Time to talk about gap closer

[Morally Grey Storm]

That that DK deathgrip is much better than speed of light on boss fights.....

That that DK deathgrip is much better than speed of light on pvp fights while having half the cd and instantly bringing DK's target up close without actually putting DK in harm's way.

[JoeShmo]

Its funny, because my first thought when avenger's shield was introduced was: "OH finally! We get a real ranged pull.......wait... why is there a snare attached to it?" /facepalm

Theres hope that blizzard will finally make a baseline gap closer for paladins at some point; after all the work we had to go through to get them to get rid of rng combat, give us an interupt, fix mana return issues, etc. the class has progressively gotten more and more "acceptable" as a melee class like the others.

They should give paladins a "winged leap" like the elves have Angelic Flight in Rift. It does the leap like heroic leap for warriors, but with wing graphics from avenging wrath included. The only caveat is that in Rift you cant use the racial in combat or pvp, but for an example of something functional the paladins could have, that would work perfectly.

Im sure a lot of warriors would "cry" about paladins having a heroic leap. I personally would change it to function more like blink or the druid cat charge, but again im sure people would complain about "homogenization". Long arm of the law is nice and all, but its not a "snap" ability like warriors / druids / dks have. Id argue that its also a talent ability, but druids have the same issue in that department, although their choices arnt nearly as thought-provoking.

[Morally Grey Storm]

Id argue that its also a talent ability, but druids have the same issue in that department, although their choices arnt nearly as thought-provoking.

I find it incredibly funny that fecal druids and rouges have Long Arm as a passive.

Oh, and I find it also pretty amusing that all druids get to have baseline Emancipate.
triple hooray for double standards?

[Hanec]

Blizzard should take a page out of murkalot's book and give us falling murlock as an ability....but maybe with the animation of Rigtheous Inspitation. Point your sword to the heavens and then teleport to a targets location smiting him with holy wrath

[Talen]

We could have something really cool... Why people wish to stay with sprint or passive boost speed

Because if Paladins aren't going to get an instant gap closer of some form, there's not really much choice left.

It's only a sprint, it doesn't give any special thing to us or to our teammates.

Yes....it would only be a sprint - albeit a sprint with a passive movement boost built in. A Sprint on a 1 min CD or a 2 min CD or a 30s CD but still a sprint. Why? Because the class already has it and its seems unlikely to get any form of instant gap closer.

very melee fighter has a signature move, something you can recognize and assimilate to the class (charge, death grip, shadowstep, flying serpent kick, etc...). The paladin is the only one without one.

Divine shield.

Truth is that yes, you can ask for something more. As paladins have asked for ever since Vanilla. Anyone else remember Shield Rush from TBC Alpha? But the chances are it's not going to happen.

The option for a sprint like move is one neither Warriors nor DKs have, and its one the class already has access to. Making it baseline and adding a passive effect means there can be a little thought in using it, and also opens up the T1 choice.

While personally I'd like one the T100 talents to be "Leap of Justice" the thing is...Warriors already have the instant charge mechanics, DKs have the bring them to here system and Paladins speeding up fits in with the "Speed" and "Light" aspects

EJL

[Morally Grey Storm]

Because if Paladins aren't going to get an instant gap closer of some form, there's not really much choice left.



Yes....it would only be a sprint - albeit a sprint with a passive movement boost built in. A Sprint on a 1 min CD or a 2 min CD or a 30s CD but still a sprint. Why? Because the class already has it and its seems unlikely to get any form of instant gap closer.



Divine shield.

Truth is that yes, you can ask for something more. As paladins have asked for ever since Vanilla. Anyone else remember Shield Rush from TBC Alpha? But the chances are it's not going to happen.

The option for a sprint like move is one neither Warriors nor DKs have, and its one the class already has access to. Making it baseline and adding a passive effect means there can be a little thought in using it, and also opens up the T1 choice.

While personally I'd like one the T100 talents to be "Leap of Justice" the thing is...Warriors already have the instant charge mechanics, DKs have the bring them to here system and Paladins speeding up fits in with the "Speed" and "Light" aspects

EJL

unique sprints on 1-2 minute cds?
you mean like fecal druids have 2(Roar, Dash) at the same time while having Long Arm as a passive with a charge to boot as well as Emancipate to boot?
I think I'm getting your idea.

[sxefluff]

Paladins have a LOT more than other melee. That's kind of the point of different classes. Give Paladins a blink or a charge, you pretty much make the other class weaker in comparison.

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unique sprints on 1-2 minute cds?
you mean like fecal druids have 2(Roar, Dash) at the same time while having Long Arm as a passive with a charge to boot as well as Emancipate to boot?
I think I'm getting your idea.

Preeeeeeetty sure he opt'd into comparing the Paladin with other plate users for a reason.

If you think Paladins really need something more unique in their kit, then maybe you should play a class that is more your style.

[Lyese]

Sheesh, 9 years and PLDs are still asking for a charge. The way I see it, PLD should either be super bursty and someone you don't want to be in melee with, or have an undispellable HoF. I think that would carve out a nice niche.

[Morally Grey Storm]

Paladins have a LOT more than other melee.

like what, for example?
any other melee (bar Enh though debatable) has better mobility and time-on-target than Ret.
any other melee has better personal defence cd's.
any other hybrid melee has better off-heals than Ret.


Do Rets excel at , like, anything?
No, they are not.
Not only they are mediocre, but they are severely lacking .

That's kind of the point of different classes. Give Paladins a blink or a charge, you pretty much make the other class weaker in comparison.

so justify all the tools fecal druids have, while we are denied even the basic right of every melee class/spec - to get into melee on demand often and realiably.

Preeeeeeetty sure he opt'd into comparing the Paladin with other plate users for a reason.

just so his arguement could fit, sure as sure.

If you think Paladins really need something more unique in their kit, then maybe you should play a class that is more your style.

If you think Retribution Paladins really are fine in pvp, then probably maybe most surely you are out of your mind.

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Sheesh, 9 years and PLDs are still asking for a charge.

Rets asked for lots of things.
Well, lot of these things Rets asked and suggested for, were given to other classes.
No pattern in here, sure as sure.

The way I see it, PLD should either be super bursty and someone you don't want to be in melee with, or have an undispellable HoF. I think that would carve out a nice niche.

and we are neither.

Btw, undispellable HoF means nothing when they kite you .
F.e. any skilled mage can kite a Ret w/o dispelling HoF with basically no chance for Ret to retailate.

[rhandric]

I think it's obvious that some people *cough* would only be happy if every Judgment stunned your target and instantly teleported you behind them...or them in front of you!

[Morally Grey Storm]

I think it's obvious that some people *cough* would only be happy if every Judgment stunned your target and instantly teleported you behind them...or them in front of you!

I think that's not the point of this topic.

*cough*

[Saxtorph]

So you have multiple self-heals and multiple damage mitigation abilities as baseline, but now you want more mobility too? LOL. Keep dreaming.

[Deleted]

So you have multiple self-heals and multiple damage mitigation abilities as baseline, but now you want more mobility too? LOL. Keep dreaming.

So do druids, shamans, priests, warriors, rogues, hunters, monks, DKs...

[Talen]

unique sprints on 1-2 minute cds?
you mean like fecal druids have 2(Roar, Dash) at the same time while having Long Arm as a passive with a charge to boot as well as Emancipate to boot?
I think I'm getting your idea.

What I'm thinking is a combination.

Passive Paladins would have the current Pursuit of Justice effect.
They can get an active effect for a short term gap closer - effectively, SoL. The CD? You'd need to balance it....it would effectively be giving the class two of the T1 talents in one, and even if the PoJ effect was inactive during the CD you'd probably want to tweak the existing CD of SOL

Now, it isn't perfect....but two of them at once would probably over at least some of the weaknesses in both. Yes...an instant gap closer (really like the Winged Vengeance idea of leap and hover then crash) would be nice, but such a tool doesn't seem like its anywhere on the horizon.

EJL

[Deleted]

So you have multiple self-heals and multiple damage mitigation abilities as baseline, but now you want more mobility too? LOL. Keep dreaming.

Mitigations and self heals won't bring you to your target. You will be kited to death.

Keep whining.

[Arcanimus]

Here's my idea:
Act of Faith (Replaces Pursuit of Justice)
Instant 24 second cooldown
Instantly leap to the target, suppressing all movement impairing effects on you for 3 seconds.
Can be cast on friendly targets, instead granting them the effect of Hand of Freedom.
Replaces Hand of Freedom. Unaffected by Clemency.

[Lyese]

Rets asked for lots of things.
Well, lot of these things Rets asked and suggested for, were given to other classes.
No pattern in here, sure as sure. and we are neither.

Btw, undispellable HoF means nothing when they kite you .
F.e. any skilled mage can kite a Ret w/o dispelling HoF with basically no chance for Ret to retailate.

You know, I've seen plenty of posters and players who use the exact same arguments over the years "We has come up with all these good ideas and dey gave dem to other classes" (a thinly veiled "dey took our jerbs" argument if I heard one), but rarely has this happened. Being a PLD for the majority of my time in WoW (8ish years), I've never really understood why Rets are so whiny.

We have plenty of other options to catch up to targets, giving us an undispellable HoF would enable use to use more of our gapcloser tools to get in while not making us as homogenized as "here's another charge/deathgrip clone". Not every pvp match is "We start on opposite sides of an arena 1v1 go!" That's when teamwork, synergy, and skill comes into play. I remember when Talen used to make paragraphs explaining the need for a charge. Good times.

[Morally Grey Storm]

We have plenty of other options to catch up to targets

yeah, we can run towards them, or we can run towards them.
plenty of options, sure as sure.

Being a PLD for the majority of my time in WoW (8ish years), I've never really understood why Rets area so whiny.

rising real issues is now called whining?

giving us an undispellable HoF would enable use to use more of our gapcloser tools

It would not.
we can have 2 HoFs as is now, but it doesnt help.
the whole package of tools doesnt help.
which means, logically, that said package is not sufficient.

Permanent passive HoF would not help with our issue, because our issue is reliable and fast gap closing and getting on target, not moving around.
If you're so hell bent on not giving Rets a charge, you'd have to buff Long Arm of No Charge to at least, I dunno, 100%-150% runspeed increase.

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So you have multiple self-heals

2 , to be exact. We have 2 heals.
one of which cuts into our damage heavily(WoG), and second is increadibly mana-costly and almost unusable unless you pick a specific talent.

So you have multiple multiple damage mitigation abilities as baseline

1. We have 1. One. Uno. Ein.
It's called Divine Protection, and it reduces only magical damage taken, unless you choose to glyph it, then it will reduce both magical and physical damage taken, but at half the original strength.

LOL. Keep dreaming.

Lol indeed, my friend.
But keep trolling.
You might yet amuse me.

[Arcanimus]

I'd gladly trade you my pet's gap closer for a self heal or sacred shield.

[Morally Grey Storm]

I'd gladly trade you my pet's gap closer for a self heal or sacred shield.

I'd gladly respond to this if it was holding some actual point, but alas.