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  1. #41
    Immortal Dezerte's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by poser765 View Post
    I'm not positive, but I am relatively certain I am right...Most inmate work programs are voluntary and a reward for good behavior. Even prisoners have rights.

    Again, if I am wrong feel free to correct me.
    This is what wiki says:

    Quote Originally Posted by Wikipedia
    The 13th Amendment of the American Constitution in 1865 explicitly allows penal labour as it states that "neither slavery nor involuntary servitude, except as a punishment for a crime whereof the party shall have been duly convicted, shall exist within the United States, or any place subject to their jurisdiction." Unconvicted detainees awaiting trial cannot be forced to participate in forced rehabilitative labor programs in prison as it violates the Thirteenth Amendment. However the "convict lease" system became popular in the South in the late 19th century. Since the impoverished state governments could not afford penitentiaries, they leased out prisoners to work at private firms. According to Douglas A. Blackmon, it was Southern policy to intimidate blacks; tens of thousands of African Americans were arbitrarily arrested and leased to coal mines, lumber camps, brickyards, railroads, quarries and farm plantations.[15] The state governments maximized profits by putting the responsibility on the lessee to provide food, clothing, shelter, and medical care for the prisoners, which resulted in extremely poor conditions, numerous deaths, and perhaps the most inhumane system of labour in the United States.[16] Reformers abolished convict lease in the Progressive Era, stopping the system in Florida in 1919. The last state to abolish the practice was Alabama in 1927.
    In 1934, however, federal prison officials concerned about growing unrest in prisons lobbied to create a work program. Companies got involved again in 1979, when Congress passed a law allowing them to hire prisoners in some circumstances.
    Penal labour is sometimes used as a punishment in the U.S. military.[17] Penal labor is not required in the United States, but refusal to work normally results in the inmate receiving less food, a longer sentence, or other sactions.
    To declare that a personal, inner experience gives certainty about the workings of the universe is to assign far too much value to one’s subjective sense of conviction.
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  2. #42
    Pit Lord Mall Security's Avatar
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    Unless its a violent offense they should be let out, if they are in there for murder or reason such as they can never be safe to be around general society, they should be signed up medical experiments or put to work for the state.

  3. #43
    Quote Originally Posted by Dezerte View Post
    This is what wiki says:
    Ah I see. I might have been too vague. I know prison work gangs and the like still exist, as well as using inmates to run certain prison infrastructure.

    I realize that stuff can be mandatory, just never really saw it as a work program. Which to me seems like a totally different experience...ie telemarketing.
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  4. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Åmbulance View Post
    Correct and wrong, there are work programs that are based on good behavior, and there are some that are mandatory. Just depends where you are imprisoned would be the best way to find out.
    Interesting. Well I guess that makes sense, and it's a good thing.
    When balance is lost, chaos is born.

  5. #45
    Banned Åmbulance's Avatar
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    I forgot which prison it was, but on the show " Lockup", they were showing inmates who did do telemarketing service for a credit card company. Struck me as odd, using criminals, to do credit card calls, with access to account information, and acess to the internet.

  6. #46
    Legendary! vindicatorx's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aelayah View Post
    that focus on punishment rather than rehabilitation.
    I don't know what prison you have been in but for the most part the inmates seem to be content in prison, sure they aren't happy about it but, they know everyone there, they never want to take responsibility for their actions, and they continue to break rules in prison just because they are there. I'll agree non violent crimes shouldn't be in prison as often as they are currently. That and rehabilitation is a joke. None of the inmates have any interest in being rehabilitated the only reason they do anything like drug awareness programs and GED classes is for the 6 month reduction to their sentence per program they complete.
    Last edited by vindicatorx; 2013-03-22 at 11:04 PM.

  7. #47
    Quote Originally Posted by Åmbulance View Post
    I forgot which prison it was, but on the show " Lockup", they were showing inmates who did do telemarketing service for a credit card company. Struck me as odd, using criminals, to do credit card calls, with access to account information, and acess to the internet.
    I's sure they are very low threat inmates, and I doubt the work is lightly monitored...same with their off time internet use.

    ---------- Post added 2013-03-22 at 11:05 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by vindicatorx View Post
    I don't know what prison you have been in but for the most part the inmates seem to be content in prison, sure they aren't happy about it but, they know everyone there, they never want to take responsibility for their actions, and they continue to break rules in prison just because they are there. I'll agree non violent crimes shouldn't be in prison as often as they are currently. That and rehabilitation is a joke. None of the inmates have any interest in being rehabilitated.
    True to a pretty high percentage, but don't generalize the entire prison population.
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  8. #48
    Banned Åmbulance's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by poser765 View Post
    I's sure they are very low threat inmates, and I doubt the work is lightly monitored...same with their off time internet use.
    While all correct, still. Knowing that, would you REALLY want your credit card company using inmates?

  9. #49
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    Even those numbers dont show the whole picture...there are 100's of thousands of people in the parole system and 100's of thousands more who have some type of criminal record and cant find a job so they have to turn to crime to survive ....you do anything in this country and your screwed for life and basically have to turn to crime to survive .

  10. #50
    Banned Bakis's Avatar
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    Just like industries tied to war, prison is serious $$$. In the end money is all that matters to the people elected to "represent the people".

    that focus on punishment rather than rehabilitation.
    In most western European countries this is of a much higher priority than in the US for better or for worse.
    Last edited by Bakis; 2013-03-22 at 11:11 PM.

  11. #51
    Legendary! Tommo's Avatar
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    Isnt it because smoking a joint is considered a fellony or something, whereas the police here would just slap you on the wrist.

  12. #52
    Banned Åmbulance's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tommo View Post
    Isnt it because smoking a joint is considered a fellony or something, whereas the police here would just slap you on the wrist.
    You don't get jailtime for a joint, no matter how much these people try to convince you. You get a fine, not prison.

  13. #53
    Quote Originally Posted by Åmbulance View Post
    While all correct, still. Knowing that, would you REALLY want your credit card company using inmates?
    Honestly? This is going to sound REALLY bad, but call centers are not known for hiring the classiest people that float tot he top of the barrel. I don't know...maybe it bothers me, maybe it doesn't. I am kind of gullible though, and would hire an ex con if he was qualified.
    Get a grip man! It's CHEESE!

  14. #54
    Legendary! vindicatorx's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by poser765 View Post
    True to a pretty high percentage, but don't generalize the entire prison population.
    I worked as a corrections officer for three years and in that time I never met an inmate who actually admitted to doing anything wrong it was someone else's fault. As far as the rehabilitation thing they used to brag about how big of a joke it was. They go to church services, drug meetings, and as many other things as they can sign up for in order to smuggle shit to other inmates, get a time credit, or have the pastor vouch for them at a parole hearing. I talked to the preacher a few times and asked how many of them actually had any contact once he got them out and he told me none had ever but he had hopes that one day one of them would. I think if some of you had to spend some time in the prison environment as a spectator you would quickly change your mind about having these assholes on the street.

  15. #55
    The Insane Didactic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by vindicatorx View Post
    I worked as a corrections officer for three years and in that time I never met an inmate who actually admitted to doing anything wrong it was someone else's fault. As far as the rehabilitation thing they used to brag about how big of a joke it was. They go to church services, drug meetings, and as many other things as they can sign up for in order to smuggle shit to other inmates, get a time credit, or have the pastor vouch for them at a parole hearing. I talked to the preacher a few times and asked how many of them actually had any contact once he got them out and he told me none had ever but he had hopes that one day one of them would. I think if some of you had to spend some time in the prison environment as a spectator you would quickly change your mind about having these assholes on the street.
    Anecdotal evidence is anecdotal. Have you ever stopped to think that perhaps that environment cultivates that sort of behavior?
    Right, as the world goes, is only in question between equals in power, while the strong do what they can and the weak suffer what they must.
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  16. #56
    Banned Åmbulance's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Didactic View Post
    Anecdotal evidence is anecdotal. Have you ever stopped to think that perhaps that environment cultivates that sort of behavior?

    Seeing they are in prison, i'm sure that the behavior has already been cultivated. Correct me if i'm wrong. /facepalm

  17. #57
    Brewmaster Elite Peon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by vindicatorx View Post
    I worked as a corrections officer for three years and in that time I never met an inmate who actually admitted to doing anything wrong it was someone else's fault. As far as the rehabilitation thing they used to brag about how big of a joke it was. They go to church services, drug meetings, and as many other things as they can sign up for in order to smuggle shit to other inmates, get a time credit, or have the pastor vouch for them at a parole hearing. I talked to the preacher a few times and asked how many of them actually had any contact once he got them out and he told me none had ever but he had hopes that one day one of them would. I think if some of you had to spend some time in the prison environment as a spectator you would quickly change your mind about having these assholes on the street.
    I work as a nurse in a state prison so I see your side but I also see the other side a lot . Some of these guys are the biggest a holes in the world and some are pretty nice guys who just got caught up with the wrong crowd or had horrible parents . I don't know what prison you worked at but most of the guys I talk to admit to the crimes they did or at least partly . You know in prison your either a lion or the prey so you have to put up an act at all times ...but I see the act come down when they are sick or hurt ..so it's not as black and white as you see to make it out to be . This is really evident when they have family come visit or they talk about kids or " homies " ...etc etc

  18. #58
    Legendary! vindicatorx's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Didactic View Post
    Anecdotal evidence is anecdotal. Have you ever stopped to think that perhaps that environment cultivates that sort of behavior?
    They do this shit from day one. I know you want to make excuses for their behavior and they love to make fun of people like you who just don't get it.

  19. #59
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    Don't know If it's even been posted, but this

    Quote Originally Posted by The Joker
    All it takes is one bad day to reduce the sanest man alive to lunacy. That's how far the world is from where I am. Just one bad day.

  20. #60
    The Insane Didactic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by vindicatorx View Post
    They do this shit from day one. I know you want to make excuses for their behavior and they love to make fun of people like you who just don't get it.
    I don't generalize in this sort of matter, and neither should you; it isn't rigorous.

    ---------- Post added 2013-03-22 at 04:30 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Åmbulance View Post
    Seeing they are in prison, i'm sure that the behavior has already been cultivated. Correct me if i'm wrong. /facepalm
    Sure. People that get gaoled for relatively minor offenses come out hardened ex-inmates. Prison should only be for those unable to live in the general population for the duration of their rehabilitation (i.e. violent crime).
    Right, as the world goes, is only in question between equals in power, while the strong do what they can and the weak suffer what they must.
    - Thucydides

    There is a modern myth that people have always tended towards democracy, constitutions, electoral rights; but in truth, love of freedom has never been the predominant note of popular politics. At most times, popular demand has been for a strong government.
    - Eugen Weber

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