If you are worried about your dps in 5.4 take a look at this

[jax]

I'd say the main issue is people still regard hunters as a pure DPS class. In reality you are one of the most controlling and mobile attackers in the game. So in true MMO terms your actually a support based class. Your damage should be moderate mid pack at best, while it is true some specs are support specs for other classes as well frost mage namely. The fact is having what can be argued as always near 100% up time especially after addition of shooting in melee range, you are not hindered by fights where melee can't do damage because of an AOE death, nor are you prevented from being in melee when its more optimal. You have near every buff potentially do you really need more or should the devs homogenize the game more so you can do more damage and feel better on meters? While Im looking overlogs I see just that a mid pack DPS, the issue is the OP classes making you actually look worse than you are. Mages are purely inflated w/ the gem along w/ warlocks. The vengeance bs w/ tanks etc It's not hunters that are broken its the other classes being too much.

Huh? Do you even play this game?
Going to enjoy ripping this one apart...

I'd say the main issue is people still regard hunters as a pure DPS class. In reality you are one of the most controlling and mobile attackers in the game. So in true MMO terms your actually a support based class.

We are classified as a pure dps class, all 3 specs are dps and we have no healing or tanking ability therefore, per Blizz we are a pure dps class.
In reality we can not support ourselves much less anyone else so your "support" claim is bogus. We have the worst self heal in the game and the worst defensive CD by far... we cant support ourselves yet you claim we are some sort of support class? Get real

Your damage should be moderate mid pack at best, while it is true some specs are support specs for other classes as well frost mage namely.

Huh? Finish your thought... so you said some specs are support for others but didn't mention who or what hunters are supposed to support. You claim we are support but there is no end to your statement saying what it is we support. Best kind of BS there bro... make a statement that makes 0 sense and back it up with 0 examples of it being true... I seriously think you are just trolling at this point.

The fact is having what can be argued as always near 100% up time

Every ranged has this... a decent played caster can move and dps with ease, only the mouth breathers in LFR seem to not understand you look at times and plan ahead.

especially after addition of shooting in melee range,

So an 7 year old outdated concept that didnt allow one ranged class to dps while stacked being finally fixed is the reason hunters are shit dps? seriously?

you are not hindered by fights where melee can't do damage because of an AOE death, nor are you prevented from being in melee when its more optimal

I almost fell out of my chair... um, gonna break this to you, and be careful because I understand that this secret is NSA and DOD protected and they may come after you once I let the cat out of the bag...

No ranged in this game has EVER been hindered by fights where melee cant do damage... nor have they ever been prevented from being in melee when its more optimal.

Shhh, take it easy bro, breath in and out slowly. The realization of the secret I just let you in on is STUNNING to you and I get that, but once you let it marinate in your brain it will become easier to deal with! I know, I know... its mind boggling to think of the above statement as a fact for the past 9 years. I understand that you had NO idea that ranged could stack or spread at will and still dps a boss for the past 9 years.

There is this website, its called www.mylittlepony.com go there and stay there please.

/smh

[st33l]

No ranged in this game has EVER been hindered by fights where melee cant do damage... nor have they ever been prevented from being in melee when its more optimal.

ROFL, HAHAHAHAHA, OMG LMFAO!
Okay, catching my breath,
ROTFL!!!

Okay, okay, more control.

Logical answer coming:

No, there are several mechanics that require a melee and a ranged cannot substitute. A very simple example would be Heroic Iron Qon. If you don't have enough melee to stack to absorb the fire debuff, you will wipe. Ranged cannot stack with melee because they get arcing lightning. They can't stay stacked throughout because again, guess what? They get arcing lightning.

There are several other mechanics through the tiers and expansions that have had similar issues. So making a blanket statement like ^^that? Is well, not particularly indicative on a well informed player.

[Deleted]

There are several other mechanics through the tiers and expansions that have had similar issues. So making a blanket statement like ^^that? Is well, not particularly indicative on a well informed player.

But even then, people asked for more ranged because then, less healers are affected by those debuffs.

And going through 10m TOT, there are several fights favoring more ranged. E.g. Maegara heroic, melees don't get to run, but in the end, having only melees leads to healers always having to run. And healers having to run is the risky part of the fight.

Think of a fight where two ranged targets get too run. If it's two or even both healers, this is a possible wipe reason, while having 6 ranged gives a lot lower chance for healers getting to run.

There's just no way that especially in 10m, a melee would be taken over a ranged, even if they did 10% more dps.

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the point of this post is to make sure those post with good stuff in them are watched by devs. maybe that way we can hope for a fix before the 10th.

Bascially why are you still expecting buffs when all PTR raiding shows hunters performing really good? They could only get a AOE/Cleave buff imo.

[Kibu]

But even then, people asked for more ranged because then, less healers are affected by those debuffs.

And going through 10m TOT, there are several fights favoring more ranged. E.g. Maegara heroic, melees don't get to run, but in the end, having only melees leads to healers always having to run. And healers having to run is the risky part of the fight.

Think of a fight where two ranged targets get too run. If it's two or even both healers, this is a possible wipe reason, while having 6 ranged gives a lot lower chance for healers getting to run.

There's just no way that especially in 10m, a melee would be taken over a ranged, even if they did 10% more dps.

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Bascially why are you still expecting buffs when all PTR raiding shows hunters performing really good? They could only get a AOE/Cleave buff imo.

Where is this anecdotal PTR data you refer to ? God, the hunter community is beyond words...

[jax]

ROFL, HAHAHAHAHA, OMG LMFAO!
Okay, catching my breath,
ROTFL!!!

Okay, okay, more control.

You sir are a complete ...

Take a breath and go re-read what the guy said, he said that we are great cause we can stack if its MORE OPTIMAL. He is saying its an ability that we have that somehow makes us special like no other ranged can stack besides us when its MORE OPTIMAL.

MORE OPTIMAL
MORE OPTIMAL

Yes there are fights where ranged cant stack... we all know this... he was saying when its MORE OPTIMAL>.. do you get it yet? No one is talking or said anything about a fight where no ranged can stack at all...

No, there are several mechanics that require a melee and a ranged cannot substitute.

Where does this even come from, no one is talking about substituting anything or anyone, he is simply trying to use bullshit lies to pretend hunters have a extra ability to stack in melee... that we dont have any more than any other ranged...

You are clearly confused and or just not very smart.
The herp derp in this thread is strong.

[Deleted]

I have been on the PTR all day today, in full t16, with ilvl 535 pvp bow and SoO trinkets. I am fully gemmed, hit/exp capped and enchanted. I am doing equivalent, sometimes marginally higher dps to my hunter on live who is at best full normal ToT geared. This is not good. RPPM trinket and other class nerf taken into account why are warriors able to do 200k self buffed steady dps (NOT BURST) yes consistent steady dps on a raid dummy. Where I am around 50-60k below that as Survival (140k single target).
Ps. Not hating on warriors here they have needed love all xpac but the disparity is glaring.
This warrior was in full hc ToT.

[Buttercheese]

the pure dps vs hybird dps argument makes it hard to take seriously

If i am a shaman dps my healing prowess becomes so low that it wouldnt be able to even keep a tank alive.

I stopped reading at this: "This thread is an attempt to, increase Hunter DPS in order to make them, as a pure spec, superior to Hybrids".

Just saying, cuz Hunters are a pure class, it doesn't mean that Hunters, Rogue, Warlocks and Mages should always be out-dpsing a spriest/shaman etc. The first line of that post will be read, and will be ignored. DPS is DPS, hybrid or not.

Nobody is asking to be superior to hybrids, hunters would like to be as good as hybrids. As it stands hunters have no utility at all beyond MD traps and the rare pet buff, none of which is even close to real utility. The other class with as little utility as hunters is mages, and we all know how good their dps is.

When we talk about off heals, or healing cds, we aren't talking about an ele shaman healing a tank through a raid boss, we are talking about the fact that in 5.4 they will be able to pop healing tide and ancestral guidance (or whichever other talent from that tier they would like) and provide more heals in 15 seconds than a BM hunter with a spirit beast could provide throughout an entire raid using spirit mend on cd. The same thing can be said about heart of the wild tranq, or vampiric embrace.

Non healing cds are great as well, and hunters have none of those either. Skull banner is great for dps. Devo aura is great for survival. Icebound fortitude and cap totem is great for add control. Stampeding roar is great for movement.

These are all things that hybrids have that hunters don't, yet hunters get nothing they don't have, especially when you consider the amount of multidot and cleave fights in SoO.

Hunters wouldn't be asking for mage damage, except we are doing mage utility. If we were doing top end dps, many would be ok with little utility. If we had hybrid like utility, we would be ok with hybrid like dps. As it stands we have neither, yet blizz seems to think we have both and does not seem likely to make any changes until 3 weeks into 5.4 when they have their oh shit moment and give us a hawk buff.