0.23% of Players Defeated Heroic Garrosh

[Deleted]

Well 0.23% i think its normal since we have to take into account that SoO is much more harder than DS. Also you have to take into account that many many people from that sample are 10man raiders. This make the amount of players (not chars) that have completed end tier boss at the best on 2,5 rate lower than it was in ICC.
But also the fact that ICC was gated, with each wing opening each month (was it? i dont remember anymore). So this also cant be a really good comparision.
DS was a faceroll for atlest first 9 bosses so basicaly this is not valid comparision either. Add the player's buffs/boss debuffs with each month after that in ICC and DS (well i dont remmeber when did they actualy started).

So if you add that the only "buff/debuff" mechanic witch is planed for SoO is the item upgrades this is actualy more than reasonable number in my eyes

P.S. Also dont forget that SoO is a very hard (atleast by my opinion) raid and also there is a lot of guilds out there that still work on their progress so maybe after fe wmore months that number might go to 2-3%+. Who knows ;P

[Deleted]

The problem with perception of difficulty is easily explained:
The pro-gamers have transferred and gathered on a few select realms increasing the average skill of the players there so far beyond that on "normal" servers that they see an apparently easy game. They fail to see that they are living in a very small nutshell.

One could argue that everybody else who wants to see endgame can follow them.
But the truth is: The majority of players plays WoW for social reasons nowadays. They want to play with friends they know for up to 9 years. For these people the alternative to "failing with the noobs they play with" is simply "stop raiding altogether". And this is happening a lot.

It puzzles me why the voice of this toxic minority has still so much weight when they have hardly ever done anything good to this game and are now just a strange leftover from the past.

Some here say that the run for worldfirsts would be done in days if blizzard lowered the hurdles. I say: So what?

[Mooshelle]

A fight that only "hundreds" could do (so like approx 50 guilds?) would be a waste of development time and resources.

A fight only a few thousand can do seems like a huge waste of development time and resources

[JoeShmo]

"The data used today is a sample made up of 6.2 million characters from 2.2 million accounts"

I have 15 lvl 90s, 1 main that killed him guess thats 14 counted as not killing him, which is dumb since most of the people don't commit to raiding on alts yet due to that data is completely inaccurare and is more likely at around 2,3%

Are you trying to say that all heroic raiders that have killed garrosh have on average 10 characters at lvl 90 and in heroic SoO?

And are you saying that people who raid heroics...have more time to level alts than people who dont put in 10+ hours a week in a raid?

You realize that if you take into consideration your 14 alts ...that the survey has to take into consideration EVERYONES alts too right? For all you know, that 0.24% could drop to 0.12% because all the people who arnt doing heroic raids...are leveling alts.

Edit: You do realize that the data was collected as PER PLAYER...and not PER CHARACTER right?

[Val the Moofia Boss]

People are not hard pressed to go the full six miles and do the final raid on the highest difficultly when they have a bunch of time to wait around and do other things first, like pet battling or RP. Also, the addition of flex allows people to do SoO on a difficultly comparitive to normal but without the need of spending several months preparing a group.

[Sengiratolom]

Linking H garrosh to the entire player base and comapring the % isn't very helpfull, checking how many that have cleared 13/14 also killed h garrosh is, as those are the ones able to engage the boss to begin with.

It is like only 0.X% of the worlds population ever stood on the eifel tower, hardly relevant if the amount of ppl that have been in paris to begin with is a ever so slightly higher %.

[Duridi]

I dunno. I don't think heroics are meant for everyone. These kills are earned by the small percent of players actually willing to put in the time and effort. The percentages seem fine to me. Also I haven't killed Heroic Garrosh yet and I'm still content with our current progression.

I don't feel like I'm entitled to the kill. If we get it we earned it.

This would be my opinion, as an ex-raider.

It never bothered me that I didn't get to kill Kil'Jaeden, or clear BWL/Naxx/AQ 20 and 40 back when I was raiding for progression. I sure as hell didn't like killing stuff if it had taken a heavy-nerf bat first. Then I'd rather not kill it at all. I was actually offended having Blizzard decide in which time-span I should be allowed to have a chance at killing a boss, before they would simplyfy it too much.

I have never been bothered by minor tweaks and adjustments, but greater nerfs has been a huge problem for me if I didn't get to kill stuff before it went live. It takes away the feeling of actually progressing.

[KaPe]

So, I have several social members in my guild - past raiders that went casual at some point and are merely there to play at their leisure, ocassionaly do Flex/Hscen, fool around in LFR. Or maybe they're just friends of our current raiders and like to be in the same guild. They have absolutely no desire to raid heroic at all and are completely fine with it.

And yet, according to some people, these guys (and gals) "failed" to kill heroic Garrosh. Supposedly, every time they log into the game, they curse the developers for designing such boss, and then proceed to cry in a corner over their failure. They are somehow part of that 99.77% that is being unfairly exploited by those heroic raiding asshole... and somehow we are in same guild. What the...?

Wait, for the matter of fact, so do I. After all, we only killed Paragons before Christmas break, so H Garrosh is still alive at this point - not for long, I hope. But heeeey, statistics don't lie, it has to be 99.77%! Nevermind that there are thirteen bosses before the G-man and each takes some time to kill, nope. They don't matter at all, it's either Garrosh or nothing.

Say, why don't we see people crying about % of people who get Gladiator every season? Surely that is too low as well, right? Those titles and mounts were designed for people, after all. Sure, someone like me doesn't give a damn about PvP, but I still count in those convenient statistics, right?

[Matt0193]

Could also be interpreted as 99.77% of players don't care, or aren't incentivized enough to finish all the content.

That sums it up for me. I play on a largely dead server, quit PvE in 5.2 to focus on PvP on another server. Come back 5.4 launch and I'm so far behind on gear. Now I'm at 545 ilvl and I still don't have an incentive to work towards HC Garrosh. If Server First 100 X was still around, I'd be farming him weekly for weapons but since that's gone I don't want, nor need, to sit farming some mind-numbingly boring shit each week.

[JoeShmo]

I see it the same way. Its not 0.23% of playerbase, that is interrested in killing HC bosses... rather ~7%. Only 0.23% are dedicated/skilled enough to put all the time in to get it done early. And consider holydays and the preparing weeks before christmast too. We lost 5 raids in december due to that. So we just started pulling Garrosh 25HC last week.

Its all a matter of time and we got plenty of that left til next addon. So all is fine and there will be 2-5% of the playerbase that pull and maybe down garrosh til then.

I would argue that the only reason that there is that 7% , is because the early heroic bosses are not tuned to be heroic at all; that rather skews the numbers.

Its not hard for a normal raiding guild to get word that the first several bosses of heroic mode are actually quite easy in comparison to the last several bosses, and furthermore in comparison to what they have been clearing in normal already its only a minor stretch of effort. This would account for the statistics up to the "hard heroic bosses" at the end of the raid, where the numbers drop off steeply, and again drop off for Garrosh.

Im sure that there are legit heroic raiding guilds that pushed or continue to push for the Garrosh kill, as well as im sure that there are normal raiding guilds that saw the opportunity to clear out bosses within their grasp, stopping once they hit that brick wall for their level of raiding; and in the same breath, there were guilds that set off on that heroic journey hap haphazardly, and died off in the process.

A good example of this from my past experience was back in every iteration of wow, there was always the "loot boss" . Those bosses that you could do from a higher raid because they had a facepalm mechanic; IE: Lootreaver from SSC. Theres one in every raid, intentional by blizzard to ease people in, or unintentional because people figured out how to game it. I wouldnt call those types of raids as "legit" raids for those instances, because they are basically just scavenging what they can get. In the case of heroic SoO , there seems to be a broad consensus that the first several bosses fit this type of description; normal / flex guilds can still make good attempts and progress with these bosses, even more so if they have had normals on farm and had never planned on doing heroics. If a guild IS having a problem with later bosses in normal SoO , whos to say they wont jump on the heroic versions for the early bosses, the ones they know they can beat/farm , for some better iLvl gear. This kind of thing has been happening for years with progression..and even pickup groups know which bosses to pick at for easier drops.

How many people EVER did normal Dropship in ICC? Huh? I cant hear you...Im too busy doing H Lootship, speak up.


So I would say that the only "Real" heroic raiders progressing right now, are the ones hitting that 0.23% place or dang close. They are the ones putting in the time and elbow grease to do heroic content. Again, the consensus states that the first several bosses arnt the problem, as such the ones that can progress past those "easy" bosses...are the ones that are doing heroic raiding.

So you have the ones that are progressing in heroic content, the ones that are doing the easier bosses and hitting a wall, and those that arnt even bothering to do it.

The numbers may not change "that" much with those in consideration, but its certainly a lower number in actuality than what we perceive on paper as "the heroic raiders" . And yet, in either case, its still much too low a number to NOT be concerned about, be that over the difficulty of the heroic raid or by how much work is being done for a part of the game that hardly anyone is completing or doing.


Holidays sure do have a way of getting in front of raids though, but so does having school semesters end allow slots in the raid to fill up easier.

[Bizerk]

There's plenty of casual content in this game already, leave the rest for people who want it.

[Buildapanda]

My first time ever heroic raiding I got poached by a guild on my server needing a mistweaver. I reluctantly agreed as I wanted to progress and my old 10m was stuck on heroic immerseus.

So I joined this new 25m heroic guild. They love my leet heals I guess. But then we get to heroic 25m immerseus and nobody know how to stand in a puddle. One month of wipes was enough for me and I quit the game, Lasted I checked they only killed malkarok once....

That's unacceptable for a top 10 heroic raiding guild on a top 5 population server.

Edit: Just checked and they killed him 7 hours ago... I havn't logged in wow for over a month.................

[Maniac2]

0.23%? This number would be much higher if many people didnt give up during Wrath and Cata and new people cant get in guilds that might be capable of this.
Im sure I would be there too, problem is I dont care about heroic raiding anymore. Doing one LFR per tier gives me everything I need, see the fight and boss and thats it.

[thunderdragon2]

Going off the stats on the front page, 0.23% of players (not characters) have defeated Heroic Garrosh. Of the 2.2 million sampled, that comes out to be like 5,000 players. Also keep in mind we are exactly 4 months out from this patch's release and the final boss has been killed by a quarter of a percent of players. What do you guys think? Is this too much, or too little? At 4 months out, how many players do you think should've been able to defeat the last boss on heroic?

tbh i think that number is fairly accurate of how many players i think should have killed this many of the bosses are very hard, my guild is 5/14 and are still progressing on shaweve had a good few 14-20% wipes so were getting there and from what i kinow shaman,malkrok and spoils are harder than him...so...

[Madruga]

Going off the stats on the front page, 0.23% of players (not characters) have defeated Heroic Garrosh. Of the 2.2 million sampled, that comes out to be like 5,000 players. Also keep in mind we are exactly 4 months out from this patch's release and the final boss has been killed by a quarter of a percent of players. What do you guys think? Is this too much, or too little? At 4 months out, how many players do you think should've been able to defeat the last boss on heroic?

If I were the developer, I would be annoyed by such a low number of Heroic Garrosh kills. I mean, heroic bosses is probably the content that takes the largest ammount of time, apart from building the raid itself, because it requires tighter tuning than LFR, Flex and Normal, meaning more development time. They might fall into that "hard to justify" thing from when they made raids more casual.

That said, it is been only 4 months in 5.4, with the Hollidays in the middle of the way... The Hollidays often mean guilds lose up to 1 month of progression. My guild, itself, lost 3 weeks. We could be at Heroic Siegecrafter if not for that, but we had to suspend progression on Heroic Nazgrim.

Perhaps Blizzard IS aiming at the 5% mark until the end of SoO. We can expect progression to further quite a bit now that guilds are back on track.

[Deleted]

It's good that content is hard. I don't know why people always have to make threads on how many people actually kill the final heroic tier, ITS SUPPOSED TO BE HARD.

[Buckyboyd]

People keep comparing this percentage to the total number of players in the game. What you don't realize is that everyone doesn't raid. Compare this percentage to the amount of people who have attempted, say flex raiding and up. Then you'll have a better representation of how many people, who care about raiding more than just queueing up for lfr, have killed the hardest boss in the game.

[Deleted]

If I were the developer, I would be annoyed by such a low number of Heroic Garrosh kills. I mean, heroic bosses is probably the content that takes the largest ammount of time, apart from building the raid itself, because it requires tighter tuning than LFR, Flex and Normal, meaning more development time. They might fall into that "hard to justify" thing from when they made raids more casual.

That said, it is been only 4 months in 5.4, with the Hollidays in the middle of the way... The Hollidays often mean guilds lose up to 1 month of progression. My guild, itself, lost 3 weeks. We could be at Heroic Siegecrafter if not for that, but we had to suspend progression on Heroic Nazgrim.

Perhaps Blizzard IS aiming at the 5% mark until the end of SoO. We can expect progression to further quite a bit now that guilds are back on track.

Well, the developers designed different iterations of the fight for a reason. People still see the fight in diffent modes. There is barely any differences between garrosh in normal and heroic anyway bar the dps check. It is pretty safe to assume that they are not concerned with how many players will get the see Garrosh HC when it is so similar to all the other iterations. Their only concern is probably making it as big of a challenge as possible.

5% is highly overestimating though unless SoO gets heavily nerfed. A guild that is around that 10-11/14H mark is still months and months and months away from Garrosh. If all the guilds that currently killed siege kills garrosh, numbers would only rise to 0.75%. To get to 5%, then all the guilds who have killed about 3-4 heroic bosses would have to kill Garrosh. That is simply not gonna happen. SoO starts at Thok. Guilds that are 3-4 heroic bosses at this stage has no chance of ever seeing a phase of heroic garrosh.

- - - Updated - - -

Then you'll have a better representation of how many people, who care about raiding more than just queueing up for lfr, have killed the hardest boss in the game.

Final boss =/= hardest boss.

[Amerissis]

Waste of resources to make/tune heroic raids, that much is obvious.

[Deleted]

Guilds that are 3-4 heroic bosses at this stage has no chance of ever seeing a phase of heroic garrosh.

Biggest load of bollocks i've ever read