Forces of Chaos vs Burning Legion

[ParanoiD84]

Tbh, even Abaddon could defeat Sargeras, and compared to some Daemons, he isn't that much. The guy cannot be harmed unless it is by a psyker of purest heart and unlimited power (The Emperor basically...). So Sargeras couldn't do jack crap to him, and that is just Abaddon the Despoiler (his daemon weapon would destroy Sargeras in a nano-second as well).

Sure, Sargeras is powerful, but against the Champion level peeps of Chaos, he is nothing. Just a big fiery giant with an atttitude problem.

Sargeras would be a fine addition in the chaos army, maby the chaos gods would give him more power

[khalltusk]

You can say abaddon would defeat sargeras without using his arms

XD, You could say compared to him Sargeras is quite handful.

One day the Emperor will return with none other than Boreale at his side. The emperor will adopt Astartes approved male pattern baldness while Boreale Shall inheret the emperors long flowing hair.

*pukes* sorry thats too much even for me.

[Arrashi]

XD, You could say compared to him Sargeras is quite handful.

One day the Emperor will return with none other than Boreale at his side. The emperor will adopt Astartes approved male pattern baldness while Boreale Shall inheret the emperors long flowing hair.

*pukes* sorry thats too much even for me.

Sargeras is powerfull foe, any help from chaos gods may be handy. Still abaddon would probably have sargeras ass handed to him.

[khalltusk]

You could say, He is far from hArmless

[Arrashi]

You could say, He is far from hArmless

Well being captain of 1st company of luna wolves abaddon sure know handfull of tricks.

[Dhrizzle]

I see a ultramarine pony and guess you are disciple of ward ? Anyway just because /tg/ have distance to lore doesnt mean we "mangle" it.
As for chaos vs sargeras, malal was walking exterminatus and chaos god had little problem raping him all together. And more important there unlike sargeras who will end up one shotted by anduin anyway, chaos gods have sue resistance level 9000 making them immune for characters using deus ex machinas and plot armor.

My avatar donned the war-plate of the 13th in honour of Captain Titus, but do find most of the Mat Ward hate to be vastly overrated and hideously inaccurate (I stand by my description of mangled).

And on more serious note: Should chaos gods really wanted to kill him they would simply flood him with greater daemons. 100 lords of change would be able to basically vaporize him before he could even say "That not fair".

If that were possible for the Chaos gods the galaxy would be a very different place, it takes an extremely powerful threat or valuable prize to bring the full focus of a Chaos god to the material plane and even then they can not simply extend their will in to the galaxy without restrictions. Even if it were somehow possible, Sargeras's power would eclipse that of the Lords of Change. Daemons and greater daemons are horrendously powerful on a mortal scale but Titans exist on a cosmic level.

I agree that, theoretically, any one of the Chaos gods has the power to annihilate Sargeras and the entire Burning Legion. However it is doubtful the Dark Titan would draw their attention to an extent where they desire and can achieve that outcome, especially as Sargeras in many ways exemplifies the way of Chaos.

Sargeras is only immune to mortal made weapons. Practically everything Chaos churns out is either deamon possessed or manufactured by Daemons/Immortal beings.

Basically, even a lowly Possessed Marine with a Power Sword could hurt him. This is before we go into anything else, such as *truly* immortal Chaos Gods with limitless power, countless billions of daemons, Chaos Marine chapters, psykers and whatnot.

Most of the weapons used by the legions of Chaos are mortal forged - even your Possessed's power sword (and you could hardly call one who has experienced the holy fusion of warp and flesh "lowly") was probably created in a Mechanicum forge, likely by someone loyal to the Emperor. Daemon forged weapons are rare and greatly prized gifts for proven champions. Whilst Chaos has many legions of daemons and fallen Astartes the hard part is getting them all together without internal strife and conflict tearing the war-host apart.

Also, something people have forgotten here. Sargeras got corrupted (to an extent, not sure how to explain it), by his long journey through darkness and whatnot. Going from a noble titan to an evil one. Your seriously going to put this guy against the masters of manipulation Tzeentch and Slaanesh? They alone would have him licking windows and wanking into sock within minutes, before we even bring out the big guns.

The Titans come across as a fusion between Old Ones, C'Tan and Eldar gods. The corruption of Sargeras - a cosmic entity wrapped in a living metal skin - mirrors the way strife in the galaxy gave rise to the Ruinous Powers, he is in effect a microcosm of Chaos even down to his Khornate features clearly being dominant. Tzeentch and Slaanesh have few hooks to manipulate Sargeras, particularly as his aims are aligned with theirs in many ways.

[khalltusk]

Well being captain of 1st company of luna wolves abaddon sure know handfull of tricks.

Thats just pointing fingers at the luna wolves.

Ok OK I will get my coat!

What if the Legion faced off against Boreale? What would he say?

[Arrashi]

If mortal forged weapons are such a problem, just send fulgrim with his magical sword. It worked against rawbutt girlyman (and he is our spiritual liege mind you) so it will have no problem with sargeras. And if that isnt enough, just lure draigo out of warp and let him own sargeras so hard he will wear paper bag on his head for a rest of his life, just like a poor mortarion.

And khalltusk, no words can describe that:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LNK5-uE5JFg

[Dhrizzle]

If mortal forged weapons are such a problem, just send fulgrim with his magical sword. It worked against rawbutt girlyman (and he is our spiritual liege mind you) so it will have no problem with sargeras. And if that isnt enough, just lure draigo out of warp and let him own sargeras so hard he will wear paper bag on his head for a rest of his life, just like a poor mortarion.

The thing is whilst he's fully immune to mortal weapons, he's also mostly immune to magic ones (as well as being fully immune to magic). Also I never had you down as an Ultramarines (or successor Chapter) player.

I'm not sure if the powers of the Grey Knights would work against a non-warp daemon so Draigo may not be a wise choice, if you have to turn to Imperial forces to bring down Sargeras I'd send Russ.

[ParanoiD84]

C'Tan

I love the C'Tan shards btw, Outsider, Nightbringer, Void Dragon, Deceiver etc

Nightbringer gorges on stars and have destroyed entire star systems and its mighty scythe has feasted on the deaths of civilizations, lol so way over the top but i like it.

[Arrashi]

The thing is whilst he's fully immune to mortal weapons, he's also mostly immune to magic ones (as well as being fully immune to magic). Also I never had you down as an Ultramarines (or successor Chapter) player.

I'm not sure if the powers of the Grey Knights would work against a non-warp daemon so Draigo may not be a wise choice, if you have to turn to Imperial forces to bring down Sargeras I'd send Russ.

Robot girlyman is so awesome he is spiritual liege even for traitor legions, im sure angron and especially alpharius love him. How would such a little emperor child like me refuse to bathe in his glory ? Hell why would legions revere they own primarchs where we have our spiritual liege ?

[Kassadin]

First and foremost, I'm not sure why people are bringing Sargeras and Chaos gods into the argument; the OP's post was entirely based on Kiljaeden vs Daemon Prince; backed by their legions.

[Arrashi]

First and foremost, I'm not sure why people are bringing Sargeras and Chaos gods into the argument; the OP's post was entirely based on Kiljaeden vs Daemon Prince; backed by their legions.

Because then, legion stands simply no chance, without support of sargeras they have absolutely nothing to not get crushed by legions of daemons and chaos space marines.

Off topic:
Totalbiscuit about WH40k MMO:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=afS5dYMUvJA

[ParanoiD84]

Off topic:
Totalbiscuit about WH40k MMO:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=afS5dYMUvJA

Gets popcorn, thanks i missed that.

[Verdugo]

More from the article about Sargeras:
He is fully clad in a burning suit of molten, black armor, and his skin cracked with veins of magma. Wildly dancing flames surround his head and form a thick mass of hair and a sweeping beard. A pair of horns extends from his forehead and a pair of demonic wings lie on his back.
---------------
Those listed powers are also only what we have seen so far. It is highly speculated he has many more abilities as well. Part of his known fighting style is also making massive amounts of copies of himself.

For how long he could use those abilities against aptly named "Lords of Change".

[Dhrizzle]

With fairness, a Chaos Space marine, whilst powerful, in the grand scheme of the Chaos ods arsenal, they are pretty lowly. Easy way around that then, just unleash lesser daemons and possessed, and they can use their hands and claw Sargeras to ribbons. They have unlimited number and are immortal, thus, even if it takes eons, Sargeras would eventually tire.

As for the point of Chaos being unable to exist in the realm, well the question is "Chaos vs Burning Legion". If BL is allowed to use their uber powered gribble-monkey (Sargeras), it is only fair that Chaos can use the big four. The fact they would make short work of him is irrelevant, it is both powers against each other in full force, not "Let's cherry pick what we like" (not saying you are, but a lot of peeps in this thread seem to be doing so...)

Sargeras has a vested interest in the material realm which the Chaos Gods do not, I'm not restricting them based on any notions of fairness but simply by their own nature as presented in the 40k fluff. Outside of the warp massive daemonic incursions are rare, and usually require mortal champions gaining the favour of their patrons to bring about (which usually involves battling other champions of Chaos). The Burning Legion on the other hand is portrayed as a more focused force, an interstellar scourge that bears more relation to a hive fleet of Tyranids than the unpredictable armies of Chaos.

I think your speculating a lot regarding the titan's and to what they are. The two mythos are so disparate and different from each other, you cannot make comparisions of that kind. With regards to manipulation, well, Sargeras has already fallen as I said. Slaanesh and Tzeentch are the epitome of manipulation. I am more than sure they would find whatever it is that floats his boat so to speak...

What floats his boat is chaos, and his favourite means is destruction. Tzeentch may be able to nudge him in directions (although outright manipulation probably won't be needed) but Slaanesh has as much chance of seducing Sargeras as (s)he does a champion of Khorne.

Whilst Sargeras is powerful to my mind, the context of putting into Warhammer (and the rest of the BL) just isn't fair. They are incredibly weak compared to everything Chaos has in it's (unfathomable and unlimited) arsenal. Whilst you can list Sargeras' powers, it would be impossible to do so for the Chaos God's, they are just too incomprehensible. The fact that they would no doubt ally with each other if there was some proverbial crossover of WoW/Warhammer is irrelevant, as that isn't the topic at hand.

If we consider basic humans to be the same in Warhammer and Warcraft, demons and daemons seem to plow through them with equivalent ease and I wouldn't like to put money on how a fight between them would go. The Warcraft games make them seem much softer than they are because we're all such big damn heroes, but in the fluff they're all pretty badass and dangerous.

Within the context of Chaos in the 41st millenium; the Burning Legion would be an incredibly large, well organised war-band with unique troops and capabilities and an amazingly powerful warlord. Unless Sargeras were considered a potent threat to Chaos (unlikely given their similar natures), or a most valuable prize (quite likely, but doubtful any one faction would tolerate another benefiting so attempts to claim this prize would likely fall to infighting before too long) no Chaos warlord would be able to muster the force to eradicate the Burning Legion.

the magic thing is also hard to describe, as in Warhammer, it is warp powered, and that is, to all extents, a living force of nature, and an extension of the Chaos Gods if you will, unlike WoW where magic is drawn from an unintelligent aether. I would personally disregard all contexts of magic in this occasion, as it is too loose for us to describe, unless we assume all warp power is magic, in which case, Tzeentch still has enough juice up his sleeve to hurt Sargeras.

I've always considered the Twisting Nether to be equivalent to the Warp before the Old Ones started dabbling in it and polluted it with Eldar gods. Both magic systems seem to have no upper limits, with Warcrafts being more stable and safer to use thanks to the lack of malevolence. The question is would demons still be able to benefit from a magical other-place corrupted with daemons?

To my mind, Chaos wins, by knockout in the first round, and goes back to the corner to eat ice cream.

To my mind Chaos wouldn't want to win by knockout. Look at the Orks, they don't serve the gods but simply by existing they feed Chaos. The Legion would likely do the same.

---------- Post added 2013-06-13 at 06:43 PM ----------

Robot girlyman is so awesome he is spiritual liege even for traitor legions, im sure angron and especially alpharius love him. How would such a little emperor child like me refuse to bathe in his glory ? Hell why would legions revere they own primarchs where we have our spiritual liege ?

The Emperor's Children strive for personal perfection whereas Roboute Guillliman strove to devise perfect systems. Angron just wants to destroy and has no reason to embrace Guilliman's philosophies. Alpharius would probably like the works of the Ultramarines most, but more as a rewarding challenge to break them. Seriously dude, 4Chan is a bad place for fluff.

---------- Post added 2013-06-13 at 06:45 PM ----------

First and foremost, I'm not sure why people are bringing Sargeras and Chaos gods into the argument; the OP's post was entirely based on Kiljaeden vs Daemon Prince; backed by their legions.

To quote the OP;

Both have an endless army of demon's and are masters of corrupting and burning worlds could be a pretty fun match up.

That would result in demons and daemons clashing forever on a burning corrupt world. Fun as it sounds those things are ten-a-penny in the 40k universe so we escalated the conflict.

[razorfire]

I love the C'Tan shards btw, Outsider, Nightbringer, Void Dragon, Deceiver etc

Nightbringer gorges on stars and have destroyed entire star systems and its mighty scythe has feasted on the deaths of civilizations, lol so way over the top but i like it.

as a loyal necrons fan I ask you to avoid using the insulting term "shards"...it's kind of like calling khorne a daemonette. it burns in my will to live.

[ParanoiD84]

as a loyal necrons fan I ask you to avoid using the insulting term "shards"...it's kind of like calling khorne a daemonette. it burns in my will to live.

Haha my bad not that into eldar/necron, more off a nid and ork guy, Will Gods do?

[Arrashi]

Haha my bad not that into eldar/necron, more off a nid and ork guy, Will Gods do?

"Incredibly powerfull being reduced to pokemon" is more fitting Also Gork and Mork are betta godz !!!

And calling khorne daemonette would obviously be bad.... its khornette !!!

Also Drhizzle you seem to have some unresonable hatred toward 4chan, given that you keep invoking it (wonder if it has something to do with most boards banning MLP shit on them), but seriously why so angry they are just group of fans.

And saying that alpharius would like anything about ultramarines is a little controversial given the fact that rawbutt and his smurfs are the reason he joined heresy.

[ParanoiD84]

"Incredibly powerfull being reduced to pokemon" is more fitting

Fair enough