Hahahahahahaha
Genocide, death, war crimes, weapons of mass destruction.
HAHAHAHAH!
Something something Linken something something OP-obviously-just-hates-MoP-and-is-arguing-opinion-as-fact something something.
Hahahahahahaha
Genocide, death, war crimes, weapons of mass destruction.
HAHAHAHAH!
Something something Linken something something OP-obviously-just-hates-MoP-and-is-arguing-opinion-as-fact something something.
Last edited by KrazyK923; 2013-12-12 at 07:28 AM.
Last edited by MrLordDariusCrowley; 2013-12-12 at 07:34 AM.
I will agree that the Pandaren are entirely too whimsical. The Pandaren could have made for a really awesome race, but they should have been a little less friendly, less "generically wise" and more truly insightful. Lorewalker Cho should have stood alone in his open-mindedness, as should Chen Stormstout and the others of the Wandering Isle. The Pandaren of the greater landmass should have felt a bit more "serious", and they should have looked far more imposing. As seen in some recent concept-art, they should have had more bear-like qualities, and look a little more grizzled, less cartoonish.
That said, I don't think MoP was necessarily a complete bust. It definitely needed a much stronger theme -- personally, I think the "Horde vs. Alliance" angle was not only weak, but incredibly stupid to base an entire expansion around. It's a major concern I have about Warlords of Draenor, as well. People want conflict, but we're sick of seeing the same things we've already seen, and without real, meaningful victories for either faction, it's pointless to even pretend that a Horde vs. Alliance story will ever work. After all, it's not like the Horde were actually kicked out of Dalaran, were they?
That said, I do think Pandaria is absolutely gorgeous (I was genuinely sad to see the "Vale of Eternal Sorrows" replace the original world-zone), and while the Pandaren themselves could have been done worlds better, I'm still glad to see them in the game finally. Contrary to what many believe, some of us Lore-junkies have actually wanted to see the Pandaren for a long time. I just wish they were less "cute" and more intimidating.
The verdict is still out on the Monk class, though. I'm still just not quite sold on it. I'm really sad Blizzard didn't even incorporate a Legendary to showcase the Class's strength, such as a Polearm for them and Druids.
^This x1000.
@ OP: The Hozen are incredibly immature in dialogue, mostly having poop jokes. However, I don't see a different between that and collecting fox poop to cover myself in camo in Redridge on the Alliance. There was a plethora of ogre droppings in Nagrand (and any Ogre hovel on Azeroth/Outland). As Daetur mentioned, there was the Grizzly Hills outhouse. I mean, really...my Alliance toons were screaming in there. There have always been quests about poop - what makes the Hozen different? Because they SAY "dook"? (HINT: it's not different)
Anyone remember the Goblin starting area at all? Just as silly and lighthearted (if not more so) than the silliest Pandaria quests. The Gnomes, while tamer than the Goblins, are still a more lighthearted race. The Mantid, imo, were one of the more hardcore races in the expansion. They wanted to eat the "lesser races" after they conquered them. They worshiped an Old God who could cause negative emotions to create physical monsters. They fit the lore of the other insect/arachnid races of Azeroth. I assume you're complaining about their voices or something, OP? Because, there weren't that many silly things about the mantid. The only things I can think of are Ka'roz being Zorak backwards (of Space Ghost fame) and the quotes they have when you continue to click them and they mention crying. And, the Klaxxi and their enhancements are named after rock bands...but I wouldn't, still, call that immature.
References are references, and some are done in poor taste (see: half of Uldum's quests). Immaturity has always been in WoW, however that is subjective. Some people find the Hozen hilarious, some find them annoying. I find the lightheartedness of the Pandaren way of life a nice change - there aren't many playable races that openly discuss and display peace/harmony whilst practicing martial arts. It's a fine balance between the silly Goblins, angst-filled Worgen, holy Draenei, war-like Orcs, spiritual Tauren, tree-hugging Night Elves, haughty Blood Elves, etc, etc, etc.
3 hints to surviving MMO-C forums:
1.) If you have an opinion, someone will say that it is wrong
2.) If you have a source, there will be people who refuse to believe it
3.) If you use logic, it will be largely ignored
btw: Spires of Arak = Arakkoa.
What no? Warcraft isn't childish, pandas are. And yes pandas never suited Warcraft as one portrays pandas as fluffy,cute and "childish". However sticking to your post, corny jokes were a part of WoW and always were so it's not much of a problem but immature scenery? What's there immature in all the expansions prior to MoP? and poorly written dialogue? Back in Warcraft 3 all the way up till Wrath the dialogue was great but it wasn't until Cata they've started fucking up.
MoP is indeed a huge satire and it is in no way a representation of the past version(s) of WoW as times change, many of the old Vanilla/BC developers have either left or has become such a minority that they can't do what they want anymore. I bet little of you know who is Tigole and what he contributed to the game. It's such a shame what blizzard has done with MoP and to this day I still consider it as a bad april fool's joke made by Metzen where he couldn't think of anything anymore and I highly doubt he leads the major part of the lore now.
I still however, think that blizzard has the potential with WoD to fix their past mistakes and diverge the game to a more of a true "Warcraft" era rather than what was done in MoP now after lolcrawler has left. Even if you might say MoP was about war but that only began in 5.3 and onward. 5.1 was merely of something than just a storyline to be advanced later and 5.2 was trolls again and nothing nice about it with pandaren influence. The expansion might have had its bits of darkness but I'm speaking in general that it didn't suit WoW.
Indeed Cata would've been great if it wasn't for the slack of developers, so basically OP just read my inner thoughts about this expansion.
EDIT: And just abit more emphasis in case anyone says that pandas are like space cows or gnomes like in the way of satire/jokes. As I've said earlier, jokes were always a part of WoW and WoW back then had good jokes that you needed to understand them to get the joke as they weren't so obvious.
Things like "merely a setback" needed you to do the boss and know what happens next in order to feel its funny but now? I think blizzard has took the "jokes" way to far with pandaren that they really aren't funny anymore and are just lame. It's true as the OP said that there's no immersion nowadays and the leveling in pandaria is/was absolutely dreadful and boring.
Last edited by enchanted; 2013-12-12 at 07:58 AM.
On this I agree...
I just bought MoP two weeks ago and leveled both Horde and Alliance to 90. In my opinion MoP leveling was one of the most boring experiences I had in WoW and I usually loved doing quests, hell I can't push myself to finish Dread Wastes for Pandaria Loremaster. The only zone I really enjoyed was Jade Forest.
I have few issues with story right now...
1. The players and "major lore figures" are promoted to some Dragon Ball Z style superheroes. I just felt bored with every NPC being in awe how awesome I am while doing quests. It's been going this way since WotLK.
2. Too much Pop culture crap. I mean one quest with Harrison Jones was fun, but doing almost whole zone about it isn't.
3. Lack of "darker" or "mature" theme. After playing through most of the MoP zones I asked myself "That's it? Where is the Horde vs Alliance fight?", all I was doing was killing some annoying rabbits or gardening. After destroying that Jade Dragon statue I thought it might be cool theme. However it ended here, then we come to some Tiger and he says we are good and we can live happily with Pandaren. Horde and Alliance are supposed to be at war, I would love total war. Destroying this innocent land with battles and pushing Pandaren to pick sides... In World Wars there wasn't any excuse, they just destroyed anything. When I told this to my friend, he said "Comparing WoW to World Wars, really?". And why not? WoW is not serious game? Well, I remember how grotesque some missions for Scourge in Warcraft 3 could look. Sure I like happy, simple mundane day-to-day life quests, but not all the time.
MoP had strong "Morale" story, but I think it just doesn't work well in war ridden world. You just can't make both Story and Gameplay compliment each other simultaneously. They tried to go with the "Morale" story, but due the Alliance vs Horde gameplay it can't be fulfilled. However this is whole WoW story issue, actual story vs gameplay.
Actually the conflict continued into 5.1 and 5.2 and was a very rich part of the story. It's not Blizzard's fault you weren't there to experience it when it was current content. You can still go to Krasarang Wilds and Isle of Thunder and experience the storytelling that dealt with the Alliance/Horde conflict any time you so desire.
I get annoyed every time I read people saying MoP lacked in "dark, mature" subject matter. There was civil war, genocide, imperialism, and death everywhere. Just because there weren't any cliche zombies all over the place does not mean MoP was a lighthearted kiddy adventure. If anything that honor goes to the Lich King with it's whole Saturday morning cartoon routine of the Lich King popping up everywhere, taunting us, and running away after his minion fails to kill us.
What do paragons say that it sounds so corny and silly? I remember them to talk about old god and that they will kill us:/ I have to say i was interested in mantid lore, i found it interesting that they were servants of yshaarj, and i was surprised when they appeared in SOO due to garroshs´ possession of yshaarjs heart. I found that plot twist interesting, refreshing and new and it definitely helped with that immersion thing.
Have to admit that i found hozens a bit stupid and that pandaren beer in every quest, even as a spec...But i know that they can make the concent perfect for everyone.
The only thing I don't get is where there is satire and dry humor in your rant. Normally these terms would be used in a positive way, you're trying to use them for criticism but give us no hint where you think these are. So I'm assuming now you've no clue what you are talking about and just throw out random words to get people listening to your opinion that "MoP was bad". See, it's easier to say it directly.
Alright. You may have that opionion. You may even shove it down our throats all you like as well, hell as if anyone cared. But you're still not making sense. Just saying.
Your rights as a consumer begin and end at the point where you choose not to consume, and not where you yourself influence the consumed goods.
Translation: if you don't like a game don't play it.
don't give me your two cents acting like it's worth a fistful of hundreds bub.
Upon extensive review of the first post, I'm pretty sure the OP doesn't know what a satire is.
I don't think anyone minds corny jokes and pop culture references, but WoW has always been threading on this fine line with it being cartoony, with lots of cheezy humor, but still remaining serious enough for adults to enjoy it. With MoP they have crossed that line. Pandarens were done way too much in spirit of "Kung-Fu Panda" and almost everything about them was very childish. From the starting zone where you would collect these giant carrots and whatnot, to having this sort of Disney-like adventure with your "friends" to save the poor giant turtle...
I am 27 years old and this kind of fantasy that they have pushed in MoP is just not suited for me. It's suited for kids. First dungeon you play you get to kill a boss that is a huge rabbit with bunch of little fluffy bunnies helping him. They say imagination has no limits and yet they choose a huge freakin rabbit in a world that is made purely out of imagination. It just saddens me.
As its own entity MoP is ok, Pandarens are ok, but I think they have pushed the childish side of WoW way too much with it. WoW is mostly played by adults (18+) at this point.
Who said I want "cliche zombies"? I also never said it was "lighthearted kiddy adventure", it was just boring. Pandaren felt incompetent to me, I had to do most of the things for them and continue being awesome. It is not only about my third point, but all the points I made combined. Overall, in my opinion, it is mess that simply isn't interesting to me.
Yeah... I wasn't there for the most of the part of it, but don't underestimate the impact of leveling process. It is the first thing you do while getting to the max level. If it is boring, then what should keep you playing this game? Promises of future content? Good luck then.
All I said was only my opinion and I am not going to change it if you are going to attack me.
Last edited by RH92; 2013-12-12 at 08:36 AM.
All your arguments are pathetic.
Pandas are as childish? Because Cows are very adult right?
And so are elfs, and GNOMES... give me a break please.
The dialogues are as good in the past as they are now. In fact they are better now.
Either you show data to prove your point, and that means getting all dialogues of a full RAID and comparing then.
Or just shut up. If you can not bring data, don't argue.
If you think leveling is dreadful and boring, quit the game. Or better start END GAME, because that is the main focus of wow if you don't know even that.
You're so stupid! Nah nah nah. j/k
I partially agree. In short, I think WoW has always had cheesy pop-culture references, such as Haris Pilton, but I've always enjoyed those. I'm not sure that's what you're referring to when you are talking about satire.
To me, the cheesiest thing about this expansion is that it does seem a bit of a satire on Kung Fu Panda to me. I mean, when you consider the plot of Kung Fu Panda, at least the second one which is the latest one I can recall... his people were pretty much massacred in a genocide, which isn't directly similar to Pandaria but the Pandaren have always been in danger of extinction from the Mantid and so forth.
And the other major plot point is that the Crane creates this ultimate weapon that endangers everyone and is going to allow the Crane to take over the known world. Sound familiar? Maybe like Garrosh? I guess that's a pretty typical plot for any storyline though, because it fits the basic Hero meets opportunity meets conflict set of events.
But it's that on top of the fact that the Pandaren just happen to be essentially kung fu fighters. There are heavy amounts of cranes, tigers, (is there a monkey in Kung Fu Panda aka Hozen?) Mantid (mantis in Kung Fu Panda), the Tauren/Taunka or whatever (bull dude in Kung Fu Panda under leadership of Crane), goats (Goat prophet in Kung Fu Panda.) I get that these are kind of generalizing things, but the fact that all of the creatures in the land of Pandaria are pretty much mirroring the animal character line-up in Kung Fu Panda on top of the general plot.. it's pretty amusing.
Also, the scene where Po deflects the cannons in the water after finding inner peace, just reminds me of a monk spell. lol
This all could just have to do with the theme of the expansion being Asian/Chinese, and the fact that it seems kind of like the entire expansion was geared towards attracting that particular audience, but it's pretty similar if you take off the white knight blindfold and see it for what it is.
The whole expansion in general, despite the minor subtext and quests, had a very childish feel. In comparison to Cataclysm which seemed a little lackluster in general with the butchering of Deathwing and the dragon aspects, and the expansion before that being about a ruthless zombie horde and their chilling leader.. with an epic eerie 5 man dungeon that where he's chasing you down a narrow cliff like you're in a Mike Myers movie! Before that TBC was more of just a high fantasy, audience neutral expansion.
That was probably way too long, but that's my summary anyway.
Also don't forget that this expansion has been pritty dark.
Seriously there's like three funerals, one death in CHILD BIRTH, child slavery, lots of torture, racial ideology that would make a certain German leader in the late 20's - 1945 smile proudly.
yeah light, fluffy and lulzy.
If you want grimdark go watch Game of Thrones or read the 40k Universe's fluff (apart from the Cain novels because they are deliberately lulzy), WoW has never been and will never bee a serious game, but it has some serious aspects as mentioned above.
Also you have to wonder how people who go FFS KUNG FU PANDAAS?S?S?SS?A""JFJ!"!!!?ONE! would actually view this expansion if there was no Kung Fu Panda (also the Kung Fu Panda films were very enjoyable!)
I enjoyed MoP as an expansion, but in terms of story and such it felt kind of like a filler expansion. I know a lot of stuff happened with Garrosh and all, but this whole deal with going to Pandaria felt more like a sidetrack, in contrast to fighting more traditional enemies such as the Legion.
But like I said, I enjoyed Mists. And I'm looking forward to WoD.
You cannot do that while stunned.
You cannot do that while stunned.
You cannot do that while stunned.
You die.
You are dead.