Kel'Thuzad

[Totle]

for the third time? no...he's dead.

He's... always been dead.

Except for in Caverns of Time.

[Azutael]

Well isn't he's phylactery still missing ? Just like what happened after Naxramas in classic.

Would be nice too see him again in human form though, but that would require the caverns of time or more "time travel".

[Giscoicus]

Stop it with these threads. Bring back Arthas Bring back Kel'Thuzard they were so great in lore and so deep honestly just stop. The limited lore on these characters, along with Illidan as well, does not make them interesting. You enjoyed the expansion, or just played Warcraft 3.

I dont get why you arent happier to see all the iconic orcs that we will meet in Warlords, it has far more depth to the lore than the prince who went evil or the wizard who was guided by the legion. Neither of them are super special nor deep. The scourge? That is something that could easily come back since it failed its purpose of preparing Azeroth for the legion, but neither Arthas or KT were more than just the hands of the dread lords.

Btw what happened to the Dreadlord that pissed Arthas off? Only Dreadlords know how to actually kill a dreadlord, or did I miss something? I know Arthas had run ins with a couple of them but I don't think any would reveal the secret so Arthas can kill another.
Dreadlords. THEY are interesting.

Sorry if I'm messing up the terminology, only a minor lore nerd and the names get messed up.

[Abstieg]

just no .
he is gone for good.

No, he's not. His phylactery is very glaringly missing from our Northrend encounter with him. He's very much still able to return.

[bison91]

He's been a villain TWICE already, and frankly he's not THAT interesting. Also, any reintroduction of the Scourge is going to be disappointing compared to the weight the story had when the faction was spearheaded by Arthas.

I'd much prefer Blizzard focused on building up new characters and introducing new villains as a pose to lazily resurrecting old ones.

i dont know where blizzard is going to but maybe they will res all heroes that can be good and at the end everyone will come up to fight the burning legion...if we going to experience draenor there no telling what blizzard might do with the heroes and maybe outland merges with draenor and then illidan comes and some sort of things
plus remember that some heroes are kind of not dead? look at cenarius...he was fucked up by grom axe...and hes a not demon and not in twisted nether but instead returned from emerald dream... personaly i say thats stinks...let all elfs die and they will come from there...as demons...look at NEW lich king...maybe bolvar will come back as good with his personal undead army and so on

[Arbs]

A Lich never dies unless we destory his phylactery & we have no clue were it is.

[ChadBroChill17]

I do not know if I want him to return, although he CAN because we players were too busy giving out loot to bother to destroy his Phylactery

[Imnick]

i dont know where blizzard is going to but maybe they will res all heroes that can be good and at the end everyone will come up to fight the burning legion...if we going to experience draenor there no telling what blizzard might do with the heroes and maybe outland merges with draenor and then illidan comes and some sort of things

You know that does get me thinking... Kel'Thuzad did despise the Legion...

[Murderdoll]

Id like to see the Cult of the Damned return.

[Sal the Shieldhog]

i dont know where blizzard is going to but maybe they will res all heroes that can be good and at the end everyone will come up to fight the burning legion...if we going to experience draenor there no telling what blizzard might do with the heroes and maybe outland merges with draenor and then illidan comes and some sort of things
plus remember that some heroes are kind of not dead? look at cenarius...he was fucked up by grom axe...and hes a not demon and not in twisted nether but instead returned from emerald dream... personaly i say thats stinks...let all elfs die and they will come from there...as demons...look at NEW lich king...maybe bolvar will come back as good with his personal undead army and so on

Cenarius was a demigod (mother was Elune the moon goddess, father was Malorne, The Lord of the forests; this is why Cenarius looks like a half NE, half deer being), with a intimate connection to the Emerald Dream that all Ancients have. It was only a matter of time until they manifested themselves on the mortal plane again. It's why everything we go through in the Mount Hyjal storyline happens; enough time has gone by for them to reform and come back. No Night Elf can do such a thing; once they're dead, they're pretty much wisps forever (unless Malfurion needs them to suicide bomb a demon lord).

Demons need to be killed on their home world (much like Ragnaros and the others needing to be killed in their respective planes to have a permanent death), and the only demon that we have concrete lore for is the Nathrezim. No other demon has such a background, so it's possible that only the Dreadlords need to be killed in such a way as to truly die, while the other kinds of demons can be killed on Azeroth and still be permanently dead). And while yes, Illidan looks like a Dreadlord, we don't know if he can actually count as one. For all we know, Illidan is actually gone for good.

I wouldn't count on seeing Bolvar too soon either. It took Arthas around 8 years to fully come in to his power as the Lich King. It may take Bolvar some time to acclimate to the new powers he has. And even then, revealing himself, even for good intentions, would negate the entire point he had for taking the helm in the first place. You have to remember, the only reason Bolvar took the Helm was because he was supposed to be dead, and no one, bar Tirion and the heroes that killed Arthas, know that there must always be a Lich King. So far as Joe Stromboni who runs the Goldshire infirmary is concerned, the Lich King is dead and gone, and has been for some time, and he isn't ever threatening his and his family's lives ever again.

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Id like to see the Cult of the Damned return.

They still have a few holdouts, but they're mostly gone. Most we're holed up in Scholomance and Strathlome, and we've taken care of them. As well, they don't have a leader, as KT, Gandling, and the others are gone (though KT could make a return, as we don't have his phylactery).

[Marthenil]

I got you a cool name, how about THE FORSAKEN???

Did you understood what i'm trying to say?? Yep, scourge 2.0 is already around since.... Oh yeah.

On-Topic, KT 2.0 (lorewise no one has killed KT back in classic) no please.

Well I was thinking about villains but I see where you're coming from.

[Mic_128]

while yes, Illidan looks like a Dreadlord, we don't know if he can actually count as one.

He's a Nightelf that dabbled with demonic magic and consumed the dark energies inside an orc's skull. He has no connection to the Nathrezim

[Sal the Shieldhog]

He's a Nightelf that dabbled with demonic magic and consumed the dark energies inside an orc's skull. He has no connection to the Nathrezim

For Illidan's "resurrection," people often point out that since the Nathrezim cannot be killed on Azeroth, and can only be killed on their homeworld, this might apply to Illidan because he looks quite similar to one. I was debunking this on account of we don't know. No connection is made, nor is is contradicted by anything, so it may or may not be true. He's supposed to be dead, but knowing Blizzard, he may or may not be.

[Haven]

Could we please stop with the old characters? The universe isn't supposed to forever revolve around them

[bison91]

2003-2007....4 years..not 8..how much time passed since bolvar become one? 1 year of pandas and 2 years of cata....3 years total

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and how u made this that ilidan look like dreadlord so maybe hes also a nethresim.... lol

[TheWorkingTitle]

I'm all for Kel'Thuzad making another return. The only problem I see with this is that he shouldn't be able to come back (shouldn't have even during WOTLK) considering I have his Phylactery STILL from Naxx 40 :P.

When ever I talk to a GM and they ask "is there anything else I can assist you with?" I always ask them how in the world KT is alive if I still have his phylactery from Vanilla. The answers that ensue are always hilarious

-Evil 1980's sitcom twin brother
-I've broken the space-time continuum and they aren't pleased about it
-In my younger age I may not have scooped up all his ashes into the jar
-etc etc

Some may wonder why I didn't turn it in. It used to house King Terenas' ashes until Arthas dumped them out and filled it up with KT's so I thought that was some pretty cool lore to have. My guild did not take kindly to me not turning it though, at 60

[mcbubble]

No, he's not. His phylactery is very glaringly missing from our Northrend encounter with him. He's very much still able to return.

So was the LICH king (Arthas) a true lich? If so, we killed him without finding his phylactery...

[Lochton]

Even if he did return.

The Scourge is still under control from another source, to keep them down and away. So, he wouldn't be able to demand much scourge power.

[Lolretadin]

Saying he only worked with the Scourge because the Lich King told him to is another statement. KT was working with me romantic magic even before being called by Ner'zhul, and was cast out of Dalaran because of it. He delighted in it, and even gathered others like him (the Cult of the Damned).

1) Kel'thuzad was true in his intentions for learning Necromancy, where he was afraid of another Orc invasion and wanted to be prepared.
2) He was interested in Necromancy because he was fascinated by it, it's not like he wanted to be a tyrant and rule Azeroth.
3) He went to Icecrown and the Lich King told him to create the Cult of the Damned; Kel'thuzad was chosen because he was one of the most influential Archmages of Dalaran and had both the funds and charisma to create the following that was needed.
4) The Lich King gave him an ultimatum that Kel'thuzad either served him willingly or he would become like Anub'arak (an unwilling servant).

I, personally, would like to see Kel'thuzad have a story where he's not the villain now that he's free of the Lich King. That being said, there's speculation that Ner'zhul could still be alive so that might be a problem. xD

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So was the LICH king (Arthas) a true lich? If so, we killed him without finding his phylactery...

No, the Lich King was not actually a Lich.
Ner'zhul was arguably a Lich, however.

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You know that does get me thinking... Kel'Thuzad did despise the Legion...

So did Ner'zhul... I might do a speculation thread on a theory about a connection between Yogg-saron and Ner'zhul, pertaining to mutual allies for freedom and the destruction of the Legion on Azeroth.

[Haven]

So did Ner'zhul... I might do a speculation thread on a theory about a connection between Yogg-saron and Ner'zhul, pertaining to mutual allies for freedom and the destruction of the Legion on Azeroth.

No way. Yogg fed upon death, and Scourge prevented life and death from circulating. IIRC, there was even a quest in Icecrown in which we unchained a Faceless One so that he wreaks havoc upon Scourge.