When WoD launches with no flying and nothing changes, will you admit being wrong?

[Pengalor]

It's a property of correct arguments that they continue to be correct when repeated.

Correct until proven wrong (which theirs have been, numerous times).

[melodramocracy]

Ever notice how the people who support Blizzard's decisions do nothing but use talking points when they argue? All they do is rephrase what Blizzard has already said. In other words, they are not thinking for themselves.

"I'm correct"
"Well yeah, you're correct, but can't you think of another way to be correct? So unoriginal"
"....."

[Trickname]

I don;t think flying will form a "tight knit community" what I think is required for that is simply to have a collection of quests requiring a group to complete (e.g. outdoor areas of elite mobs which can't be killed efficiently solo).

[Destruktion]

Ever notice how the people who support Blizzard's decisions do nothing but use talking points when they argue? All they do is rephrase what Blizzard has already said. In other words, they are not thinking for themselves.

How ironic is it that you accuse others of using talking points yet drag up the tired old "Blizz lost x million subs because of y."

[rda]

How ironic is it that you accuse others of using talking points yet drag up the tired old "Blizz lost x million subs because of y."

It still stands that Blizzard lost X million subs due to their poor decisions.

And they can absolutely lose more. Edgy decisions like this one is the last thing they need, frankly.

[Osmeric]

Correct until proven wrong (which theirs have been, numerous times).

No, they haven't. There's been a lot of tendentious nonsense from those complaining about this issue, but nothing resembling a convincing rebuttal.

[Ivalen]

Pay me $100 and I will level your gd lazy ass.

Then will you admit you're a troll?

[Pengalor]

No, they haven't. There's been a lot of tendentious nonsense from those complaining about this issue, but nothing resembling a convincing rebuttal.

Riiiight. Then again, not sure what kind of response could be expected from someone who seems to love GC so much. I sure hope he's not your example of a solid logical basis because I would feel very bad for you. However, you don't have to like that rebuttals have been made, they still show the major flaws in Blizzard's logic and Blizzard has yet to explain themselves further about how these holes are not holes so they are kind of on the losing end of this one at the moment.

[Osmeric]

Riiiight. Then again, not sure what kind of response could be expected from someone who seems to love GC so much.

I love it when someone I'm arguing with goes all ad hominem like that. It fills me with a warm glow of smug superiority, since they couldn't come up with an actual valid argument.

[Destruktion]

It still stands that Blizzard lost X million subs due to their poor decisions.

And they can absolutely lose more. Edgy decisions like this one is the last thing they need, frankly.

Some of those decisions arguably weren't poor, their implementation was simply poor.
Blizz needs to keep experimenting if they are to make the game better. By telling them to not make edgy decisions you are holding them back. Bugger off.

[DeadmanWalking]

The point isn't to make it a closer community. It is to make it so you can't go straight to kill Big Bad Guy who is surrounded by a small army of minions who fortunately can't attack you if you are a foot off the ground and skip straight to him.

Then they need to remove stealth and invisibility from the game. You can still be casted upon, struck with melee and shot at from a foot above the ground. Nonsense argument is nonsense.

[antelope591]

Let me pose this question to the whiners.....what do u currently do in game that utilizes a flying mount? Timeless isle - no flying, raids and dungeons obv no flying. Outside of farming what is there currently to do in game that NEEDS a flying mount and you can't live without it? I'm just curious to get a feel for what someone's thinking when they say that not being able to fly for a few weeks or months would make them quit the game.

[Pengalor]

I love it when someone I'm arguing with goes all ad hominem like that. It fills me with a warm glow of smug superiority, since they couldn't come up with an actual valid argument.

What, you mean like all that stuff you conveniently cut out of the quote and ignored? That's a very Blizzard thing to do of you. Oh, and have fun feeling superior, I guess ignorance is bliss.

[Pann]

So?

I have a friend in my guild that is level 90 with 1100 achievement points. I'm not sure how someone can get 90 with only 1100 points, but he has.

Again, if bots and pro farmers are using teleporting bugs to a massive degree, then flying is not "helping" you get the ore. You are only getting it because they are not in the same place you are at this moment - if they are truly still teleporting around to the degree that you claim.

So I have proved you wrong about there not being players that gather 100 stacks per day.

I am not saying that this player is a bot he may just be someone that enjoys gathering but as you can see he has listed over 80k golds worth of ore in just four days he is, also, quite prepared to gather ore without a mount and most servers have people just like him. So when you remove flying and make gathering more tedious and slower players' income is not going to raise to offset the time they now spend gathering because players like him that are prepared a spend hours of their time and some will even cheat to gather huge amounts mats will still be controlling the price.

Only a fool would willingly choose a ground mount when the game will let them fly.

In which case why are you and others defending a decision that essentially forces everyone to take the fool's option?

[draykorinee]

In which case why are you and others defending a decision that essentially forces everyone to take the fool's option?

fool me once, shame on — shame on you. Fool me — you can't get fooled again."

[Deamon002]

New zones in Draenor are somewhat small as well and takes only few minutes to cross, even without flying.

Just go and grab flight path to nearest point in that zone and mount-up, won't take long before you're at wanted destination.

Is that supposed to be a good thing? "You move like an octogenarian turtle, but that's okay because the world's only the size of a paddle-pool anyway." That's two negatives, and no, these do not cancel each other out to make a positive. It just makes Blizzard doubly lazy.

[Raeln]

undercity isnt a building its a underground city theres a difference, as soon as you enter the queens chambers you are dismounted.

most raids do idd have big long cavenrs ect but are still in a building like 3/4 of soo and thats why you cant mount there.

That is a thin explanation. Very thin.

"You can't use your flying mount because it's a building - even though it's a HUGE building."

/rolleyes

By that logic, you shouldn't be able to fly at max altitude on your flying mount because you'll freeze to death either. Keep it at the treetops.

- - - Updated - - -

I don't now where you get this fantasy that people interact on the ground with ground mounts. It does not happen. People interact in this game with whispers and chat channels. Nobody has ever run up to someone and started interacting out of the blue "Escuse me but do you have any grey poupon?" and the only exception would be people who were die hard role players, I play on an RP server and I would put role players at slightly less than 1% of the population of that server. If you can rp on a ground mount you can do it with a flight mount in the air. One does not stop the other.

And I am really sorry that people choose not to pass by you on a ground mount when they have fun shit to do and they want to get to it instead of spending their time on the ground so you can see people active around you, because everyone is here to satisfy your needs.

When I am roaming around on a ground mount in areas where flying is forbidden, I have stopped and helped people out. Rezzed someone dead or what not.

When I'm flying over head at 100 yards above the treetops - I never see them to know they could have used any help.

[Destruktion]

In which case why are you and others defending a decision that essentially forces everyone to take the fool's option?

It's not the fool's option if it's the only option.

[quras]

It's not the fool's option if it's the only option.

IT's still a fool's choice even if it's a by design.

[Raeln]

1) Ok, I was talking about current raid content (or content from the past 3 expansions for that matter)

Mount Hyjal is from the past 3 expansions.

2) Because skipping all the trash to get straight to the boss kills means the top-tier gear in the game with only the boss kill worth of effort. Too easy imo.

How is this really different from skipping mountains of "trash" out in the open world?

It's still just all about convenience in the end. I get it, "trash" is inconvenient when it's out in the open world but somehow it's a necessity when in a raid zone.

3) Pulling entire camps of mobs...lol. Yeah, so could running straight into Sha of anger or running of a fucking cliff. They aren't equivalent.
4) Yeah, and I would be willing to bet all of those mobs are either rares or required for a quest. Can't exactly skip the shit you have to kill.
5) The quest lines do, the paths themselves don't. Let's just have them start putting up invisible walls too. They say they want us to explore but they want to restrict areas of the world, they contradict themselves.
6) Not actual flying. We had boss mechanics or jumps or the like but not actual flying on your mount (besides some bugs)
7) Yeah, and how many people gave a shit about IoT or TI except for the Valor and gear? The IoT flying restriction mostly just hid their shitty development since it was gated anyway and TI would barely be visited after the first week if it wasn't for world bosses and easy VP (oh and assholes ganking their own faction).

There are mountains of players on TI every night on my server. It is miles from being a ghost island.

There were many players on IoT in the weeks and days before 5.4 launched.

Aside from Valor and Gear - there isn't much else to work for in WoW, at least right now anyway.