All New Characters Could Start At 90

[-Superman-]

We get it. "Everyone who disagree with me is an asshole, and everyone who agrees with me is good people!"

-Superman, in every single thread he has made.

--- snipped ---

[LFPO8k]

I agree! we could also start calling the game "Crazy WoW" - elite private (zomg gear ZOMG LEVELZ)
so no -.-

[Sparky_b]

You mean the people who agreed with you? The thing about discussions and debate (especially debate), is that you WANT people to disagree with you. If all everybody did here was agree with you, what does it prove, what is gained? You see no other sides to the coin, the downsides of an idea will never be known (and there are always downsides). Don't post in a forum if all you really wanted was people to agree with you. Doesn't work that way.

[Ugum]

I would say once you have a class to max level (100), you should be allowed to start that class on that faction on any server at level 90.

[-Superman-]

You mean the people who agreed with you? The thing about discussions and debate (especially debate), is that you WANT people to disagree with you. If all everybody did here was agree with you, what does it prove, what is gained? You see no other sides to the coin, the downsides of an idea will never be known (and there are always downsides). Don't post in a forum if all you really wanted was people to agree with you. Doesn't work that way.

I don't mind discussion, or debate. But when debating an issue, there is no need to call someone lazy, or tell them how stupid they are for even suggesting such a thing. If you disagree with me, or my ideas, I can tolerate that. Insulting me in the process? Fuck that.

[Self Inflicted Wounds]

I don't mind discussion, or debate. But when debating an issue, there is no need to call someone lazy, or tell them how stupid they are for even suggesting such a thing. If you disagree with me, or my ideas, I can tolerate that. Insulting me in the process? Fuck that.

You've literally been calling anyone who disagrees with you an idiot. Lazy isn't really an insult in this instant, as your idea is essentially lazy at its core.

Your idea is just trying to skip an already easy process for no real benefit to the game as a whole, other than, "Superman doesn't feel like doing it."

[Urza29]

Anything prior to WOD would become worthless, if you aren't 90 you would be doing it wrong, everyone would be 90 quickly and there wouldn't be any life and soul left from 1-85, no one would run dungeons, doing any questing, if they can get it instantly, most would say they wouldn't do it...but there is enough that would totally go for it. The game would basically start over at 90.

Instant 90's
-Confusion and learning new class (or new role) and not having any sort of learning in-game
-Quality vs Quantity (100 bad players vs 10 good ones)

SOLUTIONS: (2)
-Full Mentoring System (like Rift) Any level at any time
-simply click your toon and select your level. Scales down to that level, able to play/dungeon/raid at that level, with max level rewards
-allow friends to play with each other, no matter the level, experience old content but new to your content or skipped content as you leveled
-Experience old raids at 70, 80 etc how they were originally and or would be simple to scale to 25 raiding.
-Allow all raids to be setup in LFR and group finder. Bonuses for finishing raids just like today's raids.

TRAINING
-full on training/tutoring system, far more in depth than simple "proving grounds".
-Start at level 1 work your way up through the levels as normal but with helping hands and proper guides along the way
-Each dungeon could have 2 modes original mode and training mode.
-In training mode the game sets objectives as you go along, heal, tank and dps.
-goal in a training mode dungeon is not just to kill mobs/bosses but to learn how to properly do so healing/tanking dps
-Tell/teach you every ability, its use, and through actively playing you can learn how to play.
-explain stuff like stats, optimal rotations, aggro...everything you need to know
-not just "fight x waves and heal x mobs" like proving grounds is atm.
-each scenario and training thing level you up, and award something new or unique, so you can real progress and be rewarded

Starting a fresh rogue for example, at level 1 it has you out questing, but as you are going along it shows you abilities and teaches you how to use them and then builds a foundation of a rotation, gain new abilities the game shows you by pushing a, then b and keeping c up, you are doing the best dps

-healing it marks/colors targets so you can click on them to heal, get used to healing, and even highlight your spells on your bar, the right heal for occasion
-tanks it marks a target you are tanking, shows you your aggro % if a party member gets aggro, point it out in the ui
--These training/tutorials are optional can start and stop them at any time.
-Scales to max level, with 90-100 being very difficult/best ones and most advanced
-Would work interactively in any dungeon, scenario or while out questing
-Highlight abilities, even number them for an optimal rotation, show you how to combine abilities
-In game journal explains what mastery/haste/crit does, why/how much your role/class needs of it
-the information from say icy-veins or other sites right in the game, intuitively, interactively.

--Completing training dungeons and modes and scenarios gains additional rewards and XP and level slightly faster by doing them as you go.
-If level 40 when system rolls out, can opt to go back to the level 1 beginning and learn from the start/catch up..and gain xp for level 40...
-Set up so that even if you know your class you may find new ways of doing things or abilities that you thought weren't going to be used

When you reach level 60 (or mentor down to 60) maybe have a new raid that is like an introductory raid, or re-purpose Molten Core, make it scale to 25 players teach you all the raiding essentials, buffs, tanking, healing and dps etc, teach you all the loot differences, and of course allow you to gain rewards for max level

That way, by the time you get to LFR at 90 you know what a raid is, how it works and whats expected/needed of you etc.

All of this can be done by max level players, if you wanted to take your level 100 warrior and scale down to level 1 and begin the
whole training process, you couldit would scale rewards for max level, so you never are losing out or wasting your time,
but the benefits of learning and teaching others....would be 1000x fold better to the game then handing fresh new clueless 90's.

Imagine an era in wow where everyone has gone through training, has done all the dungeons and experienced it all, and then enters raiding, now we have 1000's of competent or at least semi-competent raiders, granted some may opt out to learn and do it their way or on their own,and that's their choice...but even say 50% of players use this system, that's 50% more players who we can then expect to be good raiders vs brand new 90's or bad players cuz they never were taught or learned

Also this would allow people that love to quest and level, keep doing what they are doing, and even having more players/friends to choose from, because some max level players would come down to help, or be bored and hang out, do dungeons at level 15 again, or old raids such as khara again at 70 etc.

[-Superman-]

Urza29 - Thank you for taking the time to bring a solid discussion and sound solutions to this thread. If more people were as articulate and less quick to be judgmental with infantile name calling, forums would be a much more pleasant place for discussion. I love your scaling idea, and also the mentoring idea. I think it could bring a fresh perspective to the game. I also understand your reasons for disagreeing with the instant 90s. It makes sense.

[jjuice32]

Great idea Urza29 along the longs of something I've been wanting for a long time.

I'm quite tired of WoW being endgame focused only.

[Deleted]

I dont really want people to be 90 with even less idea of how to play their class than most already lack.

It would screw up queue times for those who do want to level as well.

If you want a class level it up. This game is still partly RPG, do your character progression like everybody else.

Everything you've done under max level is irrelevant and doesn't learn you to play the class unless you already know the game's basics.

[Urza29]

Also a benefit of scaling would be once you got a max level toon on a server, you could really call it your permanent home because most people only transfer to another server or re-roll on another server so they can level up and play with friends...if you have friends u want to play with or even when you roll a new toon, you friends on that server can help you out, run content with you, etc so you will never be alone...would basically allow any toon to play on any server wouldn't it? (at least of those merged servers) Open wow, choose a toon, choose a server with that toon, play!

Taking it 1 step further, they could make it so u could link yourself to your friends, (like RAF) maybe if you have a max level toon, and say your friend just started out on a different server, be able to play with your friend cross realm, but also scale down to their level...effectively playing on any server you wanted, and since with the server mergers and cross realm stuff has pretty much destroyed individual realm communities anyways...the servers are just names of your location only really, removing the bounds of where you physically are, would never have to transfer or re-roll again if you didn't want to

Cross realm RAF

my problem when i re-roll is that i have no one to play with, and feel abandoned until i get max level, if my friends are 90 and i am at level 1...its daunting to have to get all the way there just to play with them, so with scaling now my friends can move down to my level, and at least make the leveling fun and enjoyable again, than a long boring grind, with absolutely no rewards. essentially like RAF but without the super insane fast leveling, normal leveling done right.

[Mementomori1993]

So WoW should be an action adventure game?

[-Superman-]

Also a benefit of scaling would be once you got a max level toon on a server, you could really call it your permanent home because most people only transfer to another server or re-roll on another server so they can level up and play with friends...if you have friends u want to play with or even when you roll a new toon, you friends on that server can help you out, run content with you, etc so you will never be alone...would basically allow any toon to play on any server wouldn't it? (at least of those merged servers) Open wow, choose a toon, choose a server with that toon, play!

Taking it 1 step further, they could make it so u could link yourself to your friends, (like RAF) maybe if you have a max level toon, and say your friend just started out on a different server, be able to play with your friend cross realm, but also scale down to their level...effectively playing on any server you wanted, and since with the server mergers and cross realm stuff has pretty much destroyed individual realm communities anyways...the servers are just names of your location only really, removing the bounds of where you physically are, would never have to transfer or re-roll again if you didn't want to

Cross realm RAF

my problem when i re-roll is that i have no one to play with, and feel abandoned until i get max level, if my friends are 90 and i am at level 1...its daunting to have to get all the way there just to play with them, so with scaling now my friends can move down to my level, and at least make the leveling fun and enjoyable again, than a long boring grind, with absolutely no rewards. essentially like RAF but without the super insane fast leveling, normal leveling done right.

These are the types of ideas which sound great as alternative solutions. I would love to have the ability to take my main to any realm, and the ability to scale up or down would make it easy to play with friends.

[Deleted]

Wow, if level 90 characters would be bought, buying a fully geared level 100 would be cheap as fuck from a chinese gold website.

[Worgoblin]

Leveling has become so trivialized now, I honestly feel like they should just remove levels completely. Add a new system of very slow (and endless) vertical progression to go along with the gear grind.

[-Superman-]

Wow, if level 90 characters would be bought, buying a fully geared level 100 would be cheap as fuck from a chinese gold website.

Already is. You can get a lvl 1-90 leveled, with profs, and gear for less than $200 if you look hard enough. I am not for supporting groups outide of Blizz. I am for paying Blizz to let me skip the stuff I have done a hundred times to just move on to the latest content.

[BigChillin]

This is a terrible idea. First off, some people actually like the leveling experience. The queues to dungeons would be absolutely horrible and leveling would be rendered completely pointless. You would also now have a bunch of level 90's who have no idea how to play their class. That problem is already bad enough with people actually having to level to 90. At that point, why even have levels in this game? Why not just take them away and put everyone on an even keel?

It also completely removes about 7 years of content that blizzard worked on (Vanilla, BC, Wrath... etc).

This will never happen unless it was for a very large fee.

[-Superman-]

This is a terrible idea. First off, some people actually like the leveling experience. The queues to dungeons would be absolutely horrible and leveling would be rendered completely pointless. You would also now have a bunch of level 90's who have no idea how to play their class. That problem is already bad enough with people actually having to level to 90. At that point, why even have levels in this game? Why not just take them away and put everyone on an even keel?

It also completely removes about 7 years of content that blizzard worked on (Vanilla, BC, Wrath... etc).

This will never happen unless it was for a very large fee.

No one is stopping them from leveling. The dungeon queues would pick up since more people would prefer my suggestion. People who get SoR get a free 90, who have not played in 2 years, and are not shunned for being bad as an instant 90. Fact is, even once we get our free 90s in WoD, it will not be this crisis collection of bad players which everyone seems to think. I think the main reason people hate the idea is simply because they WANT to quest or dungeon for 90 levels and they will be left all alone and eventually cave to peer pressure to get an instant 90. It's not that the idea is bad, it is that their willpower is almost nil.

[Giscoicus]

No one is stopping them from leveling. The dungeon queues would pick up since more people would prefer my suggestion. People who get SoR get a free 90, who have not played in 2 years, and are not shunned for being bad as an instant 90. Fact is, even once we get our free 90s in WoD, it will not be this crisis collection of bad players which everyone seems to think. I think the main reason people hate the idea is simply because they WANT to quest or dungeon for 90 levels and they will be left all alone and eventually cave to peer pressure to get an instant 90. It's not that the idea is bad, it is that their willpower is almost nil.

Dungeon queues at low level would not pick up.

Willpower? Ha. It is a question between keeping up and enjoying yourself fully in a multiplayer game. Not skipping ahead puts you at a disadvantage simple as that.

Maybe a boosted character sits locked for 4 months then becomes playable. That would be balanced.

[-Superman-]

It's ok. I get it. Some folks just don't want others to have alternatives.

- - - Updated - - -

Maybe a boosted character sits locked for 4 months then becomes playable. That would be balanced.

Not even sure how this is relevant. If I pay for a 90, or Blizz chooses to give me one for every 3 90s I have, it should not remain locked while people who want to experience the content for the 19 billionth time take the time to do so. Not entirely sure why people are so emphatically against people who have seen it all being allowed to skip it all.