1. #2501
    Quote Originally Posted by oysterwjc View Post
    A bit more: u guys really think this patch gonna end in org? Naive! XD
    Obviously Garrosh escapes his chains during a heroic only cut scene, becomes some super powered sha orc and lays siege to stormwind after escaping from Pandren justice, and in the heroic phase 4 we must fight and finally kill garrosh, yup totally obvious that's what happens, oh did i mention before we kill him he opens a twisted sha portal unleashing another form of the legion upon us, yeah something like that for sure!

  2. #2502
    Quote Originally Posted by Tehterokkar View Post
    Heroic Garrosh, just like Heroic Lei Shen will be VERY tight on the DPS. I foresee not getting a kill this week because not enough gear. I don't think the Berserk timer itself is the issue, just that spending too much time in any of the phases can be lethal, especially if you go over 50 Energy before reaching last phase(Empowered MC is REALLY annoying to deal with on normal, let alone HC).


    I just hope Blizz has tuned it like Ragnaros/Lich King was; Massive DPS/Gear check.
    I don't understand why people want gear checks, the boss should be killable with the gear guilds reaching him have now, but it should be very hard.

    What happens with gear checks is they arbitrarily stretch out the time it takes to kill the boss and then it dies the next reset someone gets to him.

  3. #2503
    Quote Originally Posted by Woobels View Post
    I don't understand why people want gear checks, the boss should be killable with the gear guilds reaching him have now, but it should be very hard.

    What happens with gear checks is they arbitrarily stretch out the time it takes to kill the boss and then it dies the next reset someone gets to him.
    Gear checks is basically just a way of saying tight dps requirements mate, if there isn't a gear check that's like saying don't bother with enrage, bring as many healers as you want, Gear checks make fighting for that last bit of dps and perfecting you movement ever so more important

  4. #2504
    Quote Originally Posted by Woobels View Post
    I don't understand why people want gear checks, the boss should be killable with the gear guilds reaching him have now, but it should be very hard.

    What happens with gear checks is they arbitrarily stretch out the time it takes to kill the boss and then it dies the next reset someone gets to him.
    Gear checks exist because they're the easiest way to appease a wide audience. Perfect example is SoO, with Blackfuse going down to many more guilds after another reset of gear. It keeps the bosses difficult the first week for top guilds while allowing lesser skilled guilds to enjoy it when they have the appropriate gear.

    Without gear checks everything would be downed the first week.

  5. #2505
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    Quote Originally Posted by Woobels View Post
    I don't understand why people want gear checks, the boss should be killable with the gear guilds reaching him have now, but it should be very hard.

    What happens with gear checks is they arbitrarily stretch out the time it takes to kill the boss and then it dies the next reset someone gets to him.
    Because honestly, what's the point of even putting in berserk timers on end boss if people kill it with iLvls way lower than intended.
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  6. #2506
    Quote Originally Posted by Tehterokkar View Post
    Because honestly, what's the point of even putting in berserk timers on end boss if people kill it with iLvls way lower than intended.
    So you don't trivialize every fight by bringing 10-15 healers?

  7. #2507
    Scarab Lord Tehterokkar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DetectiveJohnKimble View Post
    So you don't trivialize every fight by bringing 10-15 healers?
    That wasn't the point. Even with 7-8 healers, you would have a VERY hard time making the small timers that matter, perfect example of Lei Shen was reaching a certain conduit energy level right at 65%, which for P1 was usually Just after or before the 4th platform Thunderstruck.

    And top guilds had to use BL AND 5 Healers to reach that! When we arrived to Lei Shen heroic, we reached the 65%/4th Thunderstruck without BL and we even had 1 more healer than top guilds.

    The Berserks should be like Lich King 25HC(albeit, not with such a high DPS requirement that you needed weekly/monthly nerfs). Lei Shen Heroic "berserk" was just that healers couldn't keep up with Winds damage anymore. I don't even know if Sha of Fear had a berserk timer on Heroic, since you were 99.9% more likely to wipe from being overwhelmed by Adds.
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  8. #2508
    Quote Originally Posted by Hexz View Post
    Obviously Garrosh escapes his chains during a heroic only cut scene, becomes some super powered sha orc and lays siege to stormwind after escaping from Pandren justice, and in the heroic phase 4 we must fight and finally kill garrosh, yup totally obvious that's what happens, oh did i mention before we kill him he opens a twisted sha portal unleashing another form of the legion upon us, yeah something like that for sure!
    Part of me suddenly wants this to happen

  9. #2509
    Quote Originally Posted by Tehterokkar View Post
    That wasn't the point. Even with 7-8 healers, you would have a VERY hard time making the small timers that matter, perfect example of Lei Shen was reaching a certain conduit energy level right at 65%, which for P1 was usually Just after or before the 4th platform Thunderstruck.

    And top guilds had to use BL AND 5 Healers to reach that! When we arrived to Lei Shen heroic, we reached the 65%/4th Thunderstruck without BL and we even had 1 more healer than top guilds.

    The Berserks should be like Lich King 25HC(albeit, not with such a high DPS requirement that you needed weekly/monthly nerfs). Lei Shen Heroic "berserk" was just that healers couldn't keep up with Winds damage anymore. I don't even know if Sha of Fear had a berserk timer on Heroic, since you were 99.9% more likely to wipe from being overwhelmed by Adds.
    In that case, Berserk timers act as a safety net that helps prevent guilds from killing bosses by using undiscovered, gimmicky (or degenerate, as Blizzard likes to describe them these days) strategies to overcome whatever dps checks a particular phase might have.

  10. #2510
    Quote Originally Posted by Arbsbear View Post
    Blood Legion 13/14 H, We now have a race !!
    The race was over three days ago imho. Method is in a league of their own. Expect a kill within 24 hours.

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  11. #2511
    Quote Originally Posted by DetectiveJohnKimble View Post
    In that case, Berserk timers act as a safety net that helps prevent guilds from killing bosses by using undiscovered, gimmicky (or degenerate, as Blizzard likes to describe them these days) strategies to overcome whatever dps checks a particular phase might have.

    Atramedes post-post-post-post-post-post hotfix, anyone :P? The one where you'd stand in the doorway and dps him, then run when he flew up and just run forever, then come back and dps him for a little while untill he flew up again and repeat untill dead. If there had been no enrage timer or gong-soft enrage mechanic, this would have made the boss incredibly easy (not that it wasn't already).

  12. #2512
    Quote Originally Posted by elucidate View Post
    The race was over three days ago imho. Method is in a league of their own. Expect a kill within 24 hours.
    If Paragon was still 25 man they would be miles ahead of Method like always

  13. #2513
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skandulous View Post
    If Paragon was still 25 man they would be miles ahead of Method like always
    Same, same man!

  14. #2514
    Quote Originally Posted by elucidate View Post
    The race was over three days ago imho. Method is in a league of their own. Expect a kill within 24 hours.
    Or next week. It did take 6 days for Lei Shen Heroic to be killed. So if Garrosh is harder than Siege and Paragons, I see him lasting for some time.

  15. #2515
    Garrosh won't go down so easily. He's supposed to be a brutal gear check.

  16. #2516
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tehterokkar View Post
    That wasn't the point. Even with 7-8 healers, you would have a VERY hard time making the small timers that matter, perfect example of Lei Shen was reaching a certain conduit energy level right at 65%, which for P1 was usually Just after or before the 4th platform Thunderstruck.

    And top guilds had to use BL AND 5 Healers to reach that! When we arrived to Lei Shen heroic, we reached the 65%/4th Thunderstruck without BL and we even had 1 more healer than top guilds.

    The Berserks should be like Lich King 25HC(albeit, not with such a high DPS requirement that you needed weekly/monthly nerfs). Lei Shen Heroic "berserk" was just that healers couldn't keep up with Winds damage anymore. I don't even know if Sha of Fear had a berserk timer on Heroic, since you were 99.9% more likely to wipe from being overwhelmed by Adds.
    It gets tiresome if it's the same shit every fight. There is more than one way to add intensity to a fight's DPS check outside of a simple berserk. Fights with null berserks help emphasis different elements of the encounter. For example, Malkorok needs a tight enrage due to how few mechanics are in play, a fight like Spoils is entirely timer based.

    But something like Sha of Pride, with a good soft enrage, doesn't need a tight enrage. As you said yourself, Sha of Fear had a good soft enrage. Early on that enrage timer was of concern to guilds; but was made irrelevant quickly.

    These fights are improved by adding variety, the same as any other mechanic.

    The Siegecrafter enrage is one of the best yet, he doesn't technically enrage at all, he just starts pumping out superpowered weapons that are going to wreck your shit.

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  17. #2517
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    Quote Originally Posted by NeverStop View Post
    Garrosh won't go down so easily. He's supposed to be a brutal gear check.
    What does "supposed to be" mean?

  18. #2518
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skandulous View Post
    If Paragon was still 25 man they would be miles ahead of Method like always
    even lappe has said they probably wouldn't, which is why they went 10man... why even say anything unless you actually know why.
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  19. #2519
    Quote Originally Posted by cyqu View Post
    even lappe has said they probably wouldn't, which is why they went 10man... why even say anything unless you actually know why.
    Check tier 10 to tier 13 progress. Paragon ahead of Method every tier and both 25 man. Then after that they were ahead of Method but as 10 man(not saying you can compare, but they killed endboss first).

  20. #2520
    Quote Originally Posted by barackohmama View Post
    Check tier 10 to tier 13 progress. Paragon ahead of Method every tier and both 25 man. Then after that they were ahead of Method but as 10 man(not saying you can compare, but they killed endboss first).
    comparing past tiers doesnt exactly meant to much. Esp when you're comparing old tiers to a player that raided with them, and then said they wouldnt be able to.

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