It's not Nostalgia.

[Pebrocks The Warlock]

I just feel like the game does too much for you. You don't have to form any groups you just sit on your flying mount and wait for the game to find you a dungeon or raid, they have removed all the group quests from the game, bind on account gear and instant lfg makes leveling retarded, you don't ever have to leave the city.

It's just not the same game anymore

Okay, try doing normal/heroic raids while sitting on your flying mount. Go a head and blow through challenge mode with a random group. Oh! I bet heroic scenarios will just hand you everything next patch won't it.
Get over yourself. There was not much hard in past expansions. You're imagining it.

[Boogums]

It's a good thing we're not comparing MoP to anything post Vanilla.

---------- Post added 2013-04-25 at 01:21 AM ----------



Except you just got done complaining about all the crap you DO have to do. So which is it? Do we sit on our mounts all day and just queue queue, or do we HAVE to SLOG through dailies and ENDLESSLY pick our crops, AND BLAH BLAH ALL THIS CRAP I HAVE TO DO?

OR WAIT, ARE YOU TELLlING ME THERE ARE DIFFERENT WAYS PEOPLE CAN PLAY THIS GAME AND EACH INDIVIDUAL PLAYER GETS TO CHOOOOOOOSE HOW THEY WANT TO PLAY?! HOW FUCKING TERRIBLE OF BLIZZARD.

[Kelln12]

First I love how the picture to Raiding in MoP is LFRragon Soul lol

Second, lets look at things you missing in your Vanilla/MoP comparisions

Boss Mechanics
T1 vs. T14
T1: 1 main mechanics mostly
T14 multiple mechanics in every boss fight


Vanilla: Warrior = Tank, Druid/Pally/Shaman/Priest = Healer
MoP: Warrior = DPS/Tank, Druid/Pally= DPS,Heals,Tank Shaman/Priest = Healer, DPS

Dungeons
Vanilla: "LFG Ulda need tank and dps
*10 minutes later*
"LFG Ulda need tank"
*10 minutes later*
"LFG Ulda need tank, healer and dps"

MoP: Queue


Also new fun things that have been introduced since Vanilla like.........
Achievements
Transmog
Pet Battles

[The Madgod]

I never said I played in Vanilla.

Then it appears I misread your post. My apologies.

I just feel like the game does too much for you. You don't have to form any groups you just sit on your flying mount and wait for the game to find you a dungeon or raid, they have removed all the group quests from the game, bind on account gear and instant lfg makes leveling retarded, you don't ever have to leave the city.

It's just not the same game anymore

I wouldn't call being forced to spam general or trade chat for a group so you can get through that zone's questline or having to sometimes take more time getting a group together to do a dungeon than it takes for you to actually complete said dungeon a good thing.

Most people I've met in game has been through PuG raiding and through being in the same guild. PuG's still happen if your server's healthy and guilds still exist.

I really can't say that while doing five mans I've met many people who I have talked to more outside of that dungeon, nor do I think that LFG and LFR detract from that ability, since we've got cross-server communication and friends lists through the battletag system. The only thing that stops us from making friends through LFG / LFR is ourselves, really.

As if anyone was doing these. There was more world pvp on a day on the elemental plateau than in a whole year of hellfire capture points.

A lot of people were, by my reckoning, considering I got into a significant tussle about once a week in each contested area.

And the plateau was a significant mob farming area, which means people there probably aren't going to be flying around (which they had to in order to go there), which means flying mounts are irrelevant and if there's areas of choice mob farming that people DON'T take advantage of to start a fight, then that's their own fault.

[Volitar]

Okay, try doing normal/heroic raids while sitting on your flying mount. Go a head and blow through challenge mode with a random group. Oh! I bet heroic scenarios will just hand you everything next patch won't it.
Get over yourself. There was not much hard in past expansions. You're imagining it.

I was referring to LFG in my post but I completely forgot about challenges modes I think they are really awesome and one of my favorite parts about MOP didn't mean to overlook those. As for heroic scenarios I wasn't aware they had any of these, I didn't even know they existed until right now so I can't really comment on them I'll try one tomorrow and give feedback on it.

OR WAIT, ARE YOU TELLlING ME THERE ARE DIFFERENT WAYS PEOPLE CAN PLAY THIS GAME AND EACH INDIVIDUAL PLAYER GETS TO CHOOOOOOOSE HOW THEY WANT TO PLAY?! HOW FUCKING TERRIBLE OF BLIZZARD.

I think you are being a little over the top.

[Deleted]

WoW is much better now overall,
yep, it's nostalgia.

[mistahwilshire]

World PvP in Vanilla:


World PvP in MoP:

lol fail. Someone hasn't played a high pop pvp realm at 4winds.

[Boogums]

I think you are being a little over the top.

I think you want Blizzard to take away things from casuals so that "hardcores" feel like they have more.

[Pebrocks The Warlock]

I was referring to LFG in my post but I completely forgot about challenges modes I think they are really awesome and one of my favorite parts about MOP didn't mean to overlook those. As for heroic scenarios I wasn't aware they had any of these, I didn't even know they existed until right now so I can't really comment on them I'll try one tomorrow and give feedback on it.

Heroic scenarios are coming in 5.3 so you'll have to wait a bit. They cannot be queued for and have a ilvl restriction.

[Deleted]

Serpentshrine Cavern was added in patch 2.0.3, or in other words at the start of the Burning Crusade. That's not vanilla



The problem that world PvP suffers is that there's no tangible reward from it, not some bullshit to do with flying mounts.

The biggest days of world PvP for me were in TBC's endgame, and flying mounts didn't detract from that. Even to this day there's people who fight over some of those objectives.

If you want world PvP back, ask for more TBC/classic-like PvP objectives in the world. I guarantee the day they add those to relevant content you'll see more people dying outside of battlegrounds and the arena.

Fly mounts was a huge reason for the decline of World PvP, a lot of it started with a gank from someone, who then got his friends, then the ganker got his friends, and the fight just kept growing. Stranglethorn Vale is called Gankelthorn Vale for a reason.

I remember Halaa, and I remember quite a few fun fights that we had there, I would very much want to see more such things added to the game. But I still don't think fly mounts has any place in such an area, nor do I think a player should be able to flee so easily, especially when he started the fight.

[Volitar]

I think you want Blizzard to take away things from casuals so that "hardcores" feel like they have more.

I'm not saying that. I'm just saying I dislike LFG, LFR, and dailys. Pet battles, Arenas, BGs, Mount/Pet/Achievement farming, and Challenge modes are all things I enjoy outside of raiding and are accessible to anyone.

Also I hardly consider myself or my guild 'hardcore'.

[Arbs]

Some of it is nostalgia.

All of it is opinion, one way or another.

None of it is actual verifiable and testable fact that applies to all.

Things change. If the game eight years on were very much the same game as vanilla there would be arguments about that.

Prbly the best comment here,

There are things we miss (TM vs SS, Old AV, Old Guilds, Friends & Memories) But there are things that have evolved for the better. Cookie cutter builds prbly one of the worse thing in WoW is a thing of the past. Yes the current talent needs some improvements, but it is on the right track. World PvP is there and alive, its just not shown. I had huge Horde Vs Alliance Battle in Hellfire Level 90 Horde Level 90 Alliance in the end we won & captured Honor Hold.

There are things I am glad are gone from WoW aswell, but not is perfect and the market evolves & so does WoW.

MoanaLissa said it really good, Not all changes are good, but most are for the better .

I'm not saying that. I'm just saying I dislike LFG, LFR, and dailys. Pet battles, Arenas, BGs, Mount/Pet/Achievement farming, and Challenge modes are all things I enjoy outside of raiding.

I don't like LFR either, I think it shouldn't drop loot, but I do enjoy LFD as it quick easy & I can get my valor cap faster & focus on more of the things I like to do. Like get my 50 Lesser charms for the week, pet battles, challenge modes.

[Boogums]

I'm not saying that. I'm just saying I dislike LFG, LFR, and dailys. Pet battles, Arenas, BGs, Mount/Pet/Achievement farming, and Challenge modes are all things I enjoy outside of raiding.

And you don't have to do LFR, LFG, and dailies. How does them being in the game make the game worse than before?

[Deleted]

The game is much more immersive in Vanilla, but it's not as fun.

[cFortyfive]

A lot of people were, by my reckoning, considering I got into a significant tussle about once a week in each contested area.

And the plateau was a significant mob farming area, which means people there probably aren't going to be flying around (which they had to in order to go there), which means flying mounts are irrelevant and if there's areas of choice mob farming that people DON'T take advantage of to start a fight, then that's their own fault.

Well we were slaughtering endless streams of allies trying to farm crap. Or the island around sunwell. Skettis. Each saw more battles than those pvp objectives and were the reason for nice guild rivalries. Anyways.
Not sure what the flying whatever part is supposed to mean.

[Paladin885]

I played vanilla.
I raided.
I pvp grinded.
I do not wear nostalgia goggles.
I do not miss [most of] it.


I like having 3 specs that function (aka viable) and when I play my rogue I like being able to use 100% of my skill tree instead of just 20%.
I like that my paladin has more stuff to do instead of judging and auto attacking while in combat.
I like that when I raid I only have to wait a few minutes for a few people to AFK instead of 30 going afk and the raid has to wait for an hour between pulls.
I like that tanks generate threat.
I like that you can actually do shit and don't need: A) attunement, B) a key, C) the flight path, or D) fire/frost/shadow/nature resistance

[unholytestament]

Fly mounts was a huge reason for the decline of World PvP, a lot of it started with a gank from someone, who then got his friends, then the ganker got his friends, and the fight just kept growing. Stranglethorn Vale is called Gankelthorn Vale for a reason.

I remember Halaa, and I remember quite a few fun fights that we had there, I would very much want to see more such things added to the game. But I still don't think fly mounts has any place in such an area, nor do I think a player should be able to flee so easily, especially when he started the fight.

The decline of world PVP came about because of battlegrounds not flying mounts. When an area for structured PVP was added where people could get rewards the only people left to enjoy gankathons were the people scared of a fair fight.

[Theendgamelv3]

Talent trees were pretty much cookie cutter, if you didn't have the right spec, you were laughed at and made fun of and called a baddie. With the new talent trees, a lot of the choices aren't horrible AND it offers flexibility for certain fights and situations. For example, if there is a heavy AoE fight for a hunter, he could easily switch glaive toss to barrage. You couldn't really do that with the old system, or at least do it in a convenient matter. Talent trees in MoP are A LOT better than the old ones, well for hunters anyways.

Traveling in MoP......the majority of levels while leveling, you don't fly. 1-60, you DON'T fly. Also if you didn't read, recently they fixed it where you have to find FPs again. Also you DON'T FLY between lvls 85-90 on Pandaria. That is 65 lvls of content where you DON'T fly. If you want to argue that you mainly fly in MoP at 90, this is true of EVERY expansion. This isn't a MoP problem.

You can still Dungeon like Vanilla if you so choose. With that said, I don't know about you, but I hated looking for tanks and healers. I hated when I got 2 other dps look for players and then a hour later 1 of the dps has to leave and does and you have to look for MORE players. Friends and guildies aren't 100% always on.

Ok....are you telling me that all the world firsts since LFR was made was done in LFR? I am PRETTY sure you can gather your guild together and raid without using LFR. I am pretty sure that this is possible. Most of your examples aren't very good. At least with doing dungeons, you have some kind of argument cause it can create a better community and it makes the world more alive with people traveling to dungeons, but the rest....no.

As for world pvp, anyone arguing this doesn't do dailies in this expansion. You can't fly on the new 5.2 island so there is no big way to get away. Even before that, I was being ganked by the opposing factions while doing dailies that everyone hated.

[Noorri]

By that definition, considering everything we do is in the past, even if it's in the past couple of seconds, everything we know and remember is nostalgia.

No. People don't have bittersweet yearnings for stuff that happened a few seconds ago.

What the OP is annoyed by is probably more the case of people claiming nostalgia is clouding your judgement and you mostly only remember the good things, and have forgotten the bad, as humans tend to do over time.

I agree.

[Arbs]

And you don't have to do LFR, LFG, and dailies. How does them being in the game make the game worse than before?

Rof no, she/he is just saying what she/he doesn't like, but does submit what she/he does like about the game.