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  1. #101
    Scarab Lord nightfalls's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Firebert View Post
    If we're not supposed to cap it, why is it cappable?
    Because alternative strats call for alternative methods. If what is seen as the best strat given both sides' play (not just one, by the way) is not capping a GY, then that is fine. It doesn't mean the GY should never be cappable.

  2. #102
    Quote Originally Posted by Kaleredar View Post
    He'll prattle off a whole list of things that are no longer relevant like "oh well the bridge..." Yeah, when was the last time a match was decided by a team fight on the bridge? Horde don't even try, and they lose. And instead of comprehending this, it must CERTAINLY be a case of "Alliance are favored so heavily that by being in the very BG, the Horde are afflicted."

    At any rate... hopefully they fixed the bugs with summoning Ivus. As it stands now, if any of the druids even get smacked during the summoning process, they bug out and don't summon him.

    I'm going to do it one day...
    I find it interesting that in the BG inforgraphic posted on the MMO main page a few weeks ago (http://www.mmo-champion.com/content/...Tweets-DLC-424), the win ratio of AV & IoC was hugely in Alliance favor. Something that seems to be a self fulfilling prophecy when so many Horde seem to black list it and refuse to do it, and you don't have to look far to hear some Horde get on their soap box about it.

    Yet every single other BG had a much higher win ratio by the Horde. But those, of course, are perfectly balanced.

  3. #103
    I am Murloc! Firebert's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by voidspark View Post
    Because alternative strats call for alternative methods.
    And it only takes one person to force a PvP situation by capping that graveyard, which is why I cap it every single time.
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  4. #104
    I am Murloc! ringpriest's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deathgoose View Post
    I find it interesting that in the BG inforgraphic posted on the MMO main page a few weeks ago (http://www.mmo-champion.com/content/...Tweets-DLC-424), the win ratio of AV & IoC was hugely in Alliance favor. Something that seems to be a self fulfilling prophecy when so many Horde seem to black list it and refuse to do it, and you don't have to look far to hear some Horde get on their soap box about it.

    Yet every single other BG had a much higher win ratio by the Horde. But those, of course, are perfectly balanced.
    I think most Horde players agree Silvershard Mine is definitely biased in favor of Horde. You can also argue that Twin Peaks also has a small Horde bias, in that the 'non-ground' side exit from the Ally base can theoretically allow a Horde FC to speed and slow-fall over much of the BG, while the equivalent Horde exit is water. (Which has it's own advantages and disadvantages, but may not be exactly equal.) Strand is even. In AB it's slighty easier for Allies to semi-cheat by getting on the Stable roof, but that's pretty minor. WSG is pretty damn balanced once clipping issues in and around the Ally base were fixed. EotS seems even. I haven't played enough Deepwind Gorge or Temple to have an opinion. Gilneas isn't perfectly symmetrical, but I haven't noticed any particular features that benefit one faction more than another.

  5. #105
    Without bringing in faction imbalance (there isn't any, it's a myth and most of the "imbalances" are bad players not taking time to research the map), the changes:

    - Generals feel pretty decent now. They have just under 100m hitpoints and hit pretty decently with 2 marshals or warmasters with them now. Should be much easier to defend a general now with two buffs. This was before the buff to damage and health for the marshals and warmasters.
    - Captains have 39 million health. Still low in health, damage felt decent except for Balinda who has not had her damage or elemental buffed (only melee damage was increased, spell damage not - hopefully fixed this build)
    - Bowmen have 1.5m hp, shoot for an average of 16k now maxxing at 20k.
    - Graveyard guardians have 271k health, hit for an average of 15k, still pathetically weak sadly.

    Overall this should hopefully change the dynamic of AV games and make it so at least 3 towers/bunkers have to be destroyed before players can go all in. It should really be all of them but this is the best we can hope for.

    Also - not mentioned in the patch notes or in this thread - the map has actually been slightly modified. The snow ramps leading into the Horde base have been completely removed (can no longer jump the fence), and the hole in the wall next to West Frostwolf Tower has been sealed so players now MUST go through the gate of Frostwolf Village, through the little hut and again through the gate leading into Frostwolf's fortress. This essentially gives the Horde two additional, solidified chokepoints.

  6. #106
    Quote Originally Posted by Kaleredar View Post
    He'll prattle off a whole list of things that are no longer relevant like "oh well the bridge..." Yeah, when was the last time a match was decided by a team fight on the bridge? Horde don't even try, and they lose. And instead of comprehending this, it must CERTAINLY be a case of "Alliance are favored so heavily that by being in the very BG, the Horde are afflicted."

    At any rate... hopefully they fixed the bugs with summoning Ivus. As it stands now, if any of the druids even get smacked during the summoning process, they bug out and don't summon him.

    I'm going to do it one day...
    Yeah cause the alliance passing the horde at the graveyard BEFORE the open area isn't an imbalance. Alliance have the shorter path to get across the map. Same in AB. Alliance can cap stables at least 5 secs before horde can get farm.
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  7. #107
    I am Murloc! ringpriest's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oo View Post
    Also - not mentioned in the patch notes or in this thread - the map has actually been slightly modified. The snow ramps leading into the Horde base have been completely removed (can no longer jump the fence), and the hole in the wall next to West Frostwolf Tower has been sealed so players now MUST go through the gate of Frostwolf Village, through the little hut and again through the gate leading into Frostwolf's fortress. This essentially gives the Horde two additional, solidified chokepoints.
    That's actually a huge change. (If the Horde ever learns to D.)

  8. #108
    Quote Originally Posted by Pandragon View Post
    Yeah cause the alliance passing the horde at the graveyard BEFORE the open area isn't an imbalance. Alliance have the shorter path to get across the map. Same in AB. Alliance can cap stables at least 5 secs before horde can get farm.
    Yet both factions reach their respective aid stations within 3-4 seconds of each other. Yeah, huge imbalance there. How often do games come down to 3 seconds again?

  9. #109
    Quote Originally Posted by Raiju View Post
    Most of the thread has been about whether AV favours alliance or not - if it does then that is the reason for alliances higher winrate there.
    Non sequitur -- it could be that alliance is favored in AV, but that the high win rate is due to something else.
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  10. #110
    Why does alliance win most of the AV and IoC? Also why doesnt horde cap docks in IoC to get glaives? The map is symmetrical so horde has equal travel time.

  11. #111
    Quote Originally Posted by Cle View Post
    Why does alliance win most of the AV and IoC? Also why doesnt horde cap docks in IoC to get glaives? The map is symmetrical so horde has equal travel time.
    Ioc is not symetrical.

  12. #112
    Quote Originally Posted by Ettan View Post
    Ioc is not symetrical.
    Travel time to docks is still identical for horde and alliance.

  13. #113
    I am Murloc! ringpriest's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cle View Post
    Why does alliance win most of the AV and IoC? Also why doesnt horde cap docks in IoC to get glaives? The map is symmetrical so horde has equal travel time.
    To respond to your second point first, it seems to take the horde about 3-5 seconds longer to reach the flag at the docks. The docks flag is slightly closer to the Alliance keep, while the hangar flag is about the same amount closer to the Horde keep.

    As for why alliance wins so many AV & IoC games these days? It's because more dedicated (i.e. more experienced and likely better-geared) Horde PvP players blacklist both BGs, leaving them for mostly noobs, honor farmers, and bots. It's a positive feedback loop.

  14. #114
    Epic! Warlord Booty's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Itisamuh View Post
    I see nothing about making it less imbalanced in favor of Alliance, so I see no reason to care.
    Well, all it does is help the alliance. Cuz the alliance can avoid most the the horde NPCs, and the horde can't, so that just takes the horde an extra 3-4 seconds, when they are already behind by 12 seconds.

    Remains blacklisted for me.

  15. #115
    Quote Originally Posted by Warlord Booty View Post
    Well, all it does is help the alliance. Cuz the alliance can avoid most the the horde NPCs, and the horde can't, so that just takes the horde an extra 3-4 seconds, when they are already behind by 12 seconds.

    Remains blacklisted for me.
    During my years in wow career, I have never seen AV decided by 16seconds

  16. #116
    Dreadlord Fungj's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cle View Post
    During my years in wow career, I have never seen AV decided by 16seconds
    Happened multiple times that we lose when the boss is at just a couple of %.

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