Is WoW too complex?

[Lemp]

Sometimes I watch vanilla/bc pvp videos for fun and Ive noticed that there were a lot less buffs/debuffs/abilities back then. When a rogue opened on someone, the only debuff would be cheapshot and maybe one more. But now when I open on someone (as a rogue) there are instantly like 7 debuffs. This cant be fun for a new player and its not all that fun even for me. It isnt any fun glancing at all of the debuffs and figuring them all out. This could be very overwhelming for a new player and cause them a great deal of confusion. Personally I just think Vanilla/Bc pvp looks a lot more fun.

Many of the old raids had very simple mechanics (it appears) that one could probably understand relatively quickly. But now I feel like every boss is very complex and requires a lot of knowledge before-hand. Ultimately making pugging harder>casuals hitting a brickwall that requires a lot of effort (effort they dont want to put in due to the time/reward ratio)> and ultimately making them quit. Im more motivated when I feel like after I get "geared" that I will have a good shot to keep gearing than if I know as soon as I get "LFR geared", Im going to have difficulty continuing. If people feel like they have a real shot to get into pug raids, then I think they would play a lot more. I know I would.

On a side noted: What made blizzard think people wanted Scenarios instead of heriocs? I have never once seen someone ask for scenarios..

[Thelxi]

They are easier (cheaper) to make.

[Sentess]

Well, spells are introduced to players gradually.
So they should be capable of learning what the spells do while they level up without too much hassle.

Blizzard has stated that scenarios are easier to make and better at telling a story than a dungeon. They also said that they need artists for the dungeons to make the layout and graphics, where as the scenarios usually take place in the already established world with minor changes.

[Dormie]

The game was definitely more complex back then. There might be 'more' now. But it's how it's managed that makes it complex.

[Firebert]

Seeing as GC wants to try to reduce button bloat more next expansion, I'm pretty sure it's far too complex now.

[Last Starfighter]

Sometimes I watch vanilla/bc pvp videos for fun and Ive noticed that there were a lot less buffs/debuffs/abilities back then. When a rogue opened on someone, the only debuff would be cheapshot and maybe one more. But now when I open on someone (as a rogue) there are instantly like 7 debuffs. This cant be fun for a new player and its not all that fun even for me. It isnt any fun glancing at all of the debuffs and figuring them all out. This could be very overwhelming for a new player and cause them a great deal of confusion. Personally I just think Vanilla/Bc pvp looks a lot more fun.

Many of the old raids had very simple mechanics (it appears) that one could probably understand relatively quickly. But now I feel like every boss is very complex and requires a lot of knowledge before-hand. Ultimately making pugging harder>casuals hitting a brickwall that requires a lot of effort (effort they dont want to put in due to the time/reward ratio)> and ultimately making them quit. Im more motivated when I feel like after I get "geared" that I will have a good shot to keep gearing than if I know as soon as I get "LFR geared", Im going to have difficulty continuing. If people feel like they have a real shot to get into pug raids, then I think they would play a lot more. I know I would.

On a side noted: What made blizzard think people wanted Scenarios instead of heriocs? I have never once seen someone ask for scenarios..

You don't know who is quitting. And for what reason. The game is more casual friendly than ever now with LFR. And it takes little to get LFR ready. But people still want to say "Its the casuals leaving wow". No.

MoP was a big risk for Blizz. They decided to go the Panda route, and people knew it was risky. This expac just doesn't feel wow like at all. It feels like a game for 12 year olds.

[kynthrus]

There were more situational spells/debuffs back then. Maybe not for rogues, but overall it was a lot more complex then when you couldn't even see what buffs your enemies had.

[dinouille]

complex ? maybe

probleme is you don't need to understand it to succeed at it ...

[Lemp]

You don't know who is quitting. And for what reason. The game is more casual friendly than ever now with LFR. And it takes little to get LFR ready. But people still want to say "Its the casuals leaving wow". No.

MoP was a big risk for Blizz. They decided to go the Panda route, and people knew it was risky. This expac just doesn't feel wow like at all. It feels like a game for 12 year olds.

Its more casual friendly until you get past LFR, then it is not casual friendly at all.

[Dormie]

It's definitely simpler than it used to be. Rotations used to be a bit harder to manage. Now it's more or less smash anything, but smash your big attacks first.

[Killadrix]

I don't think the game itself is too complex.

It's just too complex for 90% of the people who play it who are too lazy or too dumb to figure it out.

[Hubbl3]

Its more casual friendly until you get past LFR, then it is not casual friendly at all.

Like in classic.

You need time to succeed in WoW since 2004.

[melodramocracy]

Seeing as GC wants to try to reduce button bloat more next expansion, I'm pretty sure it's far too complex now.

Because all of his decisions are good ones.

[Nobleshield]

Yes and no. Some things are simpler (overall gameplay), but a lot of boss mechanics are more complex (and badly so; it seems every boss is either a one-trick gimmick or has way too many things going on at once), ability usage (read: priority systems) are often there is just more bloat with the buttons you have on your bars.

[Glorious Leader]

Because all of his decisions are good ones.

Some are. Reducing button bloat is a good one. Others are terrible.

I agree it's to complex in some areas.

[Firebert]

Because all of his decisions are good ones.

Because all of his decisions are bad ones.

I don't see your point.

[PenguinChan]

The biggest difference I can label between Now vs Past; how straight forward and obvious things are. You had very little to do in the previous expansions (Compared to now) for your rotation, but there was a lot of little things you could do as well. Spell ranks were a huge one that a lot of people didn't understand until raiding (Or extensive dungeon runners), which you might see in older screen shots. Healers had three ranks of most healing spells, some DPS had two to three depending if they were a mana user (And gear).

I think The Burning Crusade introduced this, but /stopcasting was a huge thing that the common person just didn't know about in Classic. Good luck learning about this without someone telling you, since it was a huge help in recasting things. With it (If I remember correctly) you could recast abilities like you could now -- otherwise you had to wait until the cast bar was completely gone before the next spell could be casted.

[vesseblah]

It's definitely simpler than it used to be. Rotations used to be a bit harder to manage.

Yeah right... Some years ago most classes could still macro in their DPS rotation and press just one button to win.

I'd say the game is way too complicated when all buttons I need to mash to get maximum DPS on single target dummy don't fit into one action bar as an enhancement shaman. Would understand it if it included defensive and cc cooldowns, but 15+ buttons for just tank & spank dps is ridiculous.

[nekobaka]

Some are. Reducing button bloat is a good one. Others are terrible.

I agree it's to complex in some areas.

A lot has been done to keep overall complexity and actual button use down in PVE with some areas needing some work like things we tend to just macro anyways to deal with the bloat. There are some specs like destro that on the base level are quite simple to hit the top end of performance while still allowing more room for those who have mastered the cooldowns to get an edge. On the PVP side of things PVP has gotten ever more complex with new abilities and pvp specific changes to spells changing. There is just far more things to pay attention to in PVP. In skill level I sit between normal and heroic raids while I find PVP to be far to complex in comparison and requires a far larger time investment to learn despite having been a PVPer from Classic to WotLK. The PVP side of the game changes a lot each new expansion and just with balance patches as well. In PvE you are just learning your class vs and a fairly fixed environment while in PVP a player has to learn not only their class but the abilities of all other classes and their influences on varying situations.

Yeah right... Some years ago most classes could still macro in their DPS rotation and press just one button to win.

The balance between classes is better now. Yes a ret paladin spamming a macro was silly. It still doesnt leave out that some classes and specs like feral druid was far more complex and punishing depending on the situation resulting in a far higher skill requirement just to perform decently on top of a higher skill cap to reach to perform among the top. Rogues also have to deal with a lot as well when it comes to things like dealing with adds, combo point, and energy use that mana classes dont have to deal with. Warrior tanking was far more complex or as some would say tedious than it is today.

[Dormie]

Yeah right... Some years ago most classes could still macro in their DPS rotation and press just one button to win.

I'd say the game is way too complicated when all buttons I need to mash to get maximum DPS on single target dummy don't fit into one action bar as an enhancement shaman. Would understand it if it included defensive and cc cooldowns, but 15+ buttons for just tank & spank dps is ridiculous.

The classes I've played have all gotten redundant and simpler. And I highly doubt you use 15+ buttons on a tank and spank. Never played Enh, but most classes have like 4-5 man attacks and maybe 3 other spells you use. On my arms warriors i could still make a macro that would prettymuch play for me.

In fact I'm pretty sure if they didn't restrict waht macros could do it would be pretty easy.


I think a lot of people on the forums need to go play a BC private server and get a reality check.