How much haste with AoC?

[DizzyMonk]

I have the flex AoC trinket and with the reduced cd on FoF and EB I can drop some haste for other secondary stats. When I run Simulationcraft it still shows haste as being higher. Is simcraft taking into account the reduced cooldowns?

The scales that simcraft gives me are:
13.69 Wdps
9.54 Hit
9.51 Exp
6.54 WOHdps
6.12 Agi
2.84 Haste
2.52 Crit
2.09 AP
1.42 Mastery

Dizzy-Zul'jin

[bluebawls]

Haste is higher until we reach softcap. AoC only lowers the softcap, not the value of haste.

[DizzyMonk]

what is the softcap exactly with and without AoC?

[bluebawls]

There's no specific answer. Most people will tell you it's between 7k - 9.5k depending on FoF usage, rotation proficiency, and movement required. AoC's energy regen from EB is roughly equivalent to what you'd get from ~1000 haste.

[Callimonk]

There's no specific answer. Most people will tell you it's between 7k - 9.5k depending on FoF usage, rotation proficiency, and movement required. AoC's energy regen from EB is roughly equivalent to what you'd get from ~1000 haste.

Only a few corrections~

You forgot to mention MS (oh god, the MS gods have hated me this patch; I'm at a lower haste than Id typically be at right now simply because I'm on a laggier connection than normal)

Also, the EB gain is closer to about 1.6k haste.

I personally would only equip and use AoC if you are very comfortable with FoF - otherwise, go with TeD/multistrike. Though, AoC's proc is very, VERY nice to pair with TeB until you have them.

[DizzyMonk]

I have about 9300 Haste now and I hardly ever use FoF now. Whenever I run low on energy EB is ready.

[Totaltotemic]

Also, the EB gain is closer to about 1.6k haste.

Depends on item level, it's about 1600 for the heroic 2/2 warforged but it's down at ~1100 for 553 and lower still for flex/lfr versions.

[briswindus]

In my testing AoC works best with Power Strikes.. The reason is it seems to proc in line with FoF CD with the AoC trinket. The biggest problem i find with AoC is the fact that i don't have 3 chi when it comes off CD because its so short. I found that if i use Power Strikes it lines up better and you don't have to focus on stacking chi at the right moment. Now i haven't done any math on this but it feels better when i use PS with that trinket equipped

[Rhyzoh]

currently at 5.6k, using EB and FoF nearly on CD with normal AoC twice upgraded and I find myself energy starved for maybe 2-3 global s every minute which I've been experimenting with by trying to fill in by jumping and tapping flying serpent kick twice so it does damage but doesn't move my character

[Babylonius]

I'm using about 6k haste w/ Chi Brew with my HWF 2/2 AoC. Some times I'm starved, sometimes I'm capped. Generally if I'm starved I can look back and see I wasn't using FoF or Chi Wave enough to fill the gaps. If I am using RJW (Protectors, Sha of Pride, Galakras, etc) then I switch Chi Brew for Ascension which keeps me about the same as Chi Brew w/ Xuen.

[unlightable]

I feel that AoC reduces CD on direct cooldowns of hunters, rogues, druids and shamans, but is practicaly useless for monks?

I mean yeah, 15sec of EB is nice, but even if it worth anything up to 1600 haste for 2/2 HWF (and requiring perfect use of that EB), that haste doesn't contribute to auto-attack damage and is devalued even more. And having 1k'ish haste on 580ilvl trinket doesn't look as impressive, compared to 2.5k mastery from TeD or a ~5.5% damage on Haromm. Besides, i guess that people having top-notch trinket whould have so much haste on their gear (even fully reforged out of it), that using EB on cd would be impossible.

Anybody knows what 50% increased uptime on other class CD's worth? Should i pass on that trinket in favor of other agi's?

[zurm]

Anybody knows what 50% increased uptime on other class CD's worth? Should i pass on that trinket in favor of other agi's?

I can't speak for all other agi users, but I know it's quite good for hunters, and out of this world amazing for rogues playing combat or sub. Combat especially, the FLEX version of the trinket upgraded 2/2 is worth over a 25k dps increase to bad juju. It has to do with how the trinket stacks with a passive called restless blades which actively reduces major cooldowns (shadow blades, adrenaline rush, killing spree, and spring) by 2s for every combo point used in a damaging finisher (eviscerate, rupture, crimson tempest). The combination of these two effectively turns Adrenaline Rush and Shadow blades from 3 min cds to ~45s cds, and killing spree to about a 25s cd. It's basically amazing for any agi spec that is heavily dependent on cooldowns... which obviously isn't monks, since our main "cooldown" isn't a cooldown at all but rather a stack generated in combat.

(My rogue is my main)

[TheTrueM4gg0t]

You should defenetly pass on it. There are better trinkets for us, and its just much more valueable for other classes/speccs.
But speak with your raidmates about it

[Hottie4Hire]

In my testing AoC works best with Power Strikes.. The reason is it seems to proc in line with FoF CD with the AoC trinket. The biggest problem i find with AoC is the fact that i don't have 3 chi when it comes off CD because its so short. I found that if i use Power Strikes it lines up better and you don't have to focus on stacking chi at the right moment. Now i haven't done any math on this but it feels better when i use PS with that trinket equipped

Do you do any content other than Naxx Patchwerk runs? I can think of so many situations in which this would get off and suddenly fail. It might feel better, but only because you're taking the lazy way out. A slight amount of preparation will allow you to pool some chi in preparation for FoF and all will be well taking Ascension.