Is LFR dead ?

[Biged781]

You should probably look up posting etiquette and how to properly use quotes in your responses. You posted almost immediately after mine adressing something I brought up. You need to back off the insults and realize you aren't communicating clearly.

Thanks for clarifying either way, moving on.

I suppose that's fair, I should have quoted the OP. Not sure you should be the one telling people to cut out the insults though considering you are condescending in pretty much every one of your posts. You address people that way and that's what you'll get in return.

[Normie]

The first week is always like that, because nobody knows the strats yet. LFR heroes never read strats. Also I've very rarely seen anyone at all over 100k in LFR. Even my LFR hero ass only usually threw out 100-105 in ToT. Bit better now but still not actual raider level. Don't know what you expected. To lend some credence to your argument, I OQ pugged first flex wing and rolled it, never going back to LFR except with alts.

In general, the people in LFR (as of right now) who have no normal mode gear do not have the gear to do 100k. Players who accumulated enough valor gear and upgrades and world boss loot to get to 510-520, sure. People who don't even have a full set of 502, no.

I never read "strats" because I like to learn the encounters by watching and participating. I despise being part of the video-watching herd. If there's something I don't understand after a few times through the encounter, then I might look it up.

[jzy0]

A lot of it could be the fairly low gear level to get into LFR. They think that they can just go in there with minimum ilvl and get carried by the 3 people who have a 530+ ilvl

Note: I didn't read all of the posts in this thread so it could have been posted, if it has then I apologize.

[Sinndra]

I'm in a raiding guild (6/13 normal, 540 ilevel) and yesteray i decided to take a look at SoO LFR to get a few missing gear for my offspec... Oh boy i sure wasn't prepare !

Previous patch, good and casual raiders were still using LFR, especially on tuesday/wednesday, to get the legendary tokens or some tier gear. But why go now when you can do Flex instead ?

I was expecting a couple of wipes, the usual afkers and low dps. What i found was:

_ VERY low dps. On Sha of Pride, 2 people were above 100k. Most dps were at 60-70k WITH DETERMINATION*3 (+ 15% dps).

_ Wipe fest : we couldn't kill any boss without at least determination*5 buff and even then it took maybe 8 minutes each time (not sure but we could almost use hero twice)

_ Sub geared people : i saw people in this LFR with lots of 458, 463 blue gear. If Blizzard allow people to enter SoO, why should they go in MSV/ToT first?

So yeah, it really feel as if all the average raiders that help the group moving on weren't here anymore (i''m on a big server btw, and every evening /trade is full of "lfm flex") and the only left in lfr were the bad and the so casual that they can't do anything.

omg.. obviously the op doesnt have much of a clue about this fight. there is a debuff that causes you to do 75% less damage while corrupted, and people have not quite figured out how to remove their corruption. without that debuff removed, yah they will do 60k dps. but such good interpretaion of trying to show how "dps is so bad" in this raid when its only bad to a single fight mechanic that isnt quite fully known how to deal with yet.

pathetic attempt at trying to discredit LFR. people just need to quit this nonsense.

[slickwilly]

Look inward for the issues you blame on others in LFR.

[Marxman]

I did a drunken LFR last night with 4 or 5 guild alts. I carried healing completely, we had like 6 or 7 DPS who weren't capable enough for ToT LFR, much less SoO, and people obviously had done no prep for the bosses.

Immerseus: 1 pull
Protectors: 2 pulls
Norushen: 3 pulls
Sha: 2 pulls

Considering how bad the DPS and other healers were in this group, and it's the first week of LFR, it wasn't as bad as I thought it would be.

[Biged781]

omg.. obviously the op doesnt have much of a clue about this fight. there is a debuff that causes you to do 75% less damage while corrupted, and people have not quite figured out how to remove their corruption. without that debuff removed, yah they will do 60k dps. but such good interpretaion of trying to show how "dps is so bad" in this raid when its only bad to a single fight mechanic that isnt quite fully known how to deal with yet.

pathetic attempt at trying to discredit LFR. people just need to quit this nonsense.

You're confusing Sha of Pride with Norushen.

Regardless, none of these fights are dps checks, they're competency checks. The OP wants to cry about DPS because that's what he views as important. To him, gear == skill. If that's not true then he is not doing a good job making his case.

[CosmicGuitars]

Not sure about you, but I oneshot the SoO LFR, besides Norushen which took a second attempt to get down. I guess it just depends on what kinda group you get.

[Kelimbror]

I suppose that's fair, I should have quoted the OP. Not sure you should be the one telling people to cut out the insults though considering you are condescending in pretty much every one of your posts. You address people that way and that's what you'll get in return.

Please show me how I'm insulting you. I'm glad to know you keep up with my thousands of posts though. Can't make every fan happy all the time. There's a difference between me saying your post was a kneejerk reaction and you telling me I can't read. It's a very obvious difference that shouldn't even need to be addressed.

This is the difference between what you think is 'condescending' and what you wrote, which was insulting.

[Normie]

A lot of it could be the fairly low gear level to get into LFR. They think that they can just go in there with minimum ilvl and get carried by the 3 people who have a 530+ ilvl

Note: I didn't read all of the posts in this thread so it could have been posted, if it has then I apologize.

You and pretty much everyone else complaining about DPS in LFR don't seem to understand that one or two normal geared raiders doing 130-175k aren't carrying the raid. They're just shortening the encounter, which is fine, we appreciate your help, although we don't need it. The closest thing to a DPS check that LFR has had this expansion is Consorts, and that's only if people completely muff or ignore the Celestials. Basically, low DPS will never wipe a group in LFR. Gross failure to work with a few mechanics will, but low DPS is just fine.

[Treeskee]

Did LFR last night had about a 45 minute wait, but we only wiped once on Norushen, everything else was just fine.

[Sinndra]

You're confusing Sha of Pride with Norushen.

Regardless, none of these fights are dps checks, they're competency checks. The OP wants to cry about DPS because that's what he views as important. To him, gear == skill. If that's not true then he is not doing a good job making his case.

oh crap you're right. thank you. i was completely wrong. but yes there are other points that i think the OP missed on, gear, for one im sure he didnt see "lots" of blues on "lots" of people, since you do have to meet the minimum ilvl requirement. also, the fact that you cant get in unless youve done all the other lfr's at least once. according to a blue poster.

so to the OP i apologize about confusing the fights. but you still need to give it a rest about trying to discredit LFR. its really a tired subject.

[Kelimbror]

Did LFR last night had about a 45 minute wait, but we only wiped once on Norushen, everything else was just fine.

omg catbug. This has cheered me up immensely. Maybe I will try my hand again in the queue tonight.

[Adhemar]

Show me the phrase where i said you´re an asshole, or where i explicitly called you unbalanced. Try reading again. You might get it if you paid a little more attention.

After quoting my post you said:

Yeah, i know for a fact that balanced people don´t act like this

And:

Just stop being an asshole

If you're trying to say the implications of these statements are anything but clear, you're being disingenuous and that means I'm wasting my time with you.

And you might think that you "helped the group succeed", whether that is true or not is not mine to judge, and i keep my assumptions for me this time. But here´s the deal: They will succeed anyway, no matter whether you descend to the common lfr spheres to enlighten people. And it´s possible to take the lead without pissing people off.

I have explained some mechanics in lfr as well and regularly get "thank you"s from lfr or pugs, no big deal this should be commonplace if you´re decent. I don´t want a badge for exceptional leadership or something, that is just normal social behavior. You can always criticise in a constructive way and most people, or at least a sufficient big number, will listen and the group will succeed. Really no need to act like a prick.

And if you did at least normal ToT on your char there was really no incentive to do it in lfr more than 2-3 times AT ALL. Call it "obvious nonsense" all you like. LFR certainly is the worst and most exhausting way to complete the leg quest chain.

Yes, I think something with rationality and logic to explain it while you assert something nonsensical ("They will succeed anyway") when I and anyone else who has done more than ToT LFR have witnessed the untruth of your statement first-hand. No LFR group ever broke up on Garalon? Will of the Emperor? Un'sok? Lei Shen? Council? Durumu? Man, if all of these things that are so clear in my memory are, in fact, completely false and never happened, maybe you're right about that "unbalanced" thing.

Please refer to my previous posts. I will run LFR Wing 1 every week until I get some version of that trinket, because it's too important an upgrade not to make that attempt. If you have some amazing way to ensure that I get this item within 2-3 times, please share your secret with me and I would gladly not have to do this run any more than necessary. I'm sure many others are in this same boat and all of us would be grateful if you could offer us such a wondrous solution.

Why are you crying then? I know how strong those trinkets are, Hell the agility trinket on lfr alone is worth 200.000 AEP for an enhanchement shaman, compared to the ToT hc tf ones who are worth 50.000 AEP.

You're still misunderstanding me, I know what Hell LFR is for a progression based raider, but you do too... Bit you're going in there with the wrong mindset and crying about it here.

Also I would do the same as you do, I will farm flex/lfr endlessly till I have my CD reduction trinket om both characters I raid with, my blood dk and my ret pala, just because those are retardedly strong. That doesn't take away that the fact remains that LFR has tons of people that don't even know how to do their rotations right. They NEED handholding, and instead of affecting them negatively by cussing them out is such a dumb mindset compared to just helping them.

Mate, this is just like real life, if you work somewhere for years, and all of a sudden your boss groups you with people that are still green behind their ears, you HAVE to be the bigger man and teach them what the fuck to do, or else they will only be in your way....

What part of that don't you understand?

I'm not the one crying. Go back and read my post. The point of it was that LFR is actually in a better place now than it ever has been because most higher tier players are NOT being forced into it, and while I started out at odds with the bad LFR players who had queued up for a group activity they had no knoweldge about and proceeded to waste tons of other people's time, we moved past it when they proved themselves actually willing to follow my lead. I don't know about you, but I don't show up for league sports events and demand to participate without knowing what the rules of those events are. I also don't get paid to play WoW, much less to teach it to people who have "lives" and can't be bothered to spend 10 minutes of their own time in order to avoid wasting an hour of mine.

I didn't cuss anyone out, and as you can probably gather from our little conversation here, my tone is typically professional and unemotional. Some people choose to read things into that, but that's their own perspective. I came here and confessed that my viewpoint on LFR was changed because I found some people who actually were trying to succeed there. You're just making assumptions to defend your viewpoint.

[Fayth]

What I have personally noticed is that in LFR SoO people are toxic and very hostile. I personally do not do LFR much because I raid normals but my alts..

I hope it changes after some time.

[Wyattbw09]

One of the biggest differences between guild raiding and LFR is that when you raid with your guild everyone wipes has low DPS or shitty heals while learning the fights but you are all learning together so it is not a big deal. When you join LFR everyone things everyone else knows the fight down pat and thus it should be somewhat smooth sailing.

Well if you are doing LFR you likely have not stepped a foot in the raid and how zero clue how anything works and are hoping that the other 24 people are going to bail your ass out. Well guess what in the early days of a raid getting released everyone in the raid is hoping to get bailed out by everyone else and the entire exp is a mess.

[Larynx]

1 shot all the bosses on Tuesday. first and second were no issue, third we almost hit the berserk, fourth only myself, a DPS, and the two tanks were alive at the end.

[Oerba Yun Fang]

What I have personally noticed is that in LFR SoO people are toxic and very hostile. I personally do not do LFR much because I raid normals but my alts..

I hope it changes after some time.

That's pretty much every LFR, especially when they're newly opened. Those who have been doing the fight on the PTR and/or other modes expect those seeing it for the first time to know the fight inside and out already. I notice a favorite argument for those sorts of people is "there have been videos of the fight out for weeks now you should know it by now," I but can't honestly say that watching a video fully prepares you to actually do the fight yourself. Seeing the mechanics is one thing; reacting to them real time is quite another.

[Vargas]

I love laughing at the nerdraging when people freak out over people not having done a boss in a new LFR wing. Newsflash; not everyone lives and breathes WoW like you guys do. Most people would rather see and experience the content themselves; watching a video or reading a strat DOES NOT mean that you *know* the fight. The only real way to *know* a fight is to do it and see the mechanics in action. Yes you might wipe once or twice, but so what?

If you are using LFR and get angry at wiping, then don't use LFR.

[Normie]

"there have been videos of the fight out for weeks now you should know it by now,"

And that's just idiotic anyway.

The people who have done normal modes with previous tier normal mode gear probably wiped 5-10 times per boss as they figured it out regardless of any "strat" reading or video watching they did. Or, they haven't even finished 4 bosses yet.

That's normal mode raiders, who MIGHT want to be in T16 LFR for some trinkety reason. Where HM raiders are concerned, nothing that any heroic mode raider says in LFR matters, because there is no sane reason for any HM raider to "need" to be in LFR, so any HM raider is only there for shits and giggles.