1.3 million sub drop

[Osmeric]

Vivendi has been trying to do this for about a year now.

They've been trying to sell their stake in ATVI. Leveraging up is a very different maneuver.

[Mormolyce]

Blizzard themselves stated that there has been less engagement by casual players want to know why.....because MOP is not fucken casual. Normal mode being the most hard its been since WOTLK the gating of gear behind Valor/Rep. treating daily's like they are some awesome peace of content lack of new dungeons. Shit RNG in both LFR and Scenario.

Dailies are completely optional now, even if you want to be optimal. Wrath didn't even have LFR or scenarios.

People complained that they don't release enough content fast enough, so they shipped MoP with a fuckload of content to keep everyone busy, then people complain there's too much content and it's not casual enough.

---------- Post added 2013-05-15 at 02:53 AM ----------

You could throw yourself at the mercy of pugs who demanded ilvls equivalent of what the raid dropped.
You could get through the first 3-4 bosses of ICC, and then everyone would simply disband. Full clears weren't being pugged until well into the stacking buff point.
You could pug ToC up to the champs, where half the group would leave after a wipe (if your healers didn't simply leave before the pull)
You could grind rep for vendors inside ICC (considered mandatory at the time).
You could watch tanks leave after the first hHoR boss if they even stayed that long, everyone leave when Oculus was the daily, 1/3 the folks leave if the daily was CoT.
You could buy crafted epics for .. oh, about 8-10k per piece (a large sum of gold for a casual player at the time)

Haha, I remember all of that!

I also remember the nightmare of trying to pug 25m content. I remember on several occasions sitting in ICC with 24/25 people waiting to pug one holy pally for like an hour! And that god awful lockout system where your typical failpug that left you on 3/12 would prevent you from getting into a new pug the rest of the week.

[Deleted]

Osmeric. This is a question for you and a serious one:

do you think that 26.02% of guilds, who have entered ToT, killing Lei Shen on normal is too little? Do you think the .32% of guilds who have killed Lei Shen on heroic is too little? Where would you like the numbers to be (roughly)?

[HeedmySpeed]

Never said that all the reasons was the same but every time someone states there reasons someone subbed shuts it down.

Blizzard themselves stated that there has been less engagement by casual players want to know why.....because MOP is not fucken casual. Normal mode being the most hard its been since WOTLK the gating of gear behind Valor/Rep. treating daily's like they are some awesome peace of content lack of new dungeons. Shit RNG in both LFR and Scenario.

Rep being a pain in the ass to grind for to get the gear that is gated with valor behind the rep.


All the gating bullshit they have done in MOP is far from casual friendly but now feel free to say that casual's want everything handed to them when in fact they don't.

because that is how this argument turns out people like you get told why casual's are pissed then you pull the you want everything handed to you bs statement.

What else will keep the casuals subscribed? Clearly gameplay isn't enough since they wouldn't be quitting regardless of the difficulty of the content.
They don't like challenges and they don't like time commitment.

Not only that but all want content to be done in THEIR own time. Do you know how variable that is?

So really the lesser evil here is "time commitment" but now the problem is they feel it's too much.
And it's fine to turn to the Heroic "elitists" and say "don't like, don't do it!"

But to tell them "don't like dailies? don't do it! they're optional!" is fucking heresey.

[Windfury]

People complained that they don't release enough content fast enough, so they shipped MoP with a fuckload of content to keep everyone busy, then people complain there's too much content and it's not casual enough.

What people who say that are ignoring is that it's different people complaining. The people who stayed through wrath hated the cata changes, the people who were still around at the end of cata weren't going to like what happened in MOP. People who stayed were mostly ok with the way things were, the radical changes changed things they liked, in an attempt to bring back people who left. It's like they're constantly playing catch up and alienating their current player base to do it.

Personally I subbed continuously from release to mists on multiple accounts, and then have unsubbed and then resubbed for a month here and there throughout mists and logged in as I've missed my guild/ingame friends. People can say dailies are optional all they want, but 'dailies' was definitely what I wrote in the box when I unsubbed. Killing 800 LFR bosses (across multiple toons) and only getting 3 drops when that's the only way we're given to catch up didn't help either. Yes, they made/are making changes, but not before I was too burnt out on those things to care. Can't say what everyone else's reasons were but those were mine.

eta: although to be fair it's all more complicated than that. My luck was terrible, so all the RNG based stuff screwed me, that left me dailies as the only way to catch up, but I hated questing to start with so dailies killed the game for me. I certainly don't expect blizzard to cater to me, but I'm not going to hang around paying money for something that's making me miserable.

[rebecca191]

What people who say that are ignoring is that it's different people complaining. The people who stayed through wrath hated the cata changes, the people who were still around at the end of cata weren't going to like what happened in MOP. People who stayed were mostly ok with the way things were, the radical changes changed things they liked, in an attempt to bring back people who left. It's like they're constantly playing catch up and alienating their current player base to do it.

Well, not exactly. I loved most of vanilla, BC, WotLK. I HATED Cata. I stayed til the end because I didn't want to lose my raid spot in a top 50 US guild if the next expac looked good. I decided not to try MoP for a variety of factors. It was probably the right choice. I still miss WoW though. I'd consider another expansion if it returned to the type of storyline I liked and had less forcing of hard mode raiders into easy content like LFR (Cata) or dailies/reps (MOP), but I may not have the RL time to play hardcore and I hate playing casually.

[Osmeric]

Killing 800 LFR bosses (across multiple toons) and only getting 3 drops when that's the only way we're given to catch up didn't help either.

The 800 is surely an exaggeration. The chance of getting only 3 drops in 800 kills is fantastically low.

[Windfury]

The 800 is surely an exaggeration. The chance of getting only 3 drops in 800 kills is fantastically low.

No. It really isn't an exaggeration at all.

[Rhamses]

I'm wondering why people who don't play the game anymore care so much about the sub numbers.

It's pretty strange.

[Mormolyce]

The 800 is surely an exaggeration. The chance of getting only 3 drops in 800 kills is fantastically low.

Maybe he means 3 drops he can use. I had VP gear in a lot of slots before LFR gear dropped for them.

In fact I'm one piece off having all the VP gear and I've only gotten a handful of upgrades.

[ringpriest]

Leveraging up, here we come!

After Vivendi forces ATVI to go greatly into debt and disgorge that money in a large special dividend, ATVI is going to be picking and scratching for all the cash flow it can find.

Not that I doubt that Vivendi can and would loot Activision-Blizzard like that, but such an action should be illegal. Not that it is in practice

[Windfury]

Maybe he means 3 drops he can use. I had VP gear in a lot of slots before LFR gear dropped for them.

In fact I'm one piece off having all the VP gear and I've only gotten a handful of upgrades.

No, I mean three drops sum total (all on my shaman). 16 bosses in the tier x 14 weeks before I gave up x 6 toons. Obviously I didn't do it all every week on every toon, and release was staggered. But I religiously did it on 3, mostly out of sheer bloody mindedness by the last few weeks, as best as I can figure 800 bosses before I quit is pretty accurate. fwiw as I said I've bounced in and out since I officially unsubbed, I have tried it again and did get some drops since the increased drop rate in 5.2 over Easter. But I'm just too sick of it to bother now.

Anyway that's really beside the point, and is basically me just having a bitch because I can, we all know RNG can be rubbish at times.

eta funny thing is though that was only part of why I quit. The proverbial final straw was that I had to do dailies that I absolutely hated (I hate questing so much I leveled all my toons in Av this xpac) to be able to spend the one thing I had gotten out of all that time and energy (i.e. my Valor). I dug my heels in at that. You can expect people to put up with a bit of something they dislike to get something good at the end - but that end reward has to be worth it, or the misery has to be less. They got the balance right out for me, it just stopped being worth it.

[Deleted]

Open your eyes. People want to play Warcraft, not Kung Fu panda.

That has nothing to do with it. People want to play dungeons, not dailies .

[nooty]

i don't really care about numbers much but looking at how old game is and how players have turned game into casual bot with depressing attitude in pve and pvp there is no point playing the game .

Even good guilds are finding hard to find good players as goods have left or have no time to play .

[Pann]

Not that I doubt that Vivendi can and would loot Activision-Blizzard like that, but such an action should be illegal. Not that it is in practice

Isn't it ironic that had Bobby Kotick, often touted as the most evil man in gaming on these boards, had got his way and been able to purchase Blizzard outright none of this would even be possible. I guess that now this is on the cards that ATVI have been unable to secure finance or it would have been worse for them to buy them self from Vevendi.

[Deleted]

Not that I doubt that Vivendi can and would loot Activision-Blizzard like that, but such an action should be illegal. Not that it is in practice

Last year when Vivendi had mentioned that they are considering selling Acti-Blizzard there was a very good thread on here discussing the possible corporate decisions open to Vivendi. Quite a few people with business backgrounds contributed and they discussed the option of getting Acti-Blizzard in debt.

The way it works is when a profitable business cannot be sold, usually because they cant find a buyer for it, then they will use the companies perfect history to take out as many loans as possible without the intention to pay them back. Then this cash is moved into the company which needs it (Vivendi) as well as any other capital they can 'suck' out of the company. In Acti-Blizzards case sadly there are not enough gaming companies out there who can afford to buy it and that puts it at risk of such a business decision from Vivendi (i cant remember the correct business terminology for this action).

Vivendi is heavily in debt and needs access to capital fast and thats what puts Acti-Blizzard in a tricky position.

[Deleted]

I'm not really surprised, I don't expect for it to be dropping as much as this for some time again though. Blizzard will probably come up with something else that will keep the audience entertained for a while.

[Noxina]

That has nothing to do with it. People want to play dungeons, not dailies .

Then do dungeons? No one is forcing you to do daily quests, I'm in a 12/12N raid guild, and I do perfectly fine without doing a single daily quest. Yeah, I dont get my 3 tokens a week, but meh.

And 3 drops on 800 kills? I do not believe that what so ever. Though, it is possible, I went 3 weeks of clearing ToT LFR on my alt before I got my first drop there.


I dont see what all the ruckus about 1.3mill subs drop.. Did your server suddenly die? I havent noticed a thing about it, except all my IRL friends quit (though that was mainly because they just couldnt find the time to play anymore). As long as you can find a decent guild (If thats what you want), hunt rare mobs etc(Should be easier now with less players around, huh?), do LFR, LFD and Random BGs - is there any reason to complain? The game havent changed at all, even though we lost like 10% of the player base. Let Blizzard pull their hair while trying to figure out how they can get back their players so they can earn their cash.
(And I bet many of those accounts was "Bot-accounts", seems like Blizz have been harder against those lately. Atleast players in my guild started to get suspansions all of a sudden on their bot accounts. And they didnt do anything different than what they have always been doing..)

[Windfury]

And 3 drops on 800 kills? I do not believe that what so ever. Though, it is possible, I went 3 weeks of clearing ToT LFR on my alt before I got my first drop there.

Well you're welcome to go back through my previous posts. I've mentioned it repeatedly and I'm sure consistently, because I'm an honest person generally. If after that you really want to believe that I've spent the last 7 months concocting some sort of elaborate scheme based around this story for some reason I guess there's not much I can do to stop you.

[Deleted]

Well you're welcome to go back through my previous posts. I've mentioned it repeatedly and I'm sure consistently, because I'm an honest person generally. If after that you really want to believe that I've spent the last 7 months concocting some sort of elaborate scheme based around this story for some reason I guess there's not much I can do to stop you.

Or you've told the story so much that you now believe your own lie.