[Mage] *OFFICIAL* Help my DPS thread

[solracel]

ARCANE
hi im preeety new to raiding and just not leveling in general, yesterday i got my first garosh kill and guess what i got (gold).
but i was really, really dissapointed with my dps. and i felt bad so someone told me to come here.


here's the imgur recount screenshot: imgur.com/haaxkYc
and my armory is really really outdated so im going to post the askmrrobot one: askmrrobot.com/wow/gear/usa/illidan/ravenstorm
anything is welcomed and i really hope to get better

[LocNess]

ARCANE
hi im preeety new to raiding and just not leveling in general, yesterday i got my first garosh kill and guess what i got (gold).
but i was really, really dissapointed with my dps. and i felt bad so someone told me to come here.


here's the imgur recount screenshot: imgur.com/haaxkYc
and my armory is really really outdated so im going to post the askmrrobot one: askmrrobot.com/wow/gear/usa/illidan/ravenstorm
anything is welcomed and i really hope to get better

Unfortunately, I cannot find your character anywhere currently with the armory issues (it is not loading for me at least). Does your guild run any logs on worldoflogs or warcraftlogs?

Anyway, if the recount is for Garrosh you want Living Bomb, not Nether Tempest. Nether Tempest is generally for fights with multiple targets where the Bomb can hit other targets like Protectors. Arcane is also not going to go well at a low item level. Most Mages will see it improve at 560 ilevel or higher. I recommend going Frost as it is the easiest and most balanced of the 3 specs and is more than good enough for raiding.

[bringthepain]

HI all, hope some of u will be able to help me on increasing my dps, specifically single target dps on H Garrosh.
Trying to push p4 without getting a 2nd empowered whirling. so any tips on that will be appreciated.

Spec : 582ilvl Frost
Armoury : http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...ersie/advanced
WCL : www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/rhV4xw1aQzHKfXGd

Thanks in advance.

[Deleted]

Hello, I think I need help with my dps as arcane. I'm raiding with players having slightly lower iLvl than mine, and very often I'm 3rd or 4th in dps and it's bugging me. Also I can't find anything in my logs (except for not using dps cooldowns on cd). Recently I've joined hc raiding guild and I want to improve my gameplay.
My armory: eu .battle.net/wow/en/character/burning-legion/arivald/advanced
My logs: www .warcraftlogs.com/reports/ajrWmG4d6V2MzXNw
(can't post links)
I also have a problem with multitarget fights (shamans and protectors). What is our opener? I feel that I'm wasting too much time trying to multidot everything on procs, should I start with singletarget opener?

[Shangalar]

I started by looking at Iron Juggernaut and you seem to have done everything well there. I would possibly just suggest (non dps related), since you have Glyph of Evocation that during Siege phases you position yourself and cast Rune under you because it heals you. But as I said, that's not a dps thing.

One thing that does affect your dps a lot is the fact that you don't have a Heroic or Heroic Warforged weapon (and some of the other dps do) and your KTT is normal. Weapons and trinkets are a big part of dps.

On the Fallen Protectors and Shaman I use the following opener:
1. Rune, Mirror Image, Potion
2. Arcane Blast
3. Put Bomb on everything (I use NT on Protectors and LB on Shaman, but I play 25-man so we use the separated tactic on Shaman, that's 3 NTs on Protectors and 3 LBs on Shaman)
4. Blast to 4 Charges
5. DPS Macro
6. Protectors: normal single target with NT refreshing, Shaman: Missiles, Barrage, refresh LBs, Barrage, continue until wolves are dead

What I see from your Fallen Protectors log is that you have only 85% uptime on Living Bomb and that's a fight that practically allows 100%, and only 91% uptime on Rune of Power (which isn't bad per se, but it's not that much of a movement fight + during Sun's Desperation phases you can precast Rune in the shield and blink to it).

And finally, with some more gear you'll get more Haste which will play an important role in your bomb damage and dps rotation overall.

[Haytur]

Our Arcane mage is having some issues and was wondering if this is a normal thing or if there is something that can be done to improve it. Typically he is last on the meters for transition phase and its kinda hurting us. He does 2ish mil where everyone else does closer to 6. Is that typical? If not any suggestions?

[LocNess]

Our Arcane mage is having some issues and was wondering if this is a normal thing or if there is something that can be done to improve it. Typically he is last on the meters for transition phase and its kinda hurting us. He does 2ish mil where everyone else does closer to 6. Is that typical? If not any suggestions?

Do you have any logs you could post for us? That way we could see what he is specifically doing and give our words of advice.

[Deleted]

Well I tell you he does something wrong.... he could double his dmg (in transition phase).... (I self play arcane and got garrosh hc down)
first guess would be: Does he have 4 charges an 2 AM Proccs when transition beginns (yeah it is somtimes a pain in the ass to save the proccs and can't go full dmg on garrosh and so on..... but pff)? this alone does 2 mil dmg, so I guess he could start improving here ^^ From my experience.. Dmg in transition phase > dmg on garrosh in p2

p.s. I never use Arcane Power in transition phase (glyphed) and got 4.5 mil+ every try/kill

[Deleted]

-snip-

If this is 10 man you are talking about, i can tell its kinda typical to do 3-4mln, maybe 5mln if u get some lucky crits and AM procs, but he don't know what exactly to do to improve his damage done for the transition.

Some tips (already given) - tell him to save 2 Arcane Missile procs, to save 4 charges and to discharge it only at the second pack of adds, to use 4p (if he isn't), and to unglyph Arcane power. Arcane power should be off cooldown exactly for the transition phase so he can use it right away. Tell him to not waste time to DoT anything. Just raw Arcane Blast and Arcane Missiles casting.
Another tip you can give him is to use Blazing speed and the glyph that give Blink 2 charges. That way he can reach 2nd set of adds in 2 seconds, which will give him the extra time he need to postion himself for the 2nd set of adds so he can maximize his dps during transition. Another tip you can give him is while he pass thru middle pack at the door (assuming still some adds alive) to spam Arcane Explosion while running. If he is Lucky enough he might get extra Arcane Missile charge, which will improve his damage done there.

IF he is still doing low damage on the transition force him to use his second potion there. From my personal experience as arcane mage i saw that dealing with 1st trastion is the key to kill Garrosh and if you fail your group, you should better sacrifice more to make sure the damn transition will be dealt with properly if you want the kill. Screw the damage meter if you want your shiny gear and mount!

[sdracklryeg]

Playing Frost

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...acklrye/simple

I'm not sure if I'm doing something wrong, I constantly come near the top in Flex raids (Currently not geared enough to get into normal, I just came back from a 16 month break) but Simcraft says my DPS is way lower than It should be. For example, on a 350 second self buffed Patchwerk ie; Target Dummy It says I should do 218k but I'm only doing about ~180-185k. Is Simcraft just broken and I'm doing fine? Looking through the numbers, It thinks my abilities should be hitting/critting on average about for 50% more damage than they currently are... why?

Here's a video of me on the Target dummy. I'm not playing perfect (I'm aware I didn't pop Mirror Images) but other attempts when I played better didn't yield much better results. What's the go?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hd1ZkbuhIW8

[Deleted]

sdracklryeg the answer is more simple than you think. I didnt bother to watch the video, but i can tell on first sight from where does the diffrence between SimC and your target dummy practice come - you simmed yourself with full raid buffs, flask and food buffs.
In the Option tab there is subtab called "buffs/debuffs" just disable every buff and debuff that you cant provide for yourself and sim yourself again

[sdracklryeg]

sdracklryeg the answer is more simple than you think. I didnt bother to watch the video, but i can tell on first sight from where does the diffrence between SimC and your target dummy practice come - you simmed yourself with full raid buffs, flask and food buffs.
In the Option tab there is subtab called "buffs/debuffs" just disable every buff and debuff that you cant provide for yourself and sim yourself again

No I set it so It was only crit and Int buffs. With full raid buffs the disparity between Sim and reality is the same.

[LocNess]

No I set it so It was only crit and Int buffs. With full raid buffs the disparity between Sim and reality is the same.

Simcraft results are robot perfect results. There is no latency that makes you miss casting for 0.2 seconds, there is no missed proc. It is picture perfect. Even if you hesitate on a proc for a quarter of a second, your DPS just dropped in comparison to Simcraft.

[sdracklryeg]

Simcraft results are robot perfect results. There is no latency that makes you miss casting for 0.2 seconds, there is no missed proc. It is picture perfect. Even if you hesitate on a proc for a quarter of a second, your DPS just dropped in comparison to Simcraft.

I understand that I'm never going to be exactly at the Sim, let alone above it but that's quite a big difference. I did another test and got 200k after 5 minutes. I had an insanely good amount of proc's; It was definitely above average by no merit of my own.

The main problem I have with the sim is It is reporting that my spells should be shitting harder than they actually are.

If you run a Sim of me you get this in the abilities section:
Frostbolt avg Hit damage: 78773
Frostbolt avg Crit damage: 163799

Frostfire bolt avg Hit: 75181
Frostfire bolt avg Crit: 163522

Ice Lance avg hit: 106645
Ice Lance avg Crit: 236589

But after looking at the recount details after a target dummy this is the reality
Frostbolt avg hit: 61913 - only 82.35% of the Sim result
Frostbolt avg crit: 120300 - only 73.44% of the Sim result

Frostfire bolt avg hit: 58143 - only 77.33% of the Sim result
Frostfire bolt avg Crit: 113851 - only 69.62% of the Sim result

Icelance avg hit: 64570 - only 60.55% of the Sim result
Icelance avg crit: 151737 - only 64.14% of the Sim result

Recount numbers: https://imgur.com/zBYwbRd

So as you can see, my abilities are doing no where near what the Sim thinks they should. I have no idea why the hell not, It makes no sense to me - Which is why I'm assuming until someone can explain it that Simcraft is broken. Seeing as on average my abilities are only hitting for about ~70% of what the Sim thinks they should and 185k is only 84.86% of 218k, by that logic I should be out dps'ing the Sim, which is also wrong.

[Komman]

I understand that I'm never going to be exactly at the Sim, let alone above it but that's quite a big difference. I did another test and got 200k after 5 minutes. I had an insanely good amount of proc's; It was definitely above average by no merit of my own.

The main problem I have with the sim is It is reporting that my spells should be shitting harder than they actually are.

If you run a Sim of me you get this in the abilities section:
Frostbolt avg Hit damage: 78773
Frostbolt avg Crit damage: 163799

Frostfire bolt avg Hit: 75181
Frostfire bolt avg Crit: 163522

Ice Lance avg hit: 106645
Ice Lance avg Crit: 236589

But after looking at the recount details after a target dummy this is the reality
Frostbolt avg hit: 61913 - only 82.35% of the Sim result
Frostbolt avg crit: 120300 - only 73.44% of the Sim result

Frostfire bolt avg hit: 58143 - only 77.33% of the Sim result
Frostfire bolt avg Crit: 113851 - only 69.62% of the Sim result

Icelance avg hit: 64570 - only 60.55% of the Sim result
Icelance avg crit: 151737 - only 64.14% of the Sim result

Recount numbers: https://imgur.com/zBYwbRd

So as you can see, my abilities are doing no where near what the Sim thinks they should. I have no idea why the hell not, It makes no sense to me - Which is why I'm assuming until someone can explain it that Simcraft is broken. Seeing as on average my abilities are only hitting for about ~70% of what the Sim thinks they should and 185k is only 84.86% of 218k, by that logic I should be out dps'ing the Sim, which is also wrong.

While there are some suspicions of SimC being inaccurate, damage ranges haven't really been one of them.

The default sim assumes all raid buffs, everything. Are you dummy testing with...
1. All raid buffs and debuffs? This includes not only AB, but flask, food, stats, spell vulnerability on the target, spell haste buff, and skull banner.
2. Pre-pot and potion during the test?
3. All cooldowns? There is a known bug that will cause Ice Lances to report higher in SimC, if you use Glyph of Icy Veins. This is due to an error how the spell is constructed. This doesn't affect overall damage output though.
4. Using every single trick listed in the sim? Aside from the commonly expected tricks with AT and trinkets, there are some unintuitive ones such as camping 1 FoF charge during high haste, or prioritizing BF-FFB over LB refreshes to maximize 2T16 and reduce munching.
5. Is every single one of your Ice Lances under FoF? That is the biggest reason for why you might see smaller numbers.

I'm not saying that the sim is 100% accurate. However, comparing recount average damage per spell against SimC average damage per spell is not a good way to approach this.

[sdracklryeg]

While there are some suspicions of SimC being inaccurate, damage ranges haven't really been one of them.

The default sim assumes all raid buffs, everything. Are you dummy testing with...
1. All raid buffs and debuffs? This includes not only AB, but flask, food, stats, spell vulnerability on the target, spell haste buff, and skull banner.
2. Pre-pot and potion during the test?
3. All cooldowns? There is a known bug that will cause Ice Lances to report higher in SimC, if you use Glyph of Icy Veins. This is due to an error how the spell is constructed. This doesn't affect overall damage output though.
4. Using every single trick listed in the sim? Aside from the commonly expected tricks with AT and trinkets, there are some unintuitive ones such as camping 1 FoF charge during high haste, or prioritizing BF-FFB over LB refreshes to maximize 2T16 and reduce munching.
5. Is every single one of your Ice Lances under FoF? That is the biggest reason for why you might see smaller numbers.

I'm not saying that the sim is 100% accurate. However, comparing recount average damage per spell against SimC average damage per spell is not a good way to approach this.

1. No, just Intellect and Crit buffs. Intellect and Crit buffs are the only ones selected in SimC aswell.

2. Not always but on times I have the boost hasn't been anything to rave about, I've had higher runs where I didn't use any pots simply because of RNG on Procs

3. Yes

4. Yes

5. 1 or 2 might slip through that aren't on FoF over a 5minute fight, human error and all that jazz but otherwise, yes. This would also only really affect Icelance hit averages.

I appreciate the responses but have high doubts that pre-potting and not letting the odd Ice Lance not buffed with FoF go through would make a 40k DPS increase.

[Komman]

1. No, just Intellect and Crit buffs. Intellect and Crit buffs are the only ones selected in SimC aswell.

2. Not always but on times I have the boost hasn't been anything to rave about, I've had higher runs where I didn't use any pots simply because of RNG on Procs

3. Yes

4. Yes

5. 1 or 2 might slip through that aren't on FoF over a 5minute fight, human error and all that jazz but otherwise, yes. This would also only really affect Icelance hit averages.

I appreciate the responses but have high doubts that pre-potting and not letting the odd Ice Lance not buffed with FoF go through would make a 40k DPS increase.

It's been a while since I've looked at the GUI, so I don't really know what "just intellect and crit" looks like, or whether that means all the raid debuffs and skull banner are also deactivated. Can you clarify?

Glyph of Ice Veins, assuming you're using it, is a huge problem. As mentioned, it's a reporting bug. If you want to compare damage ranges directly, you'll need to disable it. Or, check the secondary Frostbolt/Ice Lance/Frostfire Bolt spells and see if the damage ranges match up. I'm not sure recount actually reports that properly though.

[Frost1129]

You sometimes are, and sometimes are not, out DPSing the sim. The output you are most likely referring to is an averaging of whatever number of iterations you decided to run. The DPS you did on your particular run is somewhere on that spectrum.

As for Sim damage numbers being off, removing trinkets/procs and whatnot and then comparing the damage done per hit will be your best bet. Odds of your average matching SimC average after a few attempts are not that great, I would say.

[Juddalenko]

Our Arcane mage is having some issues and was wondering if this is a normal thing or if there is something that can be done to improve it. Typically he is last on the meters for transition phase and its kinda hurting us. He does 2ish mil where everyone else does closer to 6. Is that typical? If not any suggestions?

Make sure he has 4 stacks. He can AE just before you go up to refresh the timer. I usually dot all 3 adds, and just AE each pack I'm assigned to (I need to be in for Arcane a Torrent anyway). If he does that, he'll do 4-5mil comfortably.

[Flazian]

Flazian Area 52 - US
Hey all, my guild recently tried out a merge with a 14/14h 10 man grp (we're a 25H group still working on Thok, well the majority of us now at least--from what I understand my Guild leader has his main in their group but he made his own to play with his friends) and we got absolutely stonewalled at Siegecrafter. First we got to 50% consistently, then 20% then bam, zip, nada. As a preface (or in other words, skip to the next paragraph as this isn't really pertinent but will give you a better understanding as to why I'm so lost at the moment), I'm still on trial with this guild since I've only been in for a week and a half now, but after the first few bosses we pulled I was noticed right away and recommended to represent us for the trial merge as a "strong dps". Now, I've honestly never really progressed before and so I was just shocked that people were making the same fatal mistakes over and over and over despite the fact that I was 8/8H the last time I seriously raided. I've been playing for years, switched mains more times than I can count and so I'm trying to finally stop quitting after a few months into the expansion and returning during the last patch and gain true mastery over a class.

Logs are on Warcraft logs under Defiant Unity, 9/21/14 aka Sunday aka yesterday aka yoloday

That all being said, let's get into the nitty gritty--why am I underperforming here so much? I've been lurking MMO-C's raid & dungeons forums for quite some time and by all means 25H Siegecrafter is supposed to be a walk in the park relative to 10H, and it honestly felt like that for me in terms of surviving mechanics. By the 3rd or 4th pull I had gotten fairly comfortable with RoP placements, sawblade placements, laser kiting, mine kiting, general movement with the raid and the EMP phases, but I can't really pinpoint why I'm so low damage wise. Now, obviously, I shouldn't really care where I am on the charts as long as the boss dies, but I really began to look at logs and go why the hell am I pulling 310k in 581 gear as arcane/frost over 6 mins when one tank who is 14/14h went "why isn't the boss dead yet?"

From what I understand, when this was actually pretty relevant content and people were smashing their heads for 300 attempts and whatnot at 560+ ilvl, killing it on the 12th belt was the goal. Well, at an average ilvl of I'd say 578, we're at 20% on the 10th belt. Obviously, this means the DPS need to step up their game drastically, and I think I'm one of them. I really don't understand what I'm doing wrong here, and it worries me to say that because I've honestly never had trouble before when it came to adjusting my dps. When a boss gave me trouble, I'd look and see bomb uptimes, if procs were somehow going to waste, if I was snapshotting right, not standing in rune, flubbing my opener or just messing up CD usage, stuff like that. Here, I seem to have pretty good uptime on bombs (I couldn't figure out how to see rune uptime though for the pulls I was arcane for), I KNOW I'm snapshotting well as I've gotten that down by now, I'm fairly confident that my openers have been good as long as PBoI decides to proc before AT. Maybe you can chalk it up to actually dealing with a semi-difficult boss for once, or the fact that I was using my arcane gear for when I switched to frost (still doesn't explain my atrocious damage as Arcane), but I really felt like relative to what we needed to accomplish here, I was holding everyone back and just in general very lackluster.

Oh yeah, we always kill missiles by the way except for when there's double mines of course (I think).