Phil Robertson unsuspended from A&E

[NineSpine]

He is operating under the fallacy that every person who ever read the bible takes every word as a literally translation and therefore hates gays.

The bible is not ambivalent or open to interpretation on the issue of homosexuality. The fact is that those who choose to outwardly ignore the related passages still empower those who take those passages seriously, by granting legitimacy to the holy texts that include it. You can't go around promoting the bible as the most important book ever put together, extolling the most important truths in the universe, and NOT tacitly endorse all contained within it.

[Prag]

You seem to be under the assumption that every believer is stalwart, and that there aren't people who will be influenced in their future decision to BECOME a believer by what they see around them. While it may be true that it can be a waste of time to argue in an empty room with someone who is a complete true believer, that isn't what we are talking about. We are talking about public discourse with people who are all over the map in their level of conviction. The bible is incredibly destructive, as evidenced by how it has warped the mind of the man this thread is about.

He misquoted the Bible and made remarks in a magazine article. That's not destructive and if the homosexual crowd is going to consider it the end-all, they'll never survive as a cause.

There's still widespread racism yet we have a Black president. Who the fuck cares what this moron thinks?

[Mormolyce]

Quick correction: The book says the same God did. In reality, he didn't.

Not really sure what you're saying? What DID happen in reality?

[Moralgy]

That is all true what you quoted. That same God destroyed two large cities such as Sodom/ Gomorrah and let us not forget the known world at it's time with a great flood. Women, children. There are serous repercussions for not obeying the Creator or mocking his prophets.

If you think those stories are scary, you should see what happens when Cthulhu gets mad.

[Mormolyce]

The bible is not ambivalent or open to interpretation on the issue of homosexuality.

Depends which parts you cherrypick really. It's never once mentioned in the Gospels. Ie, Jesus came down from heaven to tell us all how to live and save our souls from damnation, but he never thought to mention that not being gay was super important. Meanwhile he went on and on about how divorce was a sin...

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If you think those stories are scary, you should see what happens when Cthulhu gets mad.

Yeah but Cthulu is fictional.

Unlike God who is... oh.

[NineSpine]

He misquoted the Bible and made remarks in a magazine article. That's not destructive and if the homosexual crowd is going to consider it the end-all, they'll never survive as a cause.

There's still widespread racism yet we have a Black president. Who the fuck cares what this moron thinks?

Every individual racist belief held by every individual human is unimportant, but who cares about that? The problem is the aggregate of all the racist beliefs in the society. The same is true for homophobia. The fact is that you can't fight those things strictly in the aggregate. Those cultural battles have to get waged in the popular culture. Challenging Phil Robertson's racism and homophobia is a legitimate and important challenge to all racism and homophobia.

Beliefs like his, and more importantly the acceptance of those beliefs as legitimate, is what leads to real hate crimes and to real discrimination.

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Depends which parts you cherrypick really. It's never once mentioned in the Gospels. Ie, Jesus came down from heaven to tell us all how to live and save our souls from damnation, but he never thought to mention that not being gay was super important. Meanwhile he went on and on about how divorce was a sin...

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Yeah but Cthulu is fictional.

Unlike God who is... oh.

Jesus makes it very clear in the New Testament that he did not come to replace the old laws. He even chastises people for disobeying the Old Testament command to stone to death disobedient children.

[Moralgy]

Depends which parts you cherrypick really. It's never once mentioned in the Gospels. Ie, Jesus came down from heaven to tell us all how to live and save our souls from damnation, but he never thought to mention that not being gay was super important. Meanwhile he went on and on about how divorce was a sin...

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Yeah but Cthulu is fictional.

Unlike God who is... oh.

How dare you insult the dark lord by calling him fictional!

[NineSpine]

Not really sure what you're saying? What DID happen in reality?

The world never flooded and Sodom & Gommorah have virtually no archaeological or historical evidence for their existence.

[Prag]

Every individual racist belief held by every individual human is unimportant, but who cares about that? The problem is the aggregate of all the racist beliefs in the society. The same is true for homophobia. The fact is that you can't fight those things strictly in the aggregate. Those cultural battles have to get waged in the popular culture. Challenging Phil Robertson's racism and homophobia is a legitimate and important challenge to all racism and homophobia.

Beliefs like his, and more importantly the acceptance of those beliefs as legitimate, is what leads to real hate crimes and to real discrimination.

Don't be so out of touch in your vigilante pursuit of justice. Giving people like this a voice is what spreads it. You can't control what people think... at least not legally.

[NineSpine]

Don't be so out of touch in your vigilante pursuit of justice. Giving people like this a voice is what spreads it. You can't control what people think... at least not legally.

You can't "control" what people think, but you can fight to change what opinions are socially acceptable, and that in turn changes what people think.

[Maoli]

I could care less about his opinion but I think it's ridiculous how people cried over him getting taken off the show in the first place. The idolizing of some of these reality celebs is really pathetic.

[Cthulhu 2020]

phil is racist, yet these people are on msnbc are supposed to be the tolerant ones.. pretty sad what they are saying.. silly me.. tolerance is a one way street, even in this thread..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ToqsAD9Lars

Everyone should be tolerant in all directions, as long as the behavior is ultimately not harmful to anyone.

Hatred of homosexuality is ultimately a harmful behavior. Crying "You need to be tolerant of my intolerance" is the biggest cop out argument of the century, and harmful behavior should not be condoned, just like murder and child molestation should not be condoned.

[Kraenen]

Depends which parts you cherrypick really. It's never once mentioned in the Gospels. Ie, Jesus came down from heaven to tell us all how to live and save our souls from damnation, but he never thought to mention that not being gay was super important. Meanwhile he went on and on about how divorce was a sin...

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Yeah but Cthulu is fictional.

Unlike God who is... oh.

yeah but you're not allowed to cherry pick passages because it's all god's eternal, absolute, supremely moral word.

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Everyone should be tolerant in all directions, as long as the behavior is ultimately not harmful to anyone.

Hatred of homosexuality is ultimately a harmful behavior. Crying "You need to be tolerant of my intolerance" is the biggest cop out argument of the century, and harmful behavior should not be condoned, just like murder and child molestation should not be condoned.

Matt Dilahunty on 'the atheist experience' made a good analogy to this. IIRCC, it's like when some school bully is beating another kid with a stick, then you intervene and take away his stick so the bully goes "hey! you aren't being tolerant of me, you're taking away my freedom!". Yeah, I have the right to take away the stick you're using to beat other people with. Stop crying that your right to attack others is taken away, bitch.

[Endus]

Okay, since people have insisted on discussing religion despite mod warnings and the site rules, I'm shutting this thread down.