[Mage] 5.2 Hotfix Buffs

[Polarthief]

That's about what I was expecting. It was the easiest solution, and a fair buff to our multidot/AOE. I don't see why the tears are here. If it's not enough, we'll get more. Probably by the level 90 talents next time.

That or just a bigger buff to these bombs which buff Frost and Arcane a lot more.

Also, a bomb buff to Arcane isn't going to bring them in line. Their core DPS in Arcane spells is completely busted.

[Deleted]

By spec, it will result in :
Arcane : +5.36% (13,4% of the total dps before hotfix)
Fire : +3.12% (7.8%)
Frost : +4.08% (10.2%)
I have use SimC T15H data.

Number is not that bad. In multi-DoT/AOE, the increase will be more important.

[Polarthief]

Now I know why people don't take the mage community seriously. It's been a week since 5.2 and we have already had our voices heard.

Stopped here because you have no idea what dangerous road you're going down.

[jlwvolsfanjr]

they gave us a buff if you dont like it then why dont you ask them to take it back.
no matter how small it might seem to you we still are better off then we were yesterday.
also what would you expect when they decided that a buff was needed last night.

[Polarthief]

By spec, it will result in :
Arcane : +5.36% (13,4% of the total dps before hotfix)
Fire : +3.12% (7.8%)
Frost : +4.08% (10.2%)
I have use SimC T15H data.

Number is not that bad. In multi-DoT/AOE, the increase will be more important.

The question is does it actually make our multi-dotting worth it over just doing ST?

[Elegiac]

As much as I hate Lhivera, here are his sims taking into account the changes:

For fire (living bomb) - 3% buff
For frost (nether tempest) - 5.48% buff
For arcane (nether tempest) - 5.48% buff

So, if these are to be believed. I'm just going to lol.

[StormenNormen]

The problem i see is does this actually help with fire aoe? Do we spam Nt to spread the nice buffed bombs and just ignore spreading ignites? They really should add LB spreading again.

[Deleted]

~3% boost in single target dps, slightly more on multidotting/heavy movement fights. Seems alright to me. I can foresee a nerf to frostbomb though, and a small buff sometime soon to something else since mages still won't be taken over a warlock if you really want to optimise and everyone is of equal skill.

[Elegiac]

Holy shit our damage is buffed and still the sky is falling. Stop crying about literally every change that they release and just keep doing Throne until your fire DPS scales up so you can stop complaining.

Why should I have to play Fire to be competitive?

[Beefkow]

Makes mage burst more out of hand, before the 20% nerf in pvp to frost bomb.... now a 40% buff? meh....

[Kuni Zyrekai]

The tears are here for two reasons:

1. The wrong buff for a mage class
2. The buff is WAY to OP in PvP so wont last.

1. How so? DoTs might not work thematically, but they're here, and a wonderful tuning option when you want all three specs to remain the same relative to each other. To buff all three specs equally, the bombs are the only real answer. It also helps fix our AOE, multidot, and mobile DPS.
2. They can't just change the modifier on frost bomb they've already got made or anything. We've already lost the ability to detonate it at will, if you still did that for some reason after the nerf.

[Deleted]

By spec, it will result in :
Arcane : +5.36% (13,4% of the total dps before hotfix)
Fire : +3.12% (7.8%)
Frost : +4.08% (10.2%)
I have use SimC T15H data.

Number is not that bad. In multi-DoT/AOE, the increase will be more important.

NT was 7.8% of fire's total damage before hotfix? All my logs it's like 10%+... So it's like a 4% buff for fire at least for me.

[Polarthief]

they gave us a buff if you dont like it then why dont you ask them to take it back.
no matter how small it might seem to you we still are better off then we were yesterday.
also what would you expect when they decided that a buff was needed last night.

I think most of us (well, at least I am) are upset that for yet ANOTHER fucking patch, we say our DPS is low (5.1 saying our DPS is too high for Fire), and then a week (3 days) after the patch, we get buffed (nerfed). This should have been done in the PTR, not a hotfix.

That's at least what I'm getting upset about. They spent all their Mage time nerfing Arcane to unplayability, then realized we were getting sat and too low on the meters, so they hand us a measly buff that won't result in us topping meters.

3% of 100k is 103k. Warlocks/Spriests still pulling 20-40k ahead of us, and even with a 25% nerf to a single spell, they'll still be far ahead of us. Also, Destruction outright kills us and they didn't even get TOUCHED.

---------- Post added 2013-03-12 at 03:41 PM ----------

The problem i see is does this actually help with fire aoe? Do we spam Nt to spread the nice buffed bombs and just ignore spreading ignites? They really should add LB spreading again.

Or unlimited targets for Combustion/Ignite/Pyro DoT.

Or making Inferno Blast (NOT Fire Blast) spread NT to all targets, LB to 3 targets (IMO both the explosion and target limit should be upped to 4 or 5), and FB to... ... ... Idk, I'll think of this one later. Granted, if you're using FB as Fire, you're not playing optimally.

[Frostful]

5.2 FROST MAGE MACROS

#showtooltip Frost Bomb
/cast Frost Bomb
/yell YOLO
/dance
/cast Frostbomb
/cast ice block

Collect points
CANT WAIT BABY! !!!!!

[Swizzle]

Applying a simple modifier to a spell based on the target wouldn't have any measurable effect on game performance.

This also shouldn't be hard to implement unless their codebase is some kind of horrible abomination.

I was just going off the basis that WoW coding is still some ancient abomination. Have no clue what it's like now, but I know they hated adding debuff slots to bosses back in the day because it slowed things down and even actually broke bosses.

[Deleted]

I think the big thing they brought up in the past about splitting PvE and PvP spells/system was that it would confuse players.... as in, people would be overwhelmed by all the "spell does x against players and y against npcs".

The way I see it, splitting the PvE and PvP systems would be a big one-time effort, similar to a total skill system overhaul, but it would make balancing thereafter far easier.
You could rework Frost to actually freaking work in PvE with more Freeze-effect procs, higher damage etc. without worrying how it would affect PvP. I have and will always be of the opinion that splitting the PvE and PvP skill systems would be worth it, would make the game more enjoyable for everyone, for us and for them. Their balancing changes would be longer lasting, once they balanced a spell for PvE or PvP that'd be it, no influence from the other playstyle to consider.

As for this ... buff... yay... I was correct in my level of excitement. I'll grant that it achieves their goal of buffing all specs equally, I could see that. But it's not enough, 40% buff to our bombs won't do shit on its own. There will have to be more buffs. And that'll take time, cause they will definitely wait another week or so to see how the bomb buff affects DPS. Until the time they will be close do getting it right most mages will have been benched for weeks.

At least Warlocks got nerfed. Yeah, I know it's petty but I don't care. It was just a slap in the face to see Mage nerfed to the ground and Locks get a buff for every nerf they got when they already were, and still are, miles and miles ahead of us in the mobility and multi-dotting department, both highly integral parts of current raiding.

Another thing ... it's ... entertaining to see them addressing the issue of mobillity and multi-dotting fights and how Mages can't deal well with both. Whether they'll actually do something about it, at this point I doubt it. But I guess it's something.

[Arghh151]

The problem i see is does this actually help with fire aoe? Do we spam Nt to spread the nice buffed bombs and just ignore spreading ignites? They really should add LB spreading again.

This is my question as well... losing the spreading of ignite due to tab / NT seems to hurt quite a bit even with the buff....

[Polarthief]

5.2 FROST MAGE MACROS

#showtooltip Frost Bomb
/cast Frost Bomb
/yell YOLO
/dance
/cast Frostbomb
/cast ice block

Collect points
CANT WAIT BABY! !!!!!

Why the hell is Frost Bomb on here twice? Also, line 4 won't do anything because "Frostbomb" doesn't exist.

---------- Post added 2013-03-12 at 03:44 PM ----------

I think the big thing they brought up in the past about splitting PvE and PvP spells/system was that it would confuse players.... as in, people would be overwhelmed by all the "spell does x against players and y against npcs".

Which is why you don't put it in the tooltips, problem solved.

[Methusula]

If the calculations of these buffs are accurate, and I think they are, we will still be at the bottom of the pack.

[Norech]

Why should I have to play Fire to be competitive?

Because they gutted arcane and there gets to a point were frost essentially stops scaling? Did you miss the memo? And why are you still living in the dream world where you think your favorite spec should be the one on top? That's not how this game works.