New computer for WoW - Help please >_<

[Deleted]

Since I know pretty much nothing about hardware, I checked the ''setups of the month'' by chaud, here on MMO-CHAMPION, so as to replace my 8 year old computer.
Considering my budget, I decided to go with the ''Dolphin'' setup.

I am considering going with a AMD FX-8320 CPU instead of the FX-6300 though, since the price difference is not large.

My local computer store replied to me that they don't charge for putting the computer together, as long as the componentes are bought there. However, they aren't able to get the motherboard in the build, since they claim it is no longer produced, and they suggested ''MB ASUS Chip AMD 990FX SKAM3+DDR3 ATX - SABERTOOTH 990FX R2'' as na alternative motherboard.

They also said they couldn't get the cooler I asked for, but suggested ''CM COOLER HYPER 212 EVO 2011/1366/1156/1155/7'' as an alternative

And they couldn't get the Power Supply included in the ''Dolphin'' so I'm considering going with the 650W one on the Narwhal.

Could you guys please give me some opinions on these changes?
The computer is mostly directed at playing WoW. With this setup, how much can I expect to be able to overclock this computer (Have never overclocked before, but I would like to be able to play for many hours in a row without risking destroying my computer), and how many FPS can I expect to get?

I am currently playing 10-man on ''Fair'', since on ''Good'' the frame rate doesnt allow for a fluid game experience. Even on ''Fair'', on encounters like Elegon RaidFinder, I can't play as melee at all, since my FPS plummets as low as 5ish FPS.




Thank you very much in advance!

[BicycleMafioso]

Thread moved to sub-forum.

[Toffie]

Do not get a AMD CPU for WoW, get a 4670k with a z87 motherboard.

What is the shop you're buying from?
Also your exact budget?
You need OS ?

[Deleted]

My maximum budget is 800 to 850 euros.
Shop is called ''Abranlogica'', its a small shop in my city. I don't know where they are ordering from though - But I am unable to put pieces of a computer together on my own.
I don't know what OS means, but if it's Operating System, I have both Windows Vista and Windows 7 available.

[Iannis]

Yea sadly I have to warn against an AMD chip for wow.
I use a 990FX , AMD setup. my Phenom II is OC'd to 4.2ghz and I've seen much "slower" i5s handle WoW better =(
Grab a cheap i5 3470 and you're golden
Couple it with any gpu in the AMD 7850 or Nvidia 650 ti Boost family or higher and WoW will be running on Ultra smooth as silk

[DeltrusDisc]

Do not get a AMD CPU for WoW, get a 4670k with a z87 motherboard.

What is the shop you're buying from?
Also your exact budget?
You need OS ?

It would be helpful to the OP to explain why not to get an AMD CPU for WoW.

@OP, I'm going to hope the shop can get you prices like this. Maybe take this list to them and just ask if they can do this, then come back, if they can't, I'll chop some things down a bit. Also, summed up, AMD CPUs currently aren't quite as priceerformance-strong as they were a few years ago and also don't perform as well in comparison to similarly-priced Intel CPUs.

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant / Benchmarks


CPU: Intel Core i5-4670K 3.4GHz Quad-Core Processor (£179.99 @ Aria PC)
CPU Cooler: Cooler Master Hyper 212 EVO 82.9 CFM Sleeve Bearing CPU Cooler (£23.62 @ Scan.co.uk)
Motherboard: ASRock Z87 Pro4 ATX LGA1150 Motherboard (£104.01 @ Ebuyer)
Memory: Corsair XMS3 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR3-1600 Memory (£53.00 @ Amazon UK)
Storage: Samsung 840 Series 120GB 2.5" Solid State Disk (£74.39 @ Aria PC)
Storage: Western Digital Caviar Blue 1TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive (£48.99 @ Amazon UK)
Video Card: EVGA GeForce GTX 760 2GB Video Card (£215.71 @ Scan.co.uk)
Case: Corsair 300R ATX Mid Tower Case (£59.95 @ CCL Computers)
Power Supply: Fractal Design Integra R2 500W 80 PLUS Bronze Certified ATX12V Power Supply (£48.50 @ CCL Computers)
Optical Drive: Lite-On iHAS124-04 DVD/CD Writer (£11.99 @ Aria PC)
Total: £820.15
(Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available.)
(Generated by PCPartPicker 2013-07-23 16:13 BST+0100)

[Deleted]

So I should gun for an i5 or i7 from what I understand?
They sort of fly out of my budget though. I absolutely can't spend over 800 to 850 euros, including the price of putting the computer together. (820 pounds = roughly 950 euros)

I'm ok with a 500gb disc if it helps with prices, I have an external 1TB disk for in case I need to save lots of episodes of random TV shows.
I also noticed the SSD there... is it possible to get the computer without a SSD at this moment, and purchase a SSD later?

Without the SSD and with a 500GB disk, this should almost fit my budget, although there's still the price of putting the pieces together...


What kind of options should I be looking at, in my price range?

[moremana]

500GB isnt much cheaper, at least in WD

This is about as cheap as your going to get with quality components, the 660 is almost as quick as the 760, so that can be up to you if you want to spend the extra dough.

[Deleted]

Alright, I e-mailed the local store asking what price they could make the computer, with the specs DeltrusDisc mentioned, but no SSD. Am currently waiting for a reply.

[Fluorescent0]

I'd go for something like this if I were you. Better cooler and PSU.

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant / Benchmarks

CPU: Intel Core i5-4670K 3.4GHz Quad-Core Processor (£179.99 @ Aria PC)
CPU Cooler: Be Quiet DARK ROCK PRO 2 67.8 CFM Fluid Dynamic Bearing CPU Cooler (£53.24 @ Scan.co.uk)
Motherboard: MSI Z87M-G43 Micro ATX LGA1150 Motherboard (£86.24 @ Scan.co.uk)
Memory: Corsair XMS3 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR3-1600 Memory (£56.99 @ Ebuyer)
Storage: Western Digital Caviar Black 1TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive (£65.00 @ Amazon UK)
Video Card: MSI GeForce GTX 760 2GB Video Card (£196.13 @ Dabs)
Case: NZXT Source 210 Elite (White) ATX Mid Tower Case (£37.32 @ Scan.co.uk)
Power Supply: XFX 550W 80 PLUS Bronze Certified ATX12V / EPS12V Power Supply (£49.86 @ Scan.co.uk)
Optical Drive: Lite-On iHAS124-04 DVD/CD Writer (£11.99 @ Aria PC)
Total: £736.76
(Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available.)
(Generated by PCPartPicker 2013-07-23 17:37 BST+0100)

[DeltrusDisc]

500GB isnt much cheaper, at least in WD

This is about as cheap as your going to get with quality components, the 660 is almost as quick as the 760, so that can be up to you if you want to spend the extra dough.

er. The GTX 660 is not worth it, not at all. I'd disagree with it being "almost as quick"... http://anandtech.com/bench/Product/783?vs=854

And OP, if you have an external 1TB HDD... I'd even say, maybe take out the internal HDD and just go with an SSD, for now. Toss in another drive later on, if you'd like.

That should bring you more in line with your budget.

But yeah, i5 over i7, no doubt about that.

@moremana, he said he has a Windows copy, so no need for 8. Corsair CX PSUs are very questionable in history, also 600w is overkill, the Fractal Design I originally linked will work and is good quality, and cheaper. Also, Cooler Master Hyper 212 Evo is cheaper and good enough for almost everyones' overclocks, the NZXT Havik is 15 pounds more, so overkill.

OP, maybe this build would work? Moremana's with my tweaks, cheaper, better GPU.

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant / Benchmarks

CPU: Intel Core i5-4670K 3.4GHz Quad-Core Processor (£179.99 @ Aria PC)
CPU Cooler: Cooler Master Hyper 212 EVO 82.9 CFM Sleeve Bearing CPU Cooler (£22.85 @ CCL Computers)
Motherboard: Asus Z87-C ATX LGA1150 Motherboard (£106.76 @ Aria PC)
Memory: Corsair 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR3-1600 Memory (£57.36 @ Amazon UK)
Storage: Western Digital Caviar Blue 1TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive (£48.99 @ Amazon UK)
Video Card: EVGA GeForce GTX 760 2GB Video Card (£206.15 @ Ebuyer)
Case: Corsair 300R ATX Mid Tower Case (£60.06 @ CCL Computers)
Power Supply: Fractal Design Integra R2 500W 80 PLUS Bronze Certified ATX12V Power Supply (£49.78 @ Amazon UK)
Optical Drive: Lite-On iHAS124-04 DVD/CD Writer (£11.99 @ Aria PC)
Total: £743.93
(Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available.)
(Generated by PCPartPicker 2013-07-23 17:42 BST+0100)

- - - Updated - - -

I'd go for something like this if I were you. Better cooler and PSU.

CPU Cooler: Be Quiet DARK ROCK PRO 2 67.8 CFM Fluid Dynamic Bearing CPU Cooler (£53.24 @ Scan.co.uk)
Video Card: MSI GeForce GTX 760 2GB Video Card (£196.13 @ Dabs)

Definite overkill on the cooler, the OP is pinching pennies and a heatsink like that is an unnecessary expenditure.
That video card is reference, no thanks. It will run louder and hotter than GPUs for 10 more, like the one I linked.

Also, bleh, mATX board.

[Fluorescent0]

Also, Cooler Master Hyper 212 Evo is cheaper and good enough for almost everyones' overclocks, the NZXT Havik is 15 pounds more, so overkill.

Not on Haswell, nope. People are reporting that bad chips actually need aftermarket coolers to stay under 80C during prime95 at base clocks. I'd rather get a more powerful cooler.

OP, maybe this build would work? Moremana's with my tweaks, cheaper, better GPU.

Going single-drive, I'd really suggest going black instead of blue for lower access-time.
You can get CAS9 RAM instead of CAS11 for the same price.

By the way, you recommended a reference EVGA too. For ten pounds more going for a Gigabyte 760 is definitely worth it.

Also pretty sure I linked this board instead, guess I misclicked.

Edit:

This would be the final link. You can reduce the price by going to a stock 760 (25£ for very little performance gain on wow), reducing the CPU cooler to something else(~25-30£ for a more significant performance gain due to more overclocking capabilities), going caviar black instead of caviar blue (7-8£ for slightly lower access times and longer warranty coverage).

[DeltrusDisc]

Not on Haswell, nope. People are reporting that bad chips actually need aftermarket coolers to stay under 80C during prime95 at base clocks. I'd rather get a more powerful cooler.



Going single-drive, I'd really suggest going black instead of blue for lower access-time.
You can get CAS9 RAM instead of CAS11 for the same price.

By the way, you recommended a reference EVGA too. For ten pounds more going for a Gigabyte 760 is definitely worth it.

Also pretty sure I linked this board instead, guess I misclicked.

Oops, meant the 760 in post 6.
Before we suggest the OP buy some big ol' heatsink, we should find out exactly how much he wants to OC. By the sounds of it, he doesn't know much about building them, and probably less about overclocking. So I'd say, for now, Hyper 212 Evo. Prime95 will also push the CPU to further limits than any game the OP could even think of, unless he plans to mess with overclocking at all/P95, I don't think we need to worry too much.
The Black really won't make that big of a difference, I have one of the newer 2013 Blues and they are literal speed demons. I'll post an imgur of my results later on, if you'd like. (In a college class atm lol)
Still, at the price we've gotten it down to, it should be within his room to get a Black 1TB/bigger heatsink, maybe.

[Fluorescent0]

Well, even on a mild overclock such as 4.3 Ghz people are reporting 83C Prime95 and 70C average load temperatures on a Noctua NH-D14.

Some people on bad chips are even reporting 74C on average load on a hyper 212 evo on stock clocks.

[Deleted]

Honestly, I thought I only needed to change some setting on the BIOS in order to overclock my computer >_< sorry if I'm wrong. Does it involve tampering with my hardware as well?

Also, I had been told I'd need to get a 4ghz computer to get WoW to be fluid on Ultra setting 25man raids, so I was planning to OC mine to 4ghz.

I went to read some reviews on ''MSI GeForce GTX 760 2GB Video Card'', and they seemed pretty positive. Unless the difference will be noticeable, I'd rather stick with that, instead of the one that costs +10 pounds.

Other than that, the build in post 11 seemed good - What is the importance of the case, when building a computer? If it's not too important, I could perhaps shave some money by getting a cheaper case and using that money on a better cooler, like you guys suggested? The 40euro'ish NZXT something ones are out of the question, as my store said they can't get those (not sure why)... what options should I look at?


Also, thank you very much for all the help so far (wasn't expecting help to come this fast)... if the replies from the store are positive, and I'm able to get the price low enough for my budget, I'll probably order the computer as soon as tomorrow

[Fluorescent0]

Honestly, I thought I only needed to change some setting on the BIOS in order to overclock my computer >_< sorry if I'm wrong. Does it involve tampering with my hardware as well?

Nope, it's changing settings in BIOS. However, one of those settings is voltage. By increasing voltage you're increasing heat generated, which needs to be dissipated. Going after a better cooler allows for more overclocking because you can dissipate more heat, therefore increase the voltage more which lets you achieve higher clocks.

I went to read some reviews on ''MSI GeForce GTX 760 2GB Video Card'', and they seemed pretty positive. Unless the difference will be noticeable, I'd rather stick with that, instead of the one that costs +10 pounds.

On WoW it's probably not going to be noticeable as far as performance is concerned. Temperatures and noise will be higher on the GPU.

Other than that, the build in post 11 seemed good - What is the importance of the case, when building a computer? If it's not too important, I could perhaps shave some money by getting a cheaper case and using that money on a better cooler, like you guys suggested? The 40euro'ish NZXT something ones are out of the question, as my store said they can't get those (not sure why)... what options should I look at?

Airflow and cable management are the two most important things to look for in a case. The carbide 200R / 300R is an excellent choice if the NZXT isn't available.

All in all, with the changes made above, this is what I'd recommend you. If it's out of your budget, the next steps will be to switch to a caviar blue and to reduce the heatsink, in this order.

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant / Benchmarks

CPU: Intel Core i5-4670K 3.4GHz Quad-Core Processor (£179.99 @ Aria PC)
CPU Cooler: Be Quiet DARK ROCK PRO 2 67.8 CFM Fluid Dynamic Bearing CPU Cooler (£53.24 @ Scan.co.uk)
Motherboard: MSI Z87-G43 ATX LGA1150 Motherboard (£88.79 @ Aria PC)
Memory: Corsair XMS3 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR3-1600 Memory (£56.99 @ Ebuyer)
Storage: Western Digital Caviar Black 1TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive (£65.00 @ Amazon UK)
Video Card: MSI GeForce GTX 760 2GB Video Card (£196.13 @ Dabs)
Case: Corsair 200R ATX Mid Tower Case (£47.98 @ Dabs)
Power Supply: XFX 550W 80 PLUS Bronze Certified ATX12V / EPS12V Power Supply (£49.86 @ Scan.co.uk)
Optical Drive: Lite-On iHAS124-04 DVD/CD Writer (£11.99 @ Aria PC)
Total: £749.97
(Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available.)
(Generated by PCPartPicker 2013-07-23 18:30 BST+0100)

Edit: The CPU cooler appears to be too high for that case though, just noticed. You have the option of either changing the case with a Zalman Z11 Plus or change the cooler to a Havik 120.

[yurano]

Well, even on a mild overclock such as 4.3 Ghz people are reporting 83C Prime95 and 70C average load temperatures on a Noctua NH-D14.

1.225V for 4.3 Ghz is pretty garbage. 1.2V+ on Haswell is dual radiator (eg. H100) territory.

My 4770K @ 4.2 Ghz ~1.11V with a gimped H100 gets 65-70C in Prime95 and 55-60C in Cinebench.

[DeltrusDisc]

@OP, whoever told you that you need some "4GHz computer to run WoW maxed in 25 mans" doesn't know what they are talking about.

Quite simply, because they don't specify WHAT CPU at 4GHz, what about RAM, GPU, etc?

The i5 at stock settings, with tweaked voltages to lower them to the bare minimum needed for stock clocks, should do perfectly. So you won't have 50 fps + (much less 60) at every second in a raid, practically no one does, especially at your budget. Don't worry about it. My i5-2500K@stock when I first got it still had me well over 25 fps (which is certainly playable) and even 30 fps in 25 man raids back in April 2011, and guess what GPU I was using, to boot?

A PNY Green Edition 9800 GT 1GB DDR3 GeForce. :P

[Deleted]

The XFX 550W Power Source, the store also said they couldn't get. Is 500W not enough (If I plan to overclock to 4-4.1ghz or so)?

Also the MSI z87 motherboard is considerably cheaper than the asus one... any special reason for this? Or just different manufacturer?
From that list, I'd rather upgrade the case to a Zalman Z11plus than change the fan, since more space can't hurt for future upgrade

With that cooler, how much can I expect to safely overclock without too much trouble or risk? (Since on weekends I tend to play for extended periods of time.)
And how much FPS can I expect to get in World of Warcraft, if anyone knows?


(Tyvm for all the help, if the store can obtain all the components listed (after settling this power supply question), I will make a different thread asking for help with overclock settings, when the computer is ready.)

[DeltrusDisc]

Outside of raids, almost always 60 fps.
In 25 mans maxed out, probably staying above 30, getting up into the 50s, depending.

MSI Z87 that was linked is a lower level board than the Asus. Asus is also overpriced, usually.

I personally am not a big fan of the Zalman Z11 case, but that's me.

You should easily be able to get a healthy 4GHz on your CPU, maybe up to 4.4GHz, but Haswell is still pretty new.

500w is plenty for this build. Don't let anyone tell you otherwise. If the PSU is a good one, 500w will be overkill, even after overclocks.