So... 10N Galakras problems, any tips?

[Nobleshield]

Guild did our first tries at 10N Galakras last night. We ended up with a comp that actually had no melee at all due to what was available (our normal Rogue is MIA/AWOL and presumed not raiding with us anymore for unknown reasons):

* Tanks: Paladin (me), Brewmaster
* Healers: Resto Druid, Resto Shaman, Mistweaver
* DPS: 2x BM Hunters, Frost Mage, Shadow Priest, Destro Lock

We were pretty much getting trucked by the adds on the ground. I personally think that DPS were slow switching to kill the banners and totems, as well as the Shaman add itself, but it seemed overall that the waves were not dying fast enough. When the second miniboss comes out (High Enforcer Thranok or something, the guy who pulls people in and does that Bonecracker AOE), he was usually around 40% health or more by the time the next wave came out, with one attempt he was at like 81% or something. The tower group didn't seem to have issues (BrM, Shaman, SPriest and one of the Hunters, I think but we changed it up a few times so maybe that was an earlier attempt) but the ground team was getting overrun and either the NPCs would die or I would get destroyed by all the adds pounding me into the dust (pretty sure a banner was still up though) and we'd wipe shortly after.

I actually recorded/streamed the last attempt before we switched to Flex to kill it (gets a bit loud when everyone talks at once, be warned), including voice comms: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gTqspSuBc5M

And the log for that attempt: http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/r...?s=3392&e=3734

DPS overall doesn't seem that awful, but as you can see in the video around 5:40ish, there's a banner that's up for WAY too long (it stays up through the minibosses AOE) and the adds are just staying up for way too long it seems, so I'm at a loss for what the actual issue is other than it being people aren't switching fast enough to the banner/totems.

[BergErr]

So tankpov(you?) didn't reflask and lost it mid pull.
Mobs not tanked in group for aoe/cleave, mobs not tanked in blizzard.
Not enough stuns on adds.
Hunters with AMoC(imo bs win because targets dont stay up for 30sec) and low uptime on SRS. Mby get the good hunter teach the bad one how to play(unless WoL just missed a bunch of skills).
No legendary cloaks?
Glyph explosive trap and put it on the NPCs if you lack stuns.

[Deleted]

Two things that could help you not being overwhelmed by the adds:

Focus and interrupt the Shamans. And kill the totems right away. In your last attempt there is 126M healing by the shamans and totems.

Always tank the adds inside the Blizzard, it only damages them, not you.

[shadowfyre27]

Your dps looks to be fairly good, does everyone have the legendary if not encourage them to work on getting them they are a fairly decent dps boost. The biggest things that I noticed watching the video was that 1 people didn't seem to focus down priority targets.
For our 10m raid group we have the following priorities when it come to the adds and stuff: Banner then Bonecrusher then totem (which you can completely avoid getting if you have a couple stuns on it or burn the shaman fast enough) then shaman.

Another thing I noticed was that it didn't seem as though you had anyone assigned to watch for the fracture and then immediately stun the Bonecrusher. Now seeing as you don't have any DKs (I main one in our raid group and just death grip them when they start the fracture), the best stuns you have available to you with your comp would be the 2 hunters and the lock. Both of those classes can talent into a stun to interrupt the fracture, they just have to make sure they do it right after it starts, if they do it before they start the fracture then the Bonecrusher will just go and do it's fracture anyways (learned this the hard way in our group lol). The lock stun has a 30s cd and the hunter one has a 1m cd so you will need to assign one to cover each Bonecrusher. Now as long as your group focuses and kills the Bonecrusher right away there should only be 1 fracture per Bonecrusher.

That's all I can think of atm, if you have any other questions I'll keep on eye on this thread and try to answer them as best I can.

[Nobleshield]

Two things that could help you not being overwhelmed by the adds:

Focus and interrupt the Shamans. And kill the totems right away. In your last attempt there is 126M healing by the shamans and totems.

Always tank the adds inside the Blizzard, it only damages them, not you.

I could have sworn most of them were in the Blizzard to be honest, except in rare cases where I was moving out of things like fire or poison. I might turn my graphics settings up a bit higher if I'm missing the Blizzard graphic (also having camera zoomed out a ton).

Honestly that last attempt was pretty lazy on all of our parts, because it was the seventh or so wipe and we were like "Okay one last shot and we switch to Flex".

Re: Legendaries we have 3 people with it (Mage, SPriest, Resto Druid). The Warlock has his epic cloak but is having trouble getting a group to kill all four Celestials since on Turalyon at least, Alliance just does one Celestial for loot (when Horde hasn't tagged it) and then goes to form an Ordos group. I've told him about OpenRaid and the like though. Pretty sure one of the Hunters has the same thing.

I wonder if the Brewmaster would be better to tank the adds and me go in the tower, instead of vice versa?

[Senen]

1) You spend way too much time away from Jaina's blizzard. When a wave appears, you should take the aggro on everything (except the flamethrowers), interrupt the shaman so that he comes with you and pack everything into the Blizzard.

2) Focus the shaman. The wave with the second miniboss has a shaman, you should always kill him first. When the next wave appears, it's okay if the miniboss is still alive but the shaman should be dead or close enough.

3) Banners are important to kill but you sound really too focused about them. It's not that which will make you wipe or not, usually.

[Birkin]

Priority: Totems/Banners/FractureInterrupt/ChainHealInterrupt>Destroyers>Shaman>Mini-boss>Bonecrusher>Everything else.

Send 1 tank, 1 healer, 2 dps to tower. Leave your best dps on the ground.

How it usually works out for us (3 Heal):
Adds dead when Korgra spawns. Korgra about 40% when demolisher spawns. Switch to demolisher, then once demo down, tower team of 4 goes up, while ground team finishes off Korgra. I am Brewmaster that tanks towers, so I just pull the 3 adds in tower to the top and start on the tower mini-boss. Once tower cleared, lowest dps stays up and uses turret to kill the flying drakes while the rest of us join the ground crew. This should be right about the time Thranok spawns. (Depending on your dps in tower, he may be up for a few seconds before you finish the last tower add) Continue to deal with Thranok/adds until Demolisher spawns. When 2nd demo spawns, Thranok is usally around 50% and there is possibly 2 adds up with him still. Focus demo and as soon as it is down, we send same 4 tower team up 2nd tower. Same deal - pull all 3 adds up top and aoe with boss. Once tower miniboss is down and adds about dead, our tower healer runs back over to the other tower to get on the first turret. I (tank) stay up in 2nd tower for 2nd turret, while the 2 dps join ground and continue to help finish off adds. Now we're in position on both turrets and just waiting for a good time to pull Galakras. Usually by the time the next wave is about to spawn (2 drakes), they're still trying to finish off other adds, so we wait until drakes are almost dead and then pull Galakras.

For P2, we have melee stand on back of boss and ranged about 20yrds behind them in a group. Whoever is targeted runs behind the ranged group. Make sure your offtank is standing on the side of Galakras, so they don't get the Flames debuff from the ball. On tank swaps, make sure new tank runs back in front so the ball is still lined up nicely going through melee towards ranged.

[Deleted]

Honestly that last attempt was pretty lazy on all of our parts, because it was the seventh or so wipe and we were like "Okay one last shot and we switch to Flex".

That's your biggest issue by far!
7 wipes and then its time to switch to flex?
Really?

I honestly think you don't deserve to kill that boss on normal then and you should stick to flex raiding permanently.
Geeeez, gief epix for free plox!

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For P2, we have melee stand on back of boss and ranged about 20yrds behind them in a group. Whoever is targeted runs behind the ranged group. Make sure your offtank is standing on the side of Galakras, so they don't get the Flames debuff from the ball. On tank swaps, make sure new tank runs back in front so the ball is still lined up nicely going through melee towards ranged.

Is there a point in having 2 groups?
Why don't all stack on melee and whoever is targeted runs back a bit? Sounds like that's better for aoe healing and shorter runs for if melee is the target?

[Promark]

The Warlock has his epic cloak but is having trouble getting a group to kill all four Celestials since on Turalyon at least

Have them use oQueue, it will change your world.


Edit: It looks like your biggest issue is tunnel vision once the 2nd mini boss comes out. Your group was blasting away at Thranok and completely ignored the shaman, bad move. That shaman managed 3 big heals and put down a totem, which appears to have healed Thranok for 37 mil. You cannot allow this, especially since he only has 25 mil health to begin with. You basically tried to kill 2.5 of him.

[Senen]

That's your biggest issue by far!
7 wipes and then its time to switch to flex?
Really?

I honestly think you don't deserve to kill that boss on normal then and you should stick to flex raiding permanently.

I won't say that "you don't deserve a kill", but I agree that 7 wipes is really not that much.
Two possibilities:
1) You were progressing over these 7 wipes and everything is fine.
2) You were stuck, wiping 7 times in a row at the same moment and for the same reason. Then, your RL (you?) should think again and change some things in your strat, because something is probably wrong.

If you're not able to go through 7 wipes and keep going, then Flex is probably better suited for you.

[Perryn]

Your DPS seems fine, but you're definately not prioritizing the targets correctly and ensuring to interrupt the shamans.

Coordinating the dps/assigning interrupt duty on the heales should do wonders, I'd imagine.

And yeah, 7 wipes is not much to complain about...not gonna say how many wipes we can build up but it's a -lot- more than 7...:P

[Nobleshield]

I won't say that "you don't deserve a kill", but I agree that 7 wipes is really not that much.
Two possibilities:
1) You were progressing over these 7 wipes and everything is fine.
2) You were stuck, wiping 7 times in a row at the same moment and for the same reason. Then, your RL (you?) should think again and change some things in your strat, because something is probably wrong.

If you're not able to go through 7 wipes and keep going, then Flex is probably better suited for you.

Other tank is RL (well we are supposed to be joint RL, but he kind of took control again), it was more we were down to like an hour of raid time left so didn't want to spend the rest of the night wiping (we raid about 2.5 hours, Monday/Tuesday/Wednesday; Tuesday we did the first four bosses in that time, so this was our first foray on Galakras on Normal - before this week Tuesday would be Flex only, Wed would be normal progression and Monday would be whichever, but we've only recently been able to clear the first four); I would have been fine with it but I also wasn't seeing any meaningful progress (in fact we were getting a bit worse).

Our RL actually is of the mindset we shouldn't even attempt a boss on normal until we kill it in Flex, but I disagree because quite frankly the fight was a joke in Flex and not at all like Normal; we oneshot it on Flex, basically oneshot Iron Juggernaut (had a wipe due to an accidental pull) without having seen it before on Flex, so honestly I think we are doing more harm than good by doing Flex before Normal as it makes us complacent and thinking that the fight is joke easy and then we get steamrolled on Normal. For instance the first week, we breezed through Immerseus on Flex but we tried the same strat on Normal and got beaten to a pulp like 6 times before we ended up switching the strat and killing him.

I think I'm going to have to work on coordinating the DPS/priority and assignments for things like the shaman and stuns.

[Taiyoken]

The banner has 1 HP, I know our tank also switches to it to get it down so I don't think you can blame DPS for 'not switching to the banner'.

Totem HP is very minor as well.

There were barely any interrupts that attempts also for the amount of things that got through. There were like 3 monk kicks, 1 counterspell, 1 silence, and that's it. No rebuke, no wind shear.

[Nobleshield]

The banner has 1 HP, I know our tank also switches to it to get it down so I don't think you can blame DPS for 'not switching to the banner'.

Totem HP is very minor as well.

There were barely any interrupts that attempts also for the amount of things that got through. There were like 3 monk kicks, 1 counterspell, 1 silence, and that's it. No rebuke, no wind shear.

Thanks for pointing that out, I wasn't aware the banner had such tiny HP; I do use @mouseover macros for Judgement and Avenger's Shield, so if its that small I can zap them myself if necessary.

[Deleted]

We have only killed it twice so far, first week we 3 healed and the second week we 2 healed. The 2 healing worked a lot better, healing requirement is low outside the p2 with galakras himself and the extra DPS burns it super fast with hybrid healing CDs (we had 2 ele shamans since I went ele from resto)

Up the towers we sent 3 dps and 1 tank, one of the dps was an ele shaman with ancestral guidance and ascendance available, this was enough to heal through the tower bosses leaving 3 DPS, 1 tank and 2 healers below for the waves that come, the 3 dps up the tower also means they get down faster to help the ground group.

You may find dropping a healer and adding a DPS helps

[Deja Thoris]

so I'm at a loss for what the actual issue is other than it being people aren't switching fast enough to the banner/totems.

With respect, you need to learn how to use logs to identify problems. Failing that, use common sense. Since the whole raid was apparently tunnelling a miniboss at one point, did no one notice or think to mention his health was increasing?

http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/r...pes&boss=72249

In 7 wipes there was 590 million healing done by hostile npc's. That's your problem.

[Odina]

All the information above is GREAT info and gives you a heads up on what you need to fix. However now how to fix it?

1 MAJOR thing is make sure all your raiders have something to show enemy nameplates. I'm biased towards tidy plates with threat plates but I cannot stress enough how much of an asset having this is for this fight. You see all the names you see banners you see totems and more importantly you can click the nameplate fast and start to wail on the target. Added bonus you can see cast's on the name plate and it's pretty easy to see a shamie casting a heal and go "O shit better stop that" when the nameplates show it!

Another thing is whomever the add tank is should be MARKING the focus target! While aoe is good knowing what is the "nuke" target should be a top priority for one of the tanks... you see a shamie mark that sob and have everyone nuke it the adds will get aoe from peoples rotations and the blizzard and the shamie should drop FAST.

The NPC's are your friend abuse the added power they give to your group! Interrupt fracture ASAP! You see one of them fracturing you stun that sob even if you need to save CD's just for that do it!

One tip since you are sending your priest up the tower anyhow is have them up on the ridge as the destroyer comes out and they can keep dpsing the destroyer. The tower tank can stay on the destroyer until it's dead and then the priest can life grip them up! This saves the tank the runaround time and they can start to hit the first 3 adds in the tower while dps get up there!

Here is a link to our logs if you have any questions feel free to ask but it looks like some of your players rotations may be off for this fight. Looking specifically at our two locks and they seem to have a VERY different rotation priority for this fight and seems to be hurting your locks dps.
http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/d...?s=4235&e=4641

I get how time can be of the essence we raid 4 hours a week one day a week only so I get where you're coming from on not wanting to waste any time on flex etc and wanting to push normal progress. However the only way on reduced time raiding to push is for all your team to be on there A game and have the tools they need to perform well.


ps: Not sure if you realize but you have A LOT (5) of green level gems in your gear. Like your sword... no way you should have a green level gem in there...or the 2 green level pure haste gems means your missing 160 haste from teh blue level gems. You are missing a lot of Ilevel alocated stats due to using inferior gems! To push normal modes of a new tier you should at the very least be min maxing your personal gear before looking at how to improove your over all raid.

GL Nobleshield!

[Nobleshield]

We usually don't send the tower team up until the demolisher is killed, anyways, because when we had tried doing it, the tower team was getting rocked by the demo.

Definitely good point about marking; I thought I enabled an option in DBM to automatically mark Shamans, but it now that I think about it, it didn't seem to be working so maybe I was never given assist like I asked. Time to bring out ye olde mouseover marking keybind, methinks.

For stuns, I know I have Fist of Justice (but I try to avoid using it since I have to run to the guy if he charges Jaina or Vereesa, and that means bringing the adds out of the blizzard). Warlock can take Shadowfury, pretty sure both hunters have something (Concussive Shot?), not sure of anyone else having something to stun. I'm tempted to try swapping with the BrM and go into the tower, since he can spam Spinning Crane Kick, but having AS for the Shamans is nice to bring them in since they stand far away.

Kill order would be: Totem > Banner > Shaman > Bonecrusher > (Miniboss) > Flagbearer? With Demo being above Bonecrusher if it's out for the towers?

[Odina]

We usually don't send the tower team up until the demolisher is killed, anyways, because when we had tried doing it, the tower team was getting rocked by the demo.

Kill order would be: Totem > Banner > Shaman > Bonecrusher > (Miniboss) > Flagbearer? With Demo being above Bonecrusher if it's out for the towers?

Correct the tower team stays down to kill demolisher BUT with the warlock you can sep up gates so the priest can get up the hill pretty fast, once on the top of the hill the priest can still cast on teh demolisher and AS SOON as demo dies they can lifegrip the tank up the hill and the tank runs in and starts to kill the first 3 adds. May seem insignificant but it adds to dps on the adds and to the tank getting back down to help with add spawns faster!

We prioritise Demo over everythign but totems and banners and just ensure his hel is interupted. Don't be mistaken he also casts tidal wave and that is a dps spell and you can pretty much ignore it! Sure interupt if you can but the only thing you really need to ensure is his heals are interupted!

This is my POV as tower tank from our first kill. If you have any questions as to what we are doing feel free to ask! We were really not abusing the NPC's on the first kill and since then fixed that and the adds MELT now! You should also see what I mean by life grip helps get me in faster


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After watchign your vid 2 things to clear up

1)We prioritize Miniboss 1 > Demo and get that snake DEAD!
2) Many times you were on insignificant adds. Not saying you were wrong but once you have agro on the low priority adds you should be nuking the main target IE the shamie was up and you off in blizzard alone with 2 adds no one else is hitting thus shamie is not taking dmg from you at all.
3) When the second mini boss is up a banner stays up for like 15 seconds... this is a NONO he hits hard enough as is no need to help him wipe you :P

We may have our differences on how we want blizz to take this game and tune raiding but trust me when I say this we both want to see you kick some ass in raiding

[Perryn]

As far as the fractures go you can also have your resto druid use typhoon if it comes on the NPC's in the back (knockback will break the fracture as well as a stun will). We have a boomkin who does the same. We keep tanks' stun for Varian usually though, since he likes to be in the middle of everything.