Ret Paladins: What Do They Bring To The Table?

[Sunnydee]

didn't read entire OP post cuz im so bloody tired, but are we speaking PVE or PVP? or just in general?

in PVE we bring alot of utility. (you know the list etc)

PVP... well we DO bring good utility... only problem is we're dead before we can use any.. i can be roflstomped by random idiots in bgs nowadays due to they have instant cc's they can chain, kite me even more then i can kite them. do little to no damage ( my TV critts for 55k with wings \o/ ).

idno... pve wise we are in a good spot atm. we do good dps. we provide assistance with raid cds and such. pvp wise its still 5.0 in my eyes..

[Gnarles Malarkey]

Ret Paladins: What Do They Bring To The Table?

A lot of meter linking and unnecessary talking, usually.

Infracted. Please post constructively that contributes to the topic. ~Fhi

[Faesroll]

A lot of meter linking and unnecessary talking, usually.

That's the player, nothing to do with him being a paladin.

OT: I think Rets do competitive dps after the patch, and we still bring a lot of utility.

[Deleted]

When I used to play Ret I was very usefull as support offhealing, BOP all that tings that are usefull , and on certain patches RETs damage was actually quite good ( sometimes all the time , sometimes only when I popped CDS )

Its kind of cool as they are very different from DKS ect its just annoying that they arent a " proper " Full DPS Spec kind of

[Bsod]

being a Paladin is never about getting the highest damage or kill the most enemys.
a good Paladin (Retribution, prot or holy) is keeping his Teammates up and use all cooldown to protect them.

[Well]

There's so much wrong in this post.

-Wotlk "rotation" was not a rotation. It was "hit whatever is available". This is not a good design, and I am glad that it's gone.
-Being able to heal excessively (talking in pvp), HAS to net you lower damage, else why play something else if rets were doing the same sustained dps AND were able to heal.
-"Getting roflstopmed by everyone" is purely a L2P issue (well-meant).
-There's so much utility in retribution, it's absurd.

PLUS

Your PvE dmg is more than fine. I really don't think that there's something to complain about on ret.

[Veliane]

Ret feels pretty good in PvE at the moment and it scales much better than plenty other classes.
There's no need to go back and review what we had in the past.

Sure we lost things, but most of the sought-after changes are small quality of life upgrades, like HotR not needing a target, some wider range in DS, a way to refresh censure on multiple targets and Inquisition adding time rather than refreshing, capped at a certain max duration, like Felflaming immolate.


PvP Wise... well at least the burst we have is back to being fearsome, but I can't help to feel i'm too useless for myself and too convenient for everyone else.

Until some spells start behaving differently in holy, Rets wont be attractive for large group play.
I for one would like them to polish the Ret we have right now and work on it's PvP side.

Getting a completely new class every expansion is getting old.

---------- Post added 2013-06-08 at 03:58 PM ----------

my gear compared to a prot pala is nowhere near the same.. you got the wrong info bro..

There should be a feature to down-vote posts in these forums, misleading only creates chaos.


Alright, you have two hybrid haste/hit gems while hit overcaped.
Take them out and add raw haste, 60 crit and 60 strength don't make up for 320 wasted stats.

It'll also bring you down about 1% in hit which is what you need.

You're welcome.



And if you're ever going to say something like that quote again, go for a long walk until you feel you don't have to post it anymore.

[cletis1234]

I whole heartedly agree that Ret was OP in WOTLK. But that's not why I miss it. I miss WOTLK because of our personal defensive abilities and utility, as well as having more freedom in our rotation, which freed up resources to do other things, like support or off-healing. This is all from a PVP perspective of course. PVE-wise we are definitely in a good spot.

But the big question is: If we are not meant to put out the same kind of pressure that a non-hybrid class can (not including burst phases), then why not just go Holy and call it a day? Holy has the same toolkit that Ret has, all the while being able to heal and support the team even more. Lots of people complain that a Paladin's toolkit is really quite good, except that when you spec Ret, you're not adding anything to that toolkit that Holy cannot do (except damage, obviously).

[Dabrix32]

uh..backup tank gear? whaaat? my gear compared to a prot pala is nowhere near the same.. you got the wrong info bro..

your tanks are bad then if they are wearing full "tank" gear. Most tanking bis pieces for Prot are actually Ret pieces.

[Cronosmash]

Same old stuff I've been saying.

Instant Repentance
1 min Blinding Light
Old SS baseline
Better self heals
Inquisition out of GCD

So we get better CC/peels, better survivability and less of a Inq problem. If Inquisition were to be removed there would be another "problem to make the spec interesting" so at least GCD that is a pain in the butt should go.

Another nice things to have? Decent PVP utility for lvl 90 talents, BoP do not stop physical DPS, glyph of MAGIC BoP.

And then Ret is fine for PVP.

[Valedus]

uh..backup tank gear? whaaat? my gear compared to a prot pala is nowhere near the same.. you got the wrong info bro..

It should be. Are you not getting Haste/Mastery gear with hit/exp caps?

OT: That all being said, Ret is actually in a solid place right now. Isn't BEST of the best, but it works. Just need to have the right teammates.
Ret/Hunter/Disc works wonders.

[Aleksej89]

No other DPS brings more unique utility to both PvP and PvE.

Just open your retri spellbook and read, one by one, what spells actually give.

[Bijin]

Hello

I'm a full casual player and play as holy...

In arenas the retri are class that cant kill me, if u now the cd's they are really easy to evade...

Yesterday in 2v2 arenas with a friend fury warrior vs retri and resto druid, i just run for all arena, and use my cd's for the druid...

Think in 3's arenas is a great tool, but no the main dps...


Sorry english isnt my mother language, try to do my best

[Exac]

uh..backup tank gear? whaaat? my gear compared to a prot pala is nowhere near the same.. you got the wrong info bro..

Actually you have the wrong information, friend.

[mistahwilshire]

Rets bring godly utility and decent DPS.

[Exac]

Rets bring godly utility and decent DPS.

Only if you consider pulling 88% of a mage's DPS even competitive or worth bringing to a raid...

[Nobleshield]

More like only if you have the luxury to pick and choose who you bring... which I guess you perhaps do if you're in a 25H guild, which is what the chart you linked is for. In 99% of other cases, Ret DPS is decent enough.

[Meteoric]

Only if you consider pulling 88% of a mage's DPS even competitive or worth bringing to a raid...

How many times have you heard raid leaders say, "We can do this as soon as we recruit a few more Fire mages"?

How many times have you heard raid leaders say, "We can do this as soon as people stop fucking up"?

Now maybe your experience is different, but at least in my observation, an overwhelming majority of difficulties that raid groups face are of the second variety, not the first.

You want to be better than the Fire mage competing for your slot? Fuck up less than him. That's all it takes.

[Booniehat]

Prior to 5.3 I loved my ret but couldnt bring him anywhere.

His supposed overwhelming utility wasn't enough to compensate for crap DPS.

But now, his DPS is actually pretty damn good, especially single target. Previously his utility was his only good point (which was often fulfilled by holy/prot in raids and rbg), but now Rets are "good DPS with awesome utility".

That said, Rets are still kinda last stringers in 10M Heroic guilds. Due to prot/holy paladins. In 25 M they get to shine.

---------- Post added 2013-06-08 at 09:54 PM ----------

How many times have you heard raid leaders say, "We can do this as soon as we recruit a few more Fire mages"?

How many times have you heard raid leaders say, "We can do this as soon as people stop fucking up"?

Now maybe your experience is different, but at least in my observation, an overwhelming majority of difficulties that raid groups face are of the second variety, not the first.

You want to be better than the Fire mage competing for your slot? Fuck up less than him. That's all it takes.

Correct. @the guy he quoted, stop linking top 100 parses. It only makes you look uninformed.

[Exac]

How many times have you heard raid leaders say, "We can do this as soon as we recruit a few more Fire mages"?

How many times have you heard raid leaders say, "We can do this as soon as people stop fucking up"?

Now maybe your experience is different, but at least in my observation, an overwhelming majority of difficulties that raid groups face are of the second variety, not the first.

You want to be better than the Fire mage competing for your slot? Fuck up less than him. That's all it takes.

In my experience, making the enrage on heroic Lei Shen & Primordius when the average ilvl of your raid is 519 is not going to be possible without stacking a lot of actually good classes. I don't know what type of casual guild you're in, but the world-first race is in the first week, where you have maybe got loot off of 4-5 bosses in total, and you don't have the set bonuses.

Stop flaming people when you have no idea what real progression raiding is.