Ra-den question for Brewmasters.

[Jadenlei]

Hello, my guild just killed H:Lei Shen and will begin working on Ra-den tomorrow. My main is a Prot Paladin (http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...h/Jadez/simple), which was used to kill Lei Shen. But for Ra-den I was planning on using my Brewmaster alt (http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...Jadechi/simple) to simplify. I'm sure I would be just fine on my Pally, fatal strike is just one less thing I want to worry about, and Monk damage is just insane.

Anywho.

I was wondering if I should consider regemming towards more mastery/stam, or if running a traditional crit/haste build will work. Raid buffed I sit around 700k, but have been seeing videos with 800k+ BrM's. Seeing as Ra-den is basically 100% physical damage, maybe pushing mastery is the way to go, and more stam = more vengeance on the hardest hitting boss in the tier. Anyone with experience tanking Ra-den suggest an optimal route? Thanks

[Deleted]

Monk damage is very close to prot paladins, so use the one most geared imo.
The enrage timer is also not a problem, but ofc higher dps = higher healing.

Is this 10/25 man?
For 10 man I did not gem/reforge what ever to stam/mastery, but kept the normal crit build with a bit extra haste (5.5-6k) because of the higher amounts of purifies.
If you got more questions ask here, or on Gishens website (nightmare-asylum).

[Deleted]

in 10man i tank it with crit/haste build (+rune of reorigination), agi flask, agi food, agi pots

[Leblue]

In 10 mans its entirely unneccessary to switch out to a mastery build. Only heroic 25 man (and even then only if you're a bit undergeared) would ever consider a mastery heavy build. What's more likely to kill you is magic damage than physical so crit > haste > mastery is what you'll wanna go for.

I'd honestly go with the prot pally though. Your dps will be similar with a haste build and if you're more used to your pally its better for the raid anyways (plus battle healer says "hai")

[Deleted]

I'd honestly go with the prot pally though. Your dps will be similar with a haste build and if you're more used to your pally its better for the raid anyways (plus battle healer says "hai")

Guard + Chi Wave/Zen Sphere says "hai" aswell

[Tharax]

On 25 man, I did not change anything about my gearing. I go for a standard crit build, DPS meta. I think I had around 10% mastery raid buffed. I think I do go for stamina a little more than other Brewmasters - I used stam food, flask, shoulder, leg, and ring enchants. It took my guild around 28 attempts to kill it, and I only died one time (other than when we wiped). So put simply, I probably wouldn't change anything. Try to chain cooldowns in phase 2, as that's where the real damage comes in. Good luck!

[gynshon]

A little look up determined you are on 10m and either will be fine. It depends on how comfortable you are with your Paladin and Brewmaster and Ra-den isn't a joke with either because you have to have some form of mitigation up for every Fatal Strike. The timer isn't exact unfortunately and you could waste a Shield of the Righteous and be dead. You basically have to wait till last second before using SoTR to ensure it will withstand the delay in casting. With Brewmaster, you only need Shuffle for the active mitigation, and what geared Brewmaster doesn't maintain 97+% uptime?

The last several weeks, anytime I am in it is a one shot. We have let our recently departed Prot pally try it and after 8 or so attempts, they swapped me in for a 1 shot. Same with our new Prot pally last week. BrM is really strong for this fight.

Here are some tips as BrM:

- Standard Crit/Haste build.
- The first several times I ran with agi food/flask. I think last time I ran with Stam only because we are now 2 healing it and I didn't want a mistake.
- Maintain 100% Shuffle uptime.
- Use Elusive Brew right after a Fatal Strike, and cancelaura the Elusive Brew right before a Fatal Strike. This gives you 12% additional stagger since you have 2p.
- Don't use guard on CD, instead use it for Fatal Strikes as well.
- Have a macro made for taunting the add and targetlasttarget. Use Charging Ox Wave for the add to stun as it is available for every add and sometimes will be out of range of leg sweep.
- Use Xuen on CD.
- Use Chi Wave on CD.
- Expel Harm is your friend and should be used after fatal strikes.

If you have more questions, or want some personalized answers, please visit our website (link below), register and ask in our forum. I check it several times throughout the day and will always give in depth answers.

[Zonex]

^

Take all that with a pinch of salt. Be glad youre a BrM, because Fatal Strike hits for jack shit, what you should be worrying about is is taking consecutive hits in a small time frame (including Fatal Strike).

That said, the main variable is your Guard. There are 2 ways to go about it, i personally go with 2 healers, and one of them is a MW, so he spams CJL on the balls everytime they are up. That is when i save my Guard for. Luckily for me, this clicks with the fatal strike timer.

If you ARE goiong to be using Guard's to deal with Fatal Strike, do not use it before a Fatal Strike hits you. Most of the time, fatal strike will not kill you, what WILL kill you, is if you get unlucky with the swings to come after. Elusive Brew is great for dealing with it, but just to be awesome, wait until right after a Fatal Strike, and pop Guard, it'll be juiced up with a spike in vengeance.

Now, i notice your BrM's gear isn't great, so you have to play extra cautiously with your EB and EB /cancelaura. Gauge your CD's (Guard/EH/Gotorbs) before each Fatal Strike, and only if you have NOTHING else, cancelaura EB if you don't already have it. You have to remember, tank death is simply hitting 0 hp, being able to dodge the swing straight BEFORE Fatal Strike is just as effective as the one after.

Also with your gear set, and probably lower than average hp, you're going to be hitting sub 35% more often than most. Which is actually a blessing in disguise, it means you can pump out a ton of Expel Harms, AND it gives your Zen Sphere a fighting chance against Chi Wave. I'd advise going with Zen Sphere, just because it's an extra caution that replaces Chi Wave nicely, especially with your gear.

Another thing, for the love of god, do not stun ANYTHING unless your strategy is to do so. Having even one paladin(or druid) means a 6 second primary stun, you want that to be eaten without any DRs. If you use Charging Ox Wave, as the primary, you just lost 3 seconds of proper stunning, using Leg Sweep will only lose you 1, but yoou cant use it everytime. Now, this is not to say, our stuns arent beautiful in their usefulness, they're great for when the dedicated stunners are off doing other stuff, so don't unbind the key or anything.

Finally, and I cannot stress this enough, use your Gift of the Ox orbs. If you've tanked Ra-den, you know he's a little bitch to move around, the solution is, once you get in place, move comfortably into his hit box (not too center, not too edgy). That will make it so when you want to pick up your orbs, it want strafe the boss as well. Don't forget, with the amount of vengeance you'll be hogging, each set of orbs are pretty much a free Lay on Hands for you. Be liberal with them.


PS: In p2, be ready to shit bricks, keep your energy at or above 80 (do not cap), keep your Expel Harm finger trigger ready, and finally ROTATE your Elusive Brew and Guards and Expel Harms and GotOrbs. (i.e. don't use Elusive brew, when you have a guard up). One small fun thing if you can muster all the pant-shitting you'll be doing, is to use Avert Harm and Diffuse Magic all at once, you'll swim in a spike on vengeance, you wanna do this before you pop a Guard, because trust me, it is so worth it .

DPS Wise, for your first kill, you should be able to use 3 Xuens, so use the first after the first set of orbs die, then 1 after the 2nd time you reset phases, and finally when it comes off CD again in p2.

Have fun

[gynshon]

/sigh

Guard by itself on this fight on average are 850k-ish. Fatal Strikes are 500k on avg, and melee swings are 300k. So, simple math would tell me that popping guard for a Fatal Strike ensures that the Fatal Strike is absorbed, as well as the next consecutive melee swing right after. Then pop EB and have a great time laughing your ass off because you aren't in any danger at all. Keep in kind you can overlap EB and the 2p Staggering for even more mitigation.

While you are correct that Fatal Strike itself isn't what kills you usually, not using guard for one and allowing yourself to get low in the first place is an incorrect way to play. Using guard for Fatal Strike will allow you to absorb the FS and the next swing right after and this fight becomes a joke.

We 2 heal it. P2 we don't even kill any balls regardless of which comes out, we let them all hit. I have yet to see a faster 10m kill than ours yet which unfortunately hurts my rankings because the longer the fight goes on, the higher the dps for tanks due to the dmg increase in P2.

Let's move on to the next point. Chi Wave > Zen Sphere here for several reasons. Damage and the healing component. High Vengeance Chi Wave not only heals yourself but fellow members as well. I did 5.2m healing from Chi Wave alone, 6m from self Guard. Put that into perspective. Add in the damage component and it is golden.

Stuns - We use my stun as the only stun. Charging Ox Wave is great because it is directional and guess what, it will always hit. Leg Sweep may not due to the positioning of the add. Huge hitbox, plus Xuen likes to taunt him and sometimes Xuen is farther out when it happens.

[Zonex]

/facepalm

I don't know where you are getting 850k guards, but p1, the guards stay at about 600k, gradually building up, and spiking at Fatal Strikes. If you are averaging with the p2 vengeance in mind, the average means nothing, as your point revolves around using it against a fatal strike.

You're right FS doesn't kill you, but if you can pump out extra damage, for no risk at all, i don't see the issue in the slightest. (Yes if you dont have full hp before FS, use Guard, but if you dont, just eat the FS, Guard and EH, itll heal for more, and thus mean more damage, and no risk, you have to be sleeping to not notice if your hp is at 100% or not when Raden's energy is closing in on 100.)

We also 2 heal it, however we don't let anima balls hit, since we keep bringing in new people/alts to all our main raids. I don't exactly know why youre bringing up rankings here, but I'll bite. Each guild has their own way of doing it, for ours we just let 1 extra ball go through so we can line up CDs since p1 ends so prematurely. In essence our p1 is a tiny bit longer.

Your last point, it's pretty obv Chi Wave > ZS, however look at his gear. He will be spiking, not to mention BrM isn't his main. The damage difference between ZS and Chi Wave isn't huge when you have that kind of gear, mainly because you wont have to wait 16s to reapply ZS, he'll prolly spike sub 35 more often, on top of the fact itll give him more breathing room (if any). Ofc its a dps loss, but its not as big as it would be for you and me, who wont see many sub 35% dips.

Stuns - We use a paladin's stun, cuz guess what it's longer than the other stuns at our disposal, and why not? The GCD of the tank is worth more than anyone else's let alone a healer's.

Anyway, its all chalked up to a difference in strategy. And about your Xuen thing, i had that during progress, i found it easier to just let him run for a bit towards the raid, before i taunted when Xuen is up, which nowadays is only once in p1 so, no biggy.

[Serendepityz]

I hate to be the one guy that doesn't have much to say but if your thinking about switching to your BrM for this fight I assume your comfortable playing the class. Under that impression the entire fight is common sense for us. The only tip I have is don't be afraid of calling for that MW'ers Life cocoon/any other externals you have. theres not really any1 else in the raid that should ever need them but you.

[Jadenlei]

Update: Killed it in 8 pulls. Fight is a joke really.

[Deleted]

Update: Killed it in 8 pulls. Fight is a joke really.

dont forget you are overgeared and have the strategies from those who killed it from scratch! but yeah its way easier than lei shen

[Deleted]

dont forget you are overgeared and have the strategies from those who killed it from scratch! but yeah its way easier than lei shen

It's only easier because you can skip a whole phase and everything is on timers, nothing is random except the which orb comes from what side and which orbs in last phase.

[Deleted]

- Use Xuen on CD.

No.

Thats obv. not the way to go for max dps on this encounter.

[gynshon]

No.

Thats obv. not the way to go for max dps on this encounter.

I know, because I only held the number 1 rank on this for 2 weeks and only dropped it because our kills are so short now compared to everyone else their damage ramps up. You are right, I should just stop giving advice altogether because I don't have a clue what I am talking about. In a 4m 30sec kill, when do you suggest Xuen should be used?

[siccora]

I know, because I only held the number 1 rank on this for 2 weeks and only dropped it because our kills are so short now compared to everyone else their damage ramps up. You are right, I should just stop giving advice altogether because I don't have a clue what I am talking about. In a 4m 30sec kill, when do you suggest Xuen should be used?

At Panda City of course....well some ppl don't click the signatures, but thats the first thing to do when somebody gives advises…nice outfit now...

[gynshon]

At Panda City of course....well some ppl don't click the signatures, but thats the first thing to do when somebody gives advises…nice outfit now...

Thanks, I really like this set. Weapons I am still searching for something that really pops.

[Deleted]

Guard + Chi Wave/Zen Sphere says "hai" aswell

Did you bother checking logs for ra-den?

Paladins are almost healing all the dmg they take while monks are at 50-60% of that healing while taking more dmg.
Monks are simple on that fight: Yes.
But, paladins are immensely powerful on that fight, especially if you don't have a problem timing your shields.

[Wreckage827]

No.

Thats obv. not the way to go for max dps on this encounter.

I don't see how it would not be best to pop it on CD. Especially if you are looking at a 5-6 min encounter.