Hekili - Yet Another DPS Shaman Priority AddOn

[Vizslakane]

"Chain Lightning (2+), if you have 2 active targets." - This should be 3 targets if you have CL glyphed, although generally speaking if you're going to be doing cleave DPS you'll unglyph CL in advance

So my understanding is that if your CL will not hit at least 4 targets you should not glyph. But, if CL will hit 4+ targets glyphed CL is a major dps increase.

But I guess what your saying is that as soon as you get to 3 or fewer targets glyphed CL becomes a dps loss?? Would that mean that generally overall using unglyphed CL would produce more cleave damage (figuring most fights have 3 or fewer targets).

So is there really a fight (Galakras, Garrosh) MOP where you would use glyphed CL? Based on what you said I feel I've been using glyphed CL too freely, thinking why the hell not

@Hekili: Doesn't the Add-on only recommend CL with 2+ targets?

[Hekili]

@Hekili: Doesn't the Add-on only recommend CL with 2+ targets?

Yeah.

Doing some napkin math, it looks to me that CL with 2 targets is still a DPS gain over casting LB in that scenario, glyph or not.

With 48,481 spellpower and Shamanism, without accounting for haste, mastery, or Echo of the Elements, Lightning Bolt does roughly 62,178 damage in 2.0 seconds vs. 1 target. That's 31,089 DPS.

Unglyphed CL does 43,794 damage in 1.5 seconds vs. 1 target. That's 29,196 DPS. (Multiply by up to 3 targets.)

Glyphed CL does 39,525 damage in 1.5 seconds vs. 1 target. That's 26,350 DPS. (Multiply by up to 5 targets).

That leaves LB superior for 1 target, unglyphed > glyphed > LB for 2 - 3 targets, and obviously, glyphed for 4+ targets.

Additionally, more CL hits equals more LS stacks equals more Fulminations.

Am I missing something?

[Vizslakane]

Am I missing something?

Yes. I'm Enhancement

That leaves LB superior for 1 target, unglyphed > glyphed > LB for 2 - 3 targets, and obviously, glyphed for 4+ targets.

Simming seems to agree with above, even for Enhancement. With 4 targets pretty close to the same dps, glyphed or unglyphed.

So to maximize DPS of your Multi Integration in Single Target display, the optimal setting would be 3 correct?


Now questioning the viability of using the CL gylph at all...
Thinking about what Binkenstein said about cleave damage, if you did to use glyphed CL on fights with 4+ targets, the targets would need to stay up a while to get maximum benefit. I mean lets say you have 4 targets (dps gain using CL glyph), and 1 target goes down fast, now you would have been better off not using the glyph (more dps form unglyphed CL) against 3 targets. Can you see the CL glyph being "really" useful in any SoO encounter?

[Hekili]

So to maximize DPS of your Multi Integration in Single Target display, the optimal setting would be 3 correct?

I use it with 3, when I use it. I can't say it's necessarily optimal, as I haven't built sim profiles for each # of targets, but 3 has always worked well for me.

Thinking about what Binkenstein said about cleave damage, if you did to use glyphed CL on fights with 4+ targets, the targets would need to stay up a while to get maximum benefit.

Bink is Elemental, which is why I worked out that math for Elementals. But yeah, uptime of adds is a significant factor. That suggests that Glyph of Chain Lightning loses value as you and your raid gear up, since the adds will be gone so quickly. There aren't any real fights where you're supposed to be damaging 4+ targets for an extended period (Galakras, I guess?). I'm on belts for H Siegecrafter, but if your raid has cluster bombs and you're quick enough to not blow up a mine, maybe it's good there, too.

I mean lets say you have 4 targets (dps gain using CL glyph), and 1 target goes down fast, now you would have been better off not using the glyph (more dps form unglyphed CL) against 3 targets. Can you see the CL glyph being "really" useful in any SoO encounter?

In general, and purely my opinion, not really. Definitely not in a raid that's well-geared with efficient players maximizing their DPS. You or your teammates will be killing things too quickly for the 4th and 5th target to matter.

The difference would only be significant, though, when you have a 2nd and/or 3rd target that IS taking damage from your Chain Lightning for an extended period. In a fight where you never cast Chain Lightning, Glyph of Chain Lightning obviously has no benefit (nor drawback).

[binkenstein]

The thing you're missing is that Overload has a X/3 % chance to proc per hit, so that's where you lose a chunk of the damage on two targets. To be honest, the only fight where I *don't* use Glyph of CL is for Protectors.

[Hekili]

Thanks, binkenstein. I did overlook Overload.

Here's an unrelated question: Would anybody miss the "greentext" timers if they went away? I've actually developed some additional class/spec modules but making those timers function consistently across classes has become a waste of development time (IMHO). Looking back on it, I'm not confident that anybody can read and use that information to make any important decisions regarding what ability to use next. If it's not useful, there's no reason for it to exist. Anybody have strong opposition to that?

[Daagar]

If the loss of the timers means additional class/spec support, rip it out. Of all the priority helper addons I've tried, this is far and away my favorite.

On the flip side, supporting more classes/specs does nothing to help my altitis. Maybe this isn't such a great idea after all...

[Howliest]

Just tried this on my freshly new Elemental Shaman. I have to say, I love this addon. It's doing what it says on the tin. Will you be looking into adding other classes into this? I'm fairly sure that it would be even more popular then.

[Hekili]

Just tried this on my freshly new Elemental Shaman. I have to say, I love this addon. It's doing what it says on the tin. Will you be looking into adding other classes into this? I'm fairly sure that it would be even more popular then.

I'm glad you like it. Let me know if anything seems suboptimal. I've received some recommendations for Elemental that I haven't implemented yet.

I actually have my own version where I've been adding classes/specs to the addon. My Windwalker Monk module works pretty well, but I'd need to develop several systems to make it work for additional classes. In the meantime, I'm also doing some preliminary work toward adding an in-game editor so you can finally have custom displays and action lists. Very, very preliminary work.

[Vizslakane]

Saw this posted elsewhere.. your thoughts? Will the add-on compensate for the addition ilvls?

"With the extra ilevels on AOC trinket it's going to mean about an extra 4% cooldown refresh rate, bringing FET with glyph down to about 96 seconds.
EM being on a 90 second CD, will this mean FET glyph is going to be mandatory now?"

[Hekili]

With Heroic 4/4 AoC (I don't have WF), EM/PE with no glyph is still slightly outperforming glyphed FET, at least with my gear/stats and SimulationCraft. I'm going to be watching to see if there are other adjustments to be made.

[vykas]

I am excited to hear you may be developing Hekili for other classes. That would be amazing. I've been using this addon since the beginning of December, and I love it. One of the best I've ever used.

[Daagar]

I'm almost scared to see Hekili for other classes. The excellence of the mod for shaman helps keep me focused on one character (but now I waffle between ele/enh. Sigh).

For those waiting for Hekili+, check out Ovale. It has had some major updates of late and is really quite solid as a multi-class rotation helper. I use it for everything but shaman now.

[Eileana]

So, I just came back from a 6-month break, does this still work?
At work atm so can't test it.
Last Update 19 April 2014 and I have no idea when last patch came.

It's a great addons so it would be a shame to let it go.

Cheers.

[vykas]

It works wonderfully.

[Hekili]

So, I just came back from a 6-month break, does this still work?

It does. There have been no updates, but I'm working on a newer build that should prove to be much more efficient, allowing more updates per second and thus being more responsive. The project isn't idle.

If you run into any problems or bugs, you can PM me here or submit a ticket via Curse and I'll take a look at it.

[binkenstein]

I occasionally get the weapon buffs sticking at the front of the queue, and the only fix seems to be waiting for them to expire then re-casting.

[Hekili]

edit: I just pushed an alpha version, r75, which no longer checks which weapon enchant you've put on which weapon. If you're Enhancement and you have an imbue on your MH/OH, it will assume the MH is WF and the OH is FT. This avoids worrying about getting accurate translations for all the possible weapon imbue strings for each client language.

I threw in a bonus bugfix regarding interrupts. Basically, the addon would detect if the target were casting when it started predicting your next several actions, but would fail to anticipate if the enemy had finished casting. This meant Wind Shear would occasionally get recommended 2 - 3 seconds out, even though the target's spellcast had completed. This should now be resolved.

[vykas]

I occasionally get the weapon buffs sticking at the front of the queue, and the only fix seems to be waiting for them to expire then re-casting.

Happens to me too, usually when I have the wrong enchants on my weapons though--like FT on my MH and WF on OH.

[Vizslakane]

I occasionally get the weapon buffs sticking at the front of the queue, and the only fix seems to be waiting for them to expire then re-casting.

Happens to me too, usually when I have the wrong enchants on my weapons though--like FT on my MH and WF on OH.

Yep, the add-on is waiting/telling you to "fix" your weapon imbues. WF on MH and FT on OH. If you reversed them, the add-on will stay there until they are fixed.
I found that by right-clicking the weapon imbue buff to cancel them (so you don't have to wait) and them reapplying them correctly will fix this issue.