Lich King 25HC toughest boss in WoW History?

[furydeath]

No one has the the heroic PvP boss in that "one raid" did no one like PvP bosses

[Deleted]

Not saying the fight is harder than H Leishen but I feel you are undermining vanilla in general with your statement, not the fight.

I don't want to say Vanilla raiding was easy, but as a Ranged DD, compared to now I think it definitely was easier. (and yes, I did clear everything up to Kel'Thuzad)

The difference is that most fights required a TON of preperation. You couldn't just go in there and kill the bosses.
Also, like someone said, mana management etc. was more important, plus having less abilities to handle various situations.
It was was a completely different kind of difficulty.

Also, if you want to compare H leishen to anything in vanilla, it should be cthun. He was bugged though and probably the most impossible-to-kill boss in the history of wow due to that before his fixes :P

I compared it to Huhuran because she was brought up earlier.

[Angelicat]

Yeah I didn't recall the exact number of people that got hit, but most guild I believe over compensated in case they lose a few soakers. If 2 soakers went down and you didn't have backups, the raid would wipe very quickly.

Yep, you had to play near perfect with the exact amount of people in nature resist, and that wasn't really possible. People would die fast between the spray and dot so you needed backup.

Our guild was lucky and was the best on the realm by far so we could farm a ton of the outdoor dragons for gear, and even then our kill was messy.

[h4rr0d]

Controlling 40 players, difficult mechanics ( at the time vanilla bosses in aq40 had very unqiue mechanics and offered little by way of safe play) . Druid's combat rez had 30 min cooldown instead of 10, playing alliance mean't you had no bloodlust/heroism.

In comparison todays raiding scene 10 man in particular is easier to manage, mechanics are alot simpler or are just rehashs of old wow raid bosses.

Playing alliance actually meant that you had access to:
Fear ward - why do you think there were so many dwarf priests in vanilla. Tremor totem was nigh useless compared to that
Blessing of Salvation (now hand of salvation) - 30% threat reduction active on all raid members at all times. Totems were group only, TA totem was competing with DPS increasing totems, had measly 30 yards range AND was providing only 20% threat reduction.
I believe paladins were also better healers, but I didn't raid in vanilla, so I can't really pass any judgement on that.

[brirrspliff]

Why exactly is it useless? The op asked for "proof" that other bosses were harder. This list clearly demonstrates other bosses took longer to kill and were thus more difficult to kill for whatever reason. How would you provide this proof?

And yes, different guilds found different things difficult, but a world first is a world first, it shows how fast whoever the best players at the time were to kill something, which equalises the 'different guilds find things easier/harder' issue.

because the list does not show what you think it shows. it's comparing healthy apples to foul oranges that got fixed after months. but this was said countless times. i don't have to provide proof, because i don't think there is "proof". it's still highly subjective.

so in short, there is no objective answer to OP's question.

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Five pages and no joker mentioned the elevator boss in SSC?

i think you won. *hands joker sign over*

[Belisaurio]

So, people are comparing old bosses to new bosses without any problem?
Example:the invention of a pencil is better invention than the wheel. Yeah...maybe the pencil is better elaborated than a simple wooden wheel...

When you look close to: mechanics, minimum people required, skills, tools available, tests and spoils (guides), resists, skill-level of the player base, etc...then, and only then, you can compare all the bosses between expansions.
And the lists from previous posts is a really good start to know the difficult of bosses. Time pass at the same speed for all epochs.

[furydeath]

Five pages and no joker mentioned the elevator boss in SSC?

Crap I knew I was forgetting one. The good old days when the trash was harder then the boss. Gruul's trash, sunstrider's PRE NERD trash anyone

[transparent]

Heroic Ragnaros, Heroic LK, Alone in the Darkness, Al'akir and M'uru would all be pretty equal due to the flawless execution required. Personally I'd go with Alone in the Darkness and Heroic Ragnaros maybe pushing a little bit forward.

Using days to justify a boss's difficulty doesn't work. You can't compare the information available back when 40 man was king, versus the plethora of information available these days. On top of that, most players are simply better when talking world progression guilds.

[Deleted]

Probably the elevator in BWD, I thought it even got nerfed hahaha

[MrWilson]

From a healers perspective classic/BC raiding was harder than now... You had less spells but had to use the right rank of the spell to not go oom... Eight ranks of healing wave (as a shaman) for example... And this is only ne spell! A lot of buttons to push
Can remember I had rank 1 on key 1, rang 4 on key 2, rang 8 on key 3, then Chain Heal the next three keys... God that was... painful

[Deleted]

Why exactly is it useless? The op asked for "proof" that other bosses were harder. This list clearly demonstrates other bosses took longer to kill and were thus more difficult to kill for whatever reason. How would you provide this proof?

And yes, different guilds found different things difficult, but a world first is a world first, it shows how fast whoever the best players at the time were to kill something, which equalises the 'different guilds find things easier/harder' issue.

The list is complete and utter total BS.

As an example do you honestly really think Ragnaros from MC is the 3rd hardest boss of all time?

Really you REALLY think that?

If the list was the number of pulls or time invested when the fight was actually possible I might put some weight behind it but it is not therefore the list is complete and utter total BS.

[Orcindauh]

#3 tied Ragnaros - 74 days from Majordomo Executus' death. 25th April 2005.

Just no, MC rag was a joke tbh along with every other boss in MC. People were extremely new to the game + long graveyard walks back to instance.

[h4rr0d]

The high end raiding became streamlined as much as anything else in the game:
Threat became a non issue
You don't need to spend weeks on farming specific sets of gear just to start attempting a boss
You don't need to have x number of class y because of z mechanic, pretty much everyone has access to everything and such mechanics are generally not introduced anymore
DPS doesn't have to worry about mana at all
Healers don't have to worry about mana to some extent
Dungeon journal displaying everything about boss fights

The list probably goes on, but I can't come up with anything else right now.

All of this enabled blizzard to introduce more complex mechanics which then in turn make Vanilla fights look easy to an uneducated watcher.

[Grand Crusader Absalom]

Ouro at the top of the list is bs. He was a skippable boss so of course every guild went straight to C'thun. After downing him a few hours after the fix went live so he actually was killable they then decided OK, let's do Ouro now.
Had H LK not been gated or whatever, he would've been killed a lot quicker.
I'm sure I remember seeing Lappe or whatever say H Sha of Fear was the hardest when they killed it.
H Rag and Lei Shen I feel should be at the top.

[PotaTW]

My point is that in current raiding environment heroism is used by nearly all guilds who have a mage/ shaman or hunter where in Vanilla there was no heroism.

And yes paladins vs shaman both had there pro fights and bad fights but I liked that.

Ahhh finaly a man who has experienced the same as I did... SUPER hardcore Vanilla! No fucking addons like today.. I used stopwatch on example sons of flames... Alot of people today only focus Ilvl and shit! I remember the time having a few blue/uncommon was OMG YOU ARE PRO!....
THOSE WERE THE DAYS!
Farming for MONTHS/Years after Forors compendium! to get Quel!
Controling 40 people, doing 20man like ZG / RoAQ and be SUPER happy when taking down bosses and get some blue SUPER cool items... Using hours on trash! HAHA!
Now everything is epix.. Why the hell cant they make them Uncommon/ a few rare.. just increase ilvl...
UBRS was 15man, scholo/strat 10... We needed to work hard! Today kids dont know SHIT! Have been playing WOW since the start, seeing how people FREAKS out if you have to low ilvl just makes me sad... As i always say...
**Gear is obtainable, skills only to a certain level!**
I would 100000times more have a undergeared skilled raider, than a full geared decent player... Since items are SO easy to obtain to the one who lack items... THEN we will see who tops dmgmeter with equal gear!
OMG KIDS THESE DAYS!

BTW C'thun was the badest mofo ever... 4hm was pretty damn hard 2!

[Blaschnack]

Five pages and no joker mentioned the elevator boss in SSC?

Not to forget the ledge boss at the twin eredar encounter! 's really hard, SWP, yaknow, hard place!

[Deleted]

Five pages and no joker mentioned the elevator boss in SSC?

The only mechanic that was not perceived as easier, when it was reused in BWD years later.

[Deleted]

From a healers perspective classic/BC raiding was harder than now... You had less spells but had to use the right rank of the spell to not go oom... Eight ranks of healing wave (as a shaman) for example... And this is only ne spell! A lot of buttons to push
Can remember I had rank 1 on key 1, rang 4 on key 2, rang 8 on key 3, then Chain Heal the next three keys... God that was... painful

I was in a guild attempting Muru pre nerf as a Resto Shaman.

I could not disagree with this any more.

Healing is way more complex now than it was then. It is not even close.

[Angelicat]

Ouro at the top of the list is bs. He was a skippable boss so of course every guild went straight to C'thun. After downing him a few hours after the fix went live so he actually was killable they then decided OK, let's do Ouro now.

I recall ouro being bugged like cthun as well, which is why guilds didn't kill him. At least that's what I remember.

Had H LK not been gated or whatever, he would've been killed a lot quicker.

I don't agree. He was a hard DPS check with the 0% buff, and while being gated meant guilds couldn't throw hours at him, it did allow guilds to gear up more to attempt him without one guild having an advantage over everyone else (thus a fair race so to speak), so I feel you are really understating his difficulty/tuning.

H Rag and Lei Shen I feel should be at the top.

Definitely two of the hardest fights ever, but yogg 0 and H lich king are up there with it too, imo.

[Eläin]

LK hc is the hardest one that I did. Remember my friend raging over Vashj tho. No clue what the hardest one ever was since the game has changed so much.

Kerafyrm, The Sleeper

I know its not a wow boss, but that shiets crazy .