[Balance] 5.4 Changes and Thoughts

[Juvencus]

Are you certain about the tier 16 2piece? For me it's doing less than 1% on 60mil +-

Like I said, it's what WC shows for me. Might be overestimation of calculations, PTR bug or, but I don't think so, some goofy misinterpretation from me :P

[Fleuria]

Like I said, it's what WC shows for me. Might be overestimation of calculations, PTR bug or, but I don't think so, some goofy misinterpretation from me :P

Well it does ~4% total damage, also the new buffs are a bit higher than what they said? or well it'll be a bit higher with higher gear levels.

[Deleted]

Wasn't that a DPS loss already (to single target) unless you had CA up?

No.

10chars

[Deleted]

Its a shame because i have been reading some good ideas and good math designs for our class on different forums and in here, however its too late for this expansion. Big changes happen between patches, after that its tweaks to adjust underperforming classes.

So the best we can hope for now is some tweak to the SS proc rate and to our aoe. I doubt they will revert the SS proc change because in all honesty it procs too much on live and on ptr. I would love to see the 4 set redesigned again since after this nerf its pretty much useless.

Really i am praying for some patch notes that address our aoe, but i have all but lost hope since blizzard doesnt seem to want to help us atall. Which unfortunately makes the class less fun to play, and i think we will see a drop of active raiding boomkins in 5.4.

I think we will see some change after a few weeks into the tier when blizz gets the proper numbers about how our class performs, but still, for top guilds that is almost all of the progress time. I am very curious to see if method and BL will run with 2+ moonkins as they have in the past, or if they will be forced to play alts in progression.

[xtramuscle]

If SS is gonna proc way less, why not change it to a more chaosbolt style spell - keep its current damage as X but add a Y dot, that if reapplied before its duration ends builds like a firemages ignite? Id be fine with it proccing less, and being a real powerful hit IF we has some sort of dps on the move, but lunar shower is just weak, and shrooms arn't really worth placing.

[Drayarr]

Mages would cry that they are not special snowflakes if we get something similar to them. Also, you expect the devs to listen to reason and logic? Don't be deluded.

[snaxattax]

It made me chuckle reading the buffs to shadow priest & warlock DoTs as well when they outdo us when it comes to multi dotting

balance multidotting right now is ~10% stronger than shadow. just look at (h) qon, council and megaera 10 (25 has enough adds that it becomes aoe instead of multidotting) logs.

they need to buff moonkin aoes (either hurricane or mushroom) and they'd be basically balanced from a pve vantage. the change to sotf would actually be a significant buff to moonkin aoe if hurr/AS actually did decent damage, as it would negate the eclipse bar awkwardness.

[kendro1200]

Can there be an agreement that next xpack beta it gets constantly pushed to have hurricane/astral storm buffed (because they obviously don't want balance to use mushrooms for aoe anymore) and have it's QoL updated to reflect every other casters' aoe? Things like in the very least have the mana cost reduced to something less absurd, damage obviously buffed, have it unaffected by nature's grace so the damage can be properly balanced, and maybe make it cast and drop like destro RoF or increase the area.

[Cyous]

Can there be an agreement that next xpack beta it gets constantly pushed to have hurricane/astral storm buffed (because they obviously don't want balance to use mushrooms for aoe anymore) and have it's QoL updated to reflect every other casters' aoe? Things like in the very least have the mana cost reduced to something less absurd, damage obviously buffed, have it unaffected by nature's grace so the damage can be properly balanced, and maybe make it cast and drop like destro RoF or increase the area.

I'd rather have something that doesnt screw over Eclipse cycling -- been busy the past couple days, but one suggestion I had was to make our AOE an AOE+Multi-DOT model. (Rain of Fire + SS-weaving to a degree)

[Aboubacar]

I'd rather have something that doesnt screw over Eclipse cycling -- been busy the past couple days, but one suggestion I had was to make our AOE an AOE+Multi-DOT model. (Rain of Fire + SS-weaving to a degree)

Anyone remember the Majordomo trash?

[Deleted]

An easy fix to aoe would be to just have hurricane/astral storm generate eclipse energy or extend the duration of NG if it hits over X targets, but maybe they think it's okay for us to have such a horrible aoe mechanic, since it's damage is so terrible we hardly ever use it anyway.

[Fleuria]

Anyone remember the Majordomo trash?

Give balance first version of the aoe sunfire spam.

[Meejum]

Anyone remember the Majordomo trash?

Or shandris kited to org

[Drayarr]

Honestly, it's always felt like they just don't care too much about balance. Historically, they've made a lot of dumb, unnecessary, or very painful changes. Buffs are far and inbetween and every time we got a buff that was really great, they said "whoa, simmer down there squawky," and reduced the buff or nerfed something else. Other buffs are miniscule. I mean, I'm not the only one who noticed this is, what, the third time they buffed our single target spells this expac?

I remember when our aoe dps was not simply competitive, but it was amazing. I remember blowing up the charts on Maloriak with periodic starfalls, mushrooms, and mutidotting. It was a bit more complex than other classes' aoe and it paid off. Now mushrooms are so bad they aren't worth using actively for aoe, hurricane/astral storm were awful coming into the expansion, and after saying they didn't want to touch moonkin aoe because multidotting was so strong, they are nerfing it.

We fell down on aoe this expac, managing to keep up only with an entirely unnecessary constant target switching method that involves entirely single target spell weaving while other classes spam a few buttons, as long as they have one of the enemies in the group targetted. Now they're going to take that away and so far there is no sign they have any intention of giving us anything in return. They made our single target spells "stronger"... for the third time this expansion. Doesn't something seem off, there? They have to keep buffing the same things over and over... and it's still not very good. Maybe they're too afraid to buff balance "too much." It's not like there are fights without any movement, which stops our dps dead in its tracks.

If they're going to make multidotting useless for starsurge procs, why not give us a way to multidot with fewer button pushes and target switching, just so we have an aoe that's easy to use like pretty much every other class has right now. Something like fire and brimstone's incinerate for warlocks. Can only do it in eclipse, uses energy to put that dot on each target in the area. /shrug

The amusing thing is, it seems like they are basing the nerf on specific fight(s) - Council of Elder more specifically - because we can literally spam SS for most of the fight, which is fucking ridiculous, what about warlocks and UH dks on Tortos? warlocks and monk/pala tanks on leishen?
Just seems like they are nerfing us because mages are whining about being beaten by good moonkins when they are playing shit

[Deleted]

Dont worry, we wont be top dps on any fight now :P

[Mirri]

Dont worry, we wont be top dps on any fight now :P

We weren't top dps for any fights in tot anyway. Still feel we'll be valuable in progression.

[Fountaiin]

We weren't top dps for any fights in tot anyway. Still feel we'll be valuable in progression.

A good moonkin definitely has the potential to top some of the fights in this tier. Yeah, with good RNG Mages are broken, but go watch some of Method's progression kills before people started scumming fights like Council via cleaving.

[Cybb]

A good moonkin definitely has the potential to top some of the fights in this tier. Yeah, with good RNG Mages are broken, but go watch some of Method's progression kills before people started scumming fights like Council via cleaving.

Scumbag Fountaiin doing all the Doop-a-loops.

[Aboubacar]

I do believe the shift of power is being passed from warlocks to rogues judging the current status of PTR. Instead of warlocks have all the damage, utility, and survivability, that's all gone to rogues, for some reason an unkillable class.

[Mirri]

A good moonkin definitely has the potential to top some of the fights in this tier. Yeah, with good RNG Mages are broken, but go watch some of Method's progression kills before people started scumming fights like Council via cleaving.

I saw mostly warlocks, rogues and mages right at the top except for a few fights, though I agree that the Method owls were right behind them. Definitely top-tier.