Sylvannas and the ethics of raising undead

[Verdugo]

If WC4 ever happens one of the first orders of business will be expelling them from the horde and massacring them I imagine

Funny, I think that should WC4 ever happen, they would finaly snap and slaughter everyone.

[Aquamonkey]

The Forsaken are one of the only truly evil races in WoW.

They exist in hatred and bitterness and want to spread their undeath and eternal plight onto others.

Obviously there's a few exceptions such as the forsaken in the Argent Dawn, but most are happy watching others suffer their fate.

If WC4 ever happens one of the first orders of business will be expelling them from the horde and massacring them I imagine

They don't see it as an eternal plight, they see it as a blessing and liberating people from death's clutches. "Welcome back to the realm of the living. With the blessing and power from the Dark Lady, I have freed you from death's grip."

[wych]

Funny, I think that should WC4 ever happen, they would finaly snap and slaughter everyone.

People vastly over estimate the power of the plague and raising the dead.

We have no idea how many Valky'ir Sylvanas has left, it could be in single figures and they could be hunted down and killed.

Worgen already showed how easy it is to deal with the forsaken throwing plague at you if you are aware that it's coming.

The reality is the forsaken would get stomped out easily by the horde or the alliance.

- - - Updated - - -

They don't see it as an eternal plight, they see it as a blessing and liberating people from death's clutches. "Welcome back to the realm of the living. With the blessing and power from the Dark Lady, I have freed you from death's grip."

That is a Valky'ir, their views on death are much different than our own.

Lots of the flavour speech from forsaken NPCs is moaning about their plight.

However it appears the newly raised forsaken since Sylvanas got control of Valkyir are somehow charmed by the Valkyir into serving Sylvanas, i.e removal of free will.

[Aquamonkey]

People vastly over estimate the power of the plague and raising the dead.

We have no idea how many Valky'ir Sylvanas has left, it could be in single figures and they could be hunted down and killed.

Sylvanas has 4 Val'kyr left, but they can spawn multiple lesser Val'kyr. Val'kyr can raise hundreds of corpses each day.

Worgen already showed how easy it is to deal with the forsaken throwing plague at you if you are aware that it's coming.

Doesn't count, that was watered down crap.

At Gilneas, Forsaken Blightcallers say the following:
-This is a war, right? We're supposed to be able to kill our enemies with our weapons, right?
-This blight is useless.
-What did they test this crap on? Murlocs?
-Watered down garbage. Doesn't even slow 'em down.

[Verdugo]

Worgen already showed how easy it is to deal with the forsaken throwing plague at you if you are aware that it's coming.

Surely doesnt have to do anything with Forsaken using watered down version just so that Orcs can have presence on the front lines.

[Aquamonkey]

That is a Valky'ir, their views on death are much different than our own.

Lots of the flavour speech from forsaken NPCs is moaning about their plight.

However it appears the newly raised forsaken since Sylvanas got control of Valkyir are somehow charmed by the Valkyir into serving Sylvanas, i.e removal of free will.

Except that very same quest text says: "You are no slave, <name>. You are free to follow whatever path you choose from here. If you choose to serve the Dark Lady Sylvanas, I recommend you speak with Undertaker Mordo."

[wych]

Sylvanas has 4 Val'kyr left, but they can spawn multiple lesser Val'kyr. Val'kyr can raise hundreds of corpses each day.


Doesn't count, that was watered down crap.

At Gilneas, Forsaken Blightcallers say the following:
-This is a war, right? We're supposed to be able to kill our enemies with our weapons, right?
-This blight is useless.
-What did they test this crap on? Murlocs?
-Watered down garbage. Doesn't even slow 'em down.

Regardless of the strength of the strain, it is quite easy to send gyrocopters or soldiers on flying mounts over and destroy the plague machines, flooding the undead ranks with plague, like in Gilneas.

Valkyr can only raise as many as are around and killed, not to mention only of certain races.

Worgen troops along with gnome gyrocopters I could easily see destroying a forsaken war machine. I don't believe the Valkyr under Sylvanas are able to raise any non Human/Elvish troops

[Verdugo]

That is a Valky'ir, their views on death are much different than our own.

Lots of the flavour speech from forsaken NPCs is moaning about their plight.

People adapt, no doubt common peasantry is confused at first, but slowly they notice advantages.

[wych]

Except that very same quest text says: "You are no slave, <name>. You are free to follow whatever path you choose from here. If you choose to serve the Dark Lady Sylvanas, I recommend you speak with Undertaker Mordo."

You also forget the alliance killed in WPL.

They were loyal alliance soldiers slaughtered by undead, yet the second you raise them with a Valkyr they are ready to fight for Sylvanas.

[unholytestament]

Doesn't count, that was watered down crap.

How do people miss this?

Does no one remember the Wrath Gate? The plague forced the fucking Lich King to retreat.

[wych]

Surely doesnt have to do anything with Forsaken using watered down version just so that Orcs can have presence on the front lines.

Send flying troops over first, bombard the plague cannisters, problem solved.

[Verdugo]

I don't believe the Valkyr under Sylvanas are able to raise any non Human/Elvish troops

And who is to say that it will be Sylvanas calling the shots in WC4.

[wych]

How do people miss this?

Does no one remember the Wrath Gate? The plague forced the fucking Lich King to retreat.

And should it explode in the forsaken ranks it would destroy them as well.

[Aquamonkey]

Regardless of the strength of the strain, it is quite easy to send gyrocopters or soldiers on flying mounts over and destroy the plague machines, flooding the undead ranks with plague, like in Gilneas.

Valkyr can only raise as many as are around and killed, not to mention only of certain races.

That's why most of the raising happens at graveyards. Raising undead on the front lines is for strategic advantage, those undead aren't really for recruitment as most of those bodies get destroyed.

[Verdugo]

And should it explode in the forsaken ranks it would destroy them as well.

You know what weaponry is developed first when flying contraptions give you trouble?

Anti-air.

[wych]

And who is to say that it will be Sylvanas calling the shots in WC4.

I don't see any other current forsaken ready to take over, and should Sylvanas die I imagine her remaining Valkyr would be slaughtered too in order to prevent her ressurection.

- - - Updated - - -

You know what weaponry is developed first when flying contraptions give you trouble?

Anti-air.

I am not currently aware of any serious anti air that the forsaken currently possess.

One single flier is all that has to get through and hit the target and BOOM, melted forsaken.

[Verdugo]

I don't see any other current forsaken ready to take over, and should Sylvanas die I imagine her remaining Valkyr would be slaughtered too in order to prevent her ressurection.

Its not just good guys that Blizzard can pull out of their ass. Given certain initiative, they could surely come up with soul that spent long time in void or other such thing.

I am not currently aware of any serious anti air that the forsaken currently possess.

Really? Orcs are throwing grog in their spare time on those unfinished flying coffins to bring them down in Domination Point. Pride of their air force is a fucking ship with two turbines conveniently placed on sides and unprotected by any kind of shielding. Pure plot convenience prevents those from crashing down.

[unholytestament]

And should it explode in the forsaken ranks it would destroy them as well.

And? I'm willing to bet Sylvanas learned from her mistake in Gilneas and will have air defense for the artillery deploying the plague from here on out.

[Aquamonkey]

How do people miss this?

Does no one remember the Wrath Gate? The plague forced the fucking Lich King to retreat.

Because you completely missed the rest of my post?
At Gilneas, Forsaken Blightcallers say the following:
-This is a war, right? We're supposed to be able to kill our enemies with our weapons, right?
-This blight is useless.
-What did they test this crap on? Murlocs?
-Watered down garbage. Doesn't even slow 'em down.

They use varying degrees of potency when they launch Blight. Some is weak shit like at Gilneas because the Horde watches them like hawks. Some is highly concentrated, will melt bone, and make the area lethal for 100 years like when they wiped out Southshore.

[unholytestament]

Because you completely missed the rest of my post?

No... I got your point. I was supporting it...