mod edit: retracted your infraction. Do take care to make clear what your intention is next time, and not just leave tentatively cryptic remarks that can be construed as insulting.
    Last edited by xskarma; 2013-03-05 at 08:47 PM.
    Your comments are duly noted and ignored.
    I punch a hobo every time someone says 'it's not a rotation it's a priority list lol'.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Lulbalance View Post
    ps ; none of you will miss the old blood fear after the first week or so.
    Screw Blood Fear, you couldn't "like" it unless you liked being faceroll. What's so fun about limiting your main CC to a 10 sec CD and making it take away 10% of your health? One of the worst spells to ever make it into the game tbh, and no, it has nothing to do with all the "instant CC" that people deem OP (a.k.a Shadowfury, Cata Coil, Howl of Terror) in my opinion.
    I'll personally be "enjoying" (as in the mechanics) playing my warlock much more with the normal fear, although I'll get pretty pissed against DKs, which seem to be 5.0.4 warriors v2 against warlocks.
    Destruction cataclysm arena video

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Screwtape View Post
    It's too bad you can't argue your way to a glad title.


    Infracted

    Edit: I wasn't 'calling out' the poster specifically. We see a lot of arguments for how op blood fear is but it availed them all nothing for the glad titles that were just handed out.
    Just because a particular mechanic of a class OP doesn't make the class as a whole strong. Without Blood Fear last season we would have been as bad as monks and rets in arena.

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Simplexity View Post
    Just because a particular mechanic of a class OP doesn't make the class as a whole strong. Without Blood Fear last season we would have been as bad as monks and rets in arena.
    exactly. we needed it in 5.1, mechanics are so much better for us in 5.2 that we don't need it anymore, thank fk.

    this season is looking more enjoyable at least.

    Quote Originally Posted by Shahada View Post
    The devs aren't stupid.

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Phoenexis View Post
    Thinking of trying out Destro again with the buffs to incinerate and pets being more viable. Still probably going to stay Demo though. I'm hoping there will be less brainless instant casting until you go into Meta though.

    ---------- Post added 2013-03-05 at 07:23 PM ----------

    Also, am I the only one that finds Demo's mobility outweighing Destro's self healing?
    Demo is my spec of choice for sure. Mobility is sick and fear mixed with kjc as our only casted spell mixed with the damage and survivability buffs will make it viable again imo. I'm using goserv atm and playing more like a "bm hunter" with my imp swarm and dark soul for burst so that way when I'm popping meta and teams cc me like crazy I'm still able to do damage. Also having so much pet damage makes it easier for me to fear healers while helping my team score a kill. Overall I'm prettty happy with the changes. :-)

  18. #18
    Gonna try lock pvp again tomorrow. As demo. Since the damage boost of SF, i'd like too see if i'm ever be able to pool at least 5 molten cores stacks sac'ing the pet and soulfire bombing. I'm gonna stick to unbound will, second trinket, the mobility of the demoform and the extra leap from globlin racial.

    Still,m doesn't sound as promising as my monk WW pvping. Lot of stuff to try tomorrow.

  19. #19
    Any PvP Destro Lock here already did some tests? Was going to try some BGs last night, did it for like 5 min then power went off in my block so I gave up and went to bed.
    Going with GoSac is too much of a loss now?

    And in those 5 min I played, I did noticed something that really worried me. My chaos bolt was hitting way less than it did before patch. I mean the initial hit, not the dot that its the only part of CB that the GoSac nerf should had affected. Could be because everyone already had gotten their malev gear for honor, maybe, Idk

    On an upside, I noticed I was getting embers faster than the usual. But then again, that was all a real quick test, gonna wait for some destro locks that had tested for more time. And I´m mean PVP wise. Cause that CB thing I noticed, if true, its probably just against players.

    Well so I hear everyone saying GoSac now is just plain worse than the other 2 talents, but wasn´t blizzard´s idea to even them? If no ones going to take sac now, whats the point? (assuming no one will, I´m just talking bout what I been reading on foruns and stuff, I know its a bit soon to tell )

  20. #20
    Any initial thoughts so far regarding the 3 specs for PVP after the patch? (Trying to decide between Demo and Destro for the PVP gear grind).

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