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  1. #101
    Biased attack against the shop when Services like RaF and SoR have offered better long-term benefits, but instead the focus is only on the shop.
    Petty and biased attack with no founding.

    Communities were killed by players, not blizzard.
    More tools to communicate than ever, less willingness to use them.
    If people would rather queue with randoms then deal with their own server then that should be very telling.

    Group/elite quests only worked when the levelling population was active, and actually willing.
    When they aren't those quests become inaccessible at their intended level and are either skipped outright or come back to later when you outgear/outlevel them.

    Raiding should be about your ability to perform at a sufficient or expected standard, but instead people insist it should be about who has the most convenient real life.
    Stop whining about how your "real raiding" is dying, and instead look at how the arrogance and elitism infecting it is pushing people away to LFR where there is less drama and less ego.

    Squish we have not experienced, yet people whine about it. Stupid as usual.
    The squish is NOT impacting on ability to solo or kill anything. Not a single thing.
    OTHER changes are, such as base stats.

    LFR has to take into account those completely new to raiding.
    Because YOU are experienced and way above it, does not mean everyone in it always will be.
    If you don't like it, don't join it or do something to better the experience in it.
    Don't complain when you aren't willing to do anything.

    Homogenisation is necessary to prevent one class being mandatory.
    With a smaller quantity of classes you could get away with more, but you can't now.

    PvP was a player demand, not part of the original design.
    As proven by the shift to instanced rather than world pvp, it proves that fun was never as big a factor as some like to remember.
    Instead it is all about the rewards, all about the shiny pixels.
    Players killed World PvP, not flying. World PvP is not individual ganking, the only thing flying hurt.
    Flying offers greater access to cities, but despite that who actually raids the cities any more ?
    A better tool, but nobody is using it.

    PvP and PvE seperation is a scaling issue.
    It is absoutely necessary as shown by the numbers.
    Look at what you would hit for without resilience.
    PvP would only be about who hit first, and not about any versus component.
    PvE burst is out of control when introduced into a PvP environment with smaller healthpools on the opponents.

    Dailies are not a problem, but the gating of pretty effective if not near mandatory gear was the issue.
    Should be more optional/cosmetic/fun rewards behind reputations.
    Less gear, more fun stuff.

    The vast majority are petty attacks on features of the game that someone decides they don't like with no consideration for the reasons.
    Quote Originally Posted by DeadmanWalking View Post
    I don't understand why we don't have flying so they tell us we will have convenient flight points. Immersion and danger? Here take some coins and fly me there while I read facebook or go take a poop.
    Quote Originally Posted by Reinaerd View Post
    T'is good to see there are still people valiantly putting the "Ass" in assumption.

  2. #102
    Warchief Jayburner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Seditian View Post
    You seem to live in the past. MoP completely destroyed world PvP. Raiders can shit on a group of 3 fully PvP geared players without breaking a sweat. Besides, with your logic, a person who hunts on bears and practices exorcisms on people would have more knowledge about a duel than a Gladiator in Rome. Which needless to say, is wrong. Equally skilled PvP geared players stomping you, a PvE geared player in a duel makes perfect sense.
    Okay I miss kicking peoples asses with my askandi/aq40/bwl gear lol.
    "Beer is proof God loves us and wants us to be happy"

    --- Benjamin Franklin

    Jayburner -- Sargeras US --Quite possibly the world's greatest raid finder fury warrior. One time tank long time ago.

  3. #103
    1. Reducing the amount of commitment people have to put in their character.
    2. The lack of a proper 'training' for people to play in groups in heroic dungeons and raids. In vanilla and tbc things might have been a bit too hard, but this dungeon rushing while leveling we do atm is just stupid.
    3. The transition from being a world of warcraft to a world of 'interface' click and teleports. (Who travels the vast world they created regularly?!)
    4. Removing the social part of grouping. Everyone just wants to get their rewards asap, or we kick, leave or whatever.

  4. #104
    Pit Lord NuLogic's Avatar
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    I don't understand why everyone hates lfd and lfr. I would hate to see what would happen to most servers if lfd wasn't available..Illidown.

    Flying pretty much stopped ganking as most people who like world pvp where still on the ground looking for victims. Besides a lot of people flocked to servers like llidian and Sargeras because they're 98% one faction.

    Store is full of shitty re-skinned(isn't this what player's cry about) mounts so who cares.

    Wow was always the casual friendly alternative mmo so get over it.

  5. #105
    In no particular order cause none stand out:

    -Scenarios
    -disregarding dungeons in MoP
    -possibly LFR, it has its pros

    2 things Im really torn on:
    -MoP: On one hand I agree with people saying it doesnt feel Warcraft, on the other it was a great expansions with loads of awesome features
    -Linear questing: On one hand it makes questing more smooth and enables the incorparations of involving storylines and general epicness (see Hyjal, Vashjir, Deepholm) on the other it feels, like others have said, like a single player game. I loved the cata and mop zones but I really miss the oldschool zones too.

  6. #106
    Quote Originally Posted by ComputerNerd View Post
    Biased attack against the shop when Services like RaF and SoR have offered better long-term benefits, but instead the focus is only on the shop.
    Petty and biased attack with no founding.

    Communities were killed by players, not blizzard.
    More tools to communicate than ever, less willingness to use them.
    If people would rather queue with randoms then deal with their own server then that should be very telling.

    Group/elite quests only worked when the levelling population was active, and actually willing.
    When they aren't those quests become inaccessible at their intended level and are either skipped outright or come back to later when you outgear/outlevel them.

    Raiding should be about your ability to perform at a sufficient or expected standard, but instead people insist it should be about who has the most convenient real life.
    Stop whining about how your "real raiding" is dying, and instead look at how the arrogance and elitism infecting it is pushing people away to LFR where there is less drama and less ego.

    Squish we have not experienced, yet people whine about it. Stupid as usual.
    The squish is NOT impacting on ability to solo or kill anything. Not a single thing.
    OTHER changes are, such as base stats.

    LFR has to take into account those completely new to raiding.
    Because YOU are experienced and way above it, does not mean everyone in it always will be.
    If you don't like it, don't join it or do something to better the experience in it.
    Don't complain when you aren't willing to do anything.

    Homogenisation is necessary to prevent one class being mandatory.
    With a smaller quantity of classes you could get away with more, but you can't now.

    PvP was a player demand, not part of the original design.
    As proven by the shift to instanced rather than world pvp, it proves that fun was never as big a factor as some like to remember.
    Instead it is all about the rewards, all about the shiny pixels.
    Players killed World PvP, not flying. World PvP is not individual ganking, the only thing flying hurt.
    Flying offers greater access to cities, but despite that who actually raids the cities any more ?
    A better tool, but nobody is using it.

    PvP and PvE seperation is a scaling issue.
    It is absoutely necessary as shown by the numbers.
    Look at what you would hit for without resilience.
    PvP would only be about who hit first, and not about any versus component.
    PvE burst is out of control when introduced into a PvP environment with smaller healthpools on the opponents.

    Dailies are not a problem, but the gating of pretty effective if not near mandatory gear was the issue.
    Should be more optional/cosmetic/fun rewards behind reputations.
    Less gear, more fun stuff.

    The vast majority are petty attacks on features of the game that someone decides they don't like with no consideration for the reasons.
    Thank you. This is a good post.

  7. #107
    1. Class Homogenization

    Instead of wanting each class and valuing diversity, it's now just all about ilvl and Output Per Second. Even if a class under-performed, it still had a spot because of it's unique utility.

    Maybe I want a class like the old school rogue; zero utility, but the highest single target damage in the game. Or maybe I want a class that is the lowest damage class, but brings amazing support abilities. All of those choices are ruined. You do the same DPS as everyone else and you bring the same utility. Why do we even have classes anymore?

    2. Flying Mounts

    They've ruined world PvP. They've ruined questing. They've ruined gathering and the economy. But above all, they've spoiled everyone and there's no going back with out some seriously painful rage.

    They could've simply improved other forms of transport like hearthstones and flight paths.

    3. Separation of PvP and PvE progression

    The gear should be equal. Blizzard says it's to keep either side from feeling like they need to do something they hate to compete. Well if you force yourself to do something you hate, that's your fault. If people really can't control themselves, make a limit to the amount of gear your can get in a week. You can earn 4 epics from either PvP or PvE per week. All from one side, or a split between them both. After 4 you can only earn gear from one or the other. But who cares other than elitists?

    TLDR: People should be able to play whatever they feel like, whenever they want and not have to start at the bottom of PvE when they are a legendary PvP'er or vice-versa

    4. Making LFR the only way to catch up for real endgame content.

    People can't get into Normal difficulty raiding guilds without first running LFR half a hundred times. By the time they gear for it, the raid is boring, repetitive, and the player is suffering from burnout.

    It should be like this.

    LFR gear = Heroic/Challenge Dungeon Gear = Gear Crafted from non-raid materials

    If I want to join normal, I might not want to do the same raid 50 times first.

    5. PvP in general

    I feel like Blizzard has really dropped the ball when it comes to PvP.

    Consolidate PvP currencies, make it all just Honor. You buy pvp set 1 and then upgrade it with that piece and some additional honor to PvP set 2. Just like justice heirlooms.

    Give each win a chance to give you USEFUL loot similar to LFR style looting.

    Battlegrounds:

    There should only be 3 battleground game types: Capture the flag, King of the Hill(s), and Attack/Defend. Each type should have multiple maps to keep them fresh.

    Factions should be pitted against each other to balance and alleviate queues.


    Arenas:

    Get rid of 5's. Balance around 2's and 3's for ratings and rewards. Introduce 1v1 for fun, still with some PvP points but also with some Brawler's guild type rewards for participating.

    World PvP:

    Everyone wants it and Blizzard seems to be phasing out leveling anyways so that excuse is gone. Balance it with player scaling. Reward it like PvE and questing. Just do it.

  8. #108
    The fact that people feel the need to cry about a fucking game amazes me. If you dont like the fucking game don't play it. But there is no need for crybaby threads asking where Blizzard went wrong. The fact is they did not go wrong anywhere. It is their game, their company, and their money. If they want to make the whole fucking thing rainbows and unicorns who the fuck are you to judge them? You are a random internet douche that feels entitled to having the game you want, when it has nothing to do with you. Let them make their game how they want and stop being little bitches.

    TLDR; Stop crying no one cares.

    And no I am not a fanboi. I have already unsubbed and will be playing Wildstar when it comes out. Just tired of all these little bitches thinking they are entitled to other's work. It is not your game stfu.

  9. #109
    Quote Originally Posted by Yrrildur View Post
    4. Removing the social part of grouping. Everyone just wants to get their rewards asap, or we kick, leave or whatever.
    And how exactly did they directly cause that? Easier said than done to inffluence your playerbase to be nice and friendly to eachother. That's what guilds are for.

  10. #110
    1. Cataclysm talent trees
    2. Removal of spell power from armor
    3. LFR
    4. PvP grind/battleground changes
    5. Realm transfers

  11. #111
    Quote Originally Posted by ComputerNerd View Post
    bunch-o-crap
    Stop padding your post count by posting off-topic.
    No one is forcing you to enter a thread clearly marked to get people's opinions about bad decisions.
    Are you so insecure?

  12. #112
    Warchief Jayburner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pastar View Post
    The fact that people feel the need to cry about a fucking game amazes me. If you dont like the fucking game don't play it. But there is no need for crybaby threads asking where Blizzard went wrong. The fact is they did not go wrong anywhere. It is their game, their company, and their money. If they want to make the whole fucking thing rainbows and unicorns who the fuck are you to judge them? You are a random internet douche that feels entitled to having the game you want, when it has nothing to do with you. Let them make their game how they want and stop being little bitches.

    TLDR; Stop crying no one cares.

    And no I am not a fanboi. I have already unsubbed and will be playing Wildstar when it comes out. Just tired of all these little bitches thinking they are entitled to other's work. It is not your game stfu.
    My 9+year non-stop subscription would like to have a word with you.
    "Beer is proof God loves us and wants us to be happy"

    --- Benjamin Franklin

    Jayburner -- Sargeras US --Quite possibly the world's greatest raid finder fury warrior. One time tank long time ago.

  13. #113
    1) Cataclysm

    2) MoP.

    3) Going P2W in WoD.
    Garrosh: "LOK'TAR! HAVE A HAMBURGER."


    I am The Burning Legion - Play Free Online Games

  14. #114
    LFR, arenas, brick wall at the beginning of cata, pandaria as an xpac, trying to balance 10/25

  15. #115
    Quote Originally Posted by pastar View Post
    The fact that people feel the need to cry about a fucking game amazes me. If you dont like the fucking game don't play it. But there is no need for crybaby threads asking where Blizzard went wrong. The fact is they did not go wrong anywhere. It is their game, their company, and their money. If they want to make the whole fucking thing rainbows and unicorns who the fuck are you to judge them? You are a random internet douche that feels entitled to having the game you want, when it has nothing to do with you. Let them make their game how they want and stop being little bitches.

    TLDR; Stop crying no one cares.

    And no I am not a fanboi. I have already unsubbed and will be playing Wildstar when it comes out. Just tired of all these little bitches thinking they are entitled to other's work. It is not your game stfu.
    I think youre missing the point of this thread.

    The points of this thread is too discuss the mistakes that Blizzard has made. It's perfectly normal for a company to make mistakes. Everyone does. And maybe Blizzard will see this and be influenced to not make those mistakes again.

    How can a company improve their game when they get no criticism from their playerbase?

    And this is coming from a "fanboy" with WoW as his favorite game of all time.

  16. #116
    Quote Originally Posted by Jayburner View Post
    My 9+year non-stop subscription would like to have a word with you.
    And in which one of those years did they come to your house with a gun, and made you pay. It was your choice to pay for the shit. That still does not give you any right over what happens to the game. If you do not like the game quit giving them your money.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by jabulaniman View Post
    I think youre missing the point of this thread.

    The points of this thread is too discuss the mistakes that Blizzard has made. It's perfectly normal for a company to make mistakes. Everyone does. And maybe Blizzard will see this and be influenced to not make those mistakes again.

    How can a company improve their game when they get no criticism from their playerbase?

    And this is coming from a "fanboy" with WoW as his favorite game of all time.
    The fact is you see mistakes where they might see nothing wrong. Speak with your wallet not random post on fan sights. If they thought they were mistakes they would fix them.

  17. #117
    Quote Originally Posted by crakerjack View Post
    Subs are continuing to drop and you think we should pretend the game doesn't have issues? Ok...
    The subs are declining yes, but I see little truth to most of the reasons players state.
    If players could give better arguments, rather than the same regurgitated stuff which has been debunked dozens of times previously, then we might get somewhere.
    Those using the same tired and flawed arguments time and time again are the ones pretending.

    Look in the mirror and they might not like what they see.
    The community is playing a bigger part in the decline than they like to admit.

    The game is attracting and keeping hold of less new players, when before it was a healthier supply in than there was out.
    Something IS putting those players off long before they reach level cap, or before they even play at all.
    Now that only leaves a single option, the players in there already.

    Quote Originally Posted by Roadblock View Post
    Stop padding your post count by posting off-topic.
    No one is forcing you to enter a thread clearly marked to get people's opinions about bad decisions.
    Are you so insecure?
    Yet you provide no argument against what I said, and throw out a baseless accusation about post counts.
    Point proven.

    It is a DISCUSSION forum if you didn't notice.
    If you want to post something where nobody can disagree with you, then go make a blog or something.
    Last edited by ComputerNerd; 2014-01-26 at 09:03 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by DeadmanWalking View Post
    I don't understand why we don't have flying so they tell us we will have convenient flight points. Immersion and danger? Here take some coins and fly me there while I read facebook or go take a poop.
    Quote Originally Posted by Reinaerd View Post
    T'is good to see there are still people valiantly putting the "Ass" in assumption.

  18. #118
    Quote Originally Posted by ComputerNerd View Post
    Biased attack against the shop when Services like RaF and SoR have offered better long-term benefits, but instead the focus is only on the shop.
    Petty and biased attack with no founding.

    Communities were killed by players, not blizzard.
    More tools to communicate than ever, less willingness to use them.
    If people would rather queue with randoms then deal with their own server then that should be very telling.

    Group/elite quests only worked when the levelling population was active, and actually willing.
    When they aren't those quests become inaccessible at their intended level and are either skipped outright or come back to later when you outgear/outlevel them.

    Raiding should be about your ability to perform at a sufficient or expected standard, but instead people insist it should be about who has the most convenient real life.
    Stop whining about how your "real raiding" is dying, and instead look at how the arrogance and elitism infecting it is pushing people away to LFR where there is less drama and less ego.

    Squish we have not experienced, yet people whine about it. Stupid as usual.
    The squish is NOT impacting on ability to solo or kill anything. Not a single thing.
    OTHER changes are, such as base stats.

    LFR has to take into account those completely new to raiding.
    Because YOU are experienced and way above it, does not mean everyone in it always will be.
    If you don't like it, don't join it or do something to better the experience in it.
    Don't complain when you aren't willing to do anything.

    Homogenisation is necessary to prevent one class being mandatory.
    With a smaller quantity of classes you could get away with more, but you can't now.

    PvP was a player demand, not part of the original design.
    As proven by the shift to instanced rather than world pvp, it proves that fun was never as big a factor as some like to remember.
    Instead it is all about the rewards, all about the shiny pixels.
    Players killed World PvP, not flying. World PvP is not individual ganking, the only thing flying hurt.
    Flying offers greater access to cities, but despite that who actually raids the cities any more ?
    A better tool, but nobody is using it.

    PvP and PvE seperation is a scaling issue.
    It is absoutely necessary as shown by the numbers.
    Look at what you would hit for without resilience.
    PvP would only be about who hit first, and not about any versus component.
    PvE burst is out of control when introduced into a PvP environment with smaller healthpools on the opponents.

    Dailies are not a problem, but the gating of pretty effective if not near mandatory gear was the issue.
    Should be more optional/cosmetic/fun rewards behind reputations.
    Less gear, more fun stuff.

    The vast majority are petty attacks on features of the game that someone decides they don't like with no consideration for the reasons.
    A post I almost completely agree with. Except for the "Players kill World PvP, not Blizzard" part. Yes, flying mounts killed world PvP, they weren't just used for ganking. Ganking started world PvP because people would shout for help in their guild chat, world defense chat and all that. Did I get ganked on my alts? Yes. Did I hate it? Nope. It would mean I'd relog to my main and have some fun dueling going on and maybe even a small skirmish of a (few) dozen people.

    Now you can blame the players for ruining world PvP. But back in Wrath of the Lich King, PvE players stood a chance against us PvPers, except for Legendaries ruining it once in a while, it was pretty balanced. Glass cannon vs sturdy PvPer. Blizzard ruined it by removing resilience on gear (like you already stated) and by adding flying everywhere. Luckily they're changing their stance on flying mounts with WoD. Let's see what happens.

  19. #119
    1. LFD/LFR - How easy and attainable everything is. The thing that i loved about wow when i first started playing in TBC was the want and need for MORE! i had to form groups and get to a dungeon, summon them and then enter (to some it may sound tedious, to me it felt better for the community and you made friends along the way) I think this is 1 of thee biggest down falls of wow, it killed the realm community. People now log on, do their LFD / LFR without talking to a single person and log out ..... BORING! I'd just like to point out back at the end of TBC & all the way through WOTLK i was a hardcore raider, had my own guild and we cleared everything at the hardest setting, now i'm a casual player who doesn't have time for hardcore so you'd think i was for LFR .... i'm not, it's shit. On my server i'd like to start a casual 1/2 night a week raiding guild with like minded players, i can't because the people who can only get on casually now just do LFR and log out. Low to Medium pop realms are dead. No one stays on because you don't need to interact with the players on your realm to do anything.

    2. Content - these are very rough estimations but you understand where I'm coming from. in Sterling (£ UK) it's £8.99 a month sub, so lets call it £9, now let's say there are 8 million subs roughly equaled out between the start and end of an expansion, that's £81,000,000($133,698,600 USD) per month, so a year thats £972,000,000 ($1,604,383,200 USD) ... thats over 1 BILLION a year, seriously, they could employ some more teams, bigger teams and churn out more content in patches. New Dungeons (not rehashed old vanilla dungeons) new Islands, New quests etc etc etc. The Cata raids having only a few bosses when a company makes that much money is terrible.

    3. Homogenization - Classes should be unique, i loved having to bring a sham for totems and blood lust to name just 1 .....

    4. Cata - leave the old world, people zerg level in a day and don't see any of this new content, it was a waste of time. Expansions should be new, not old shit re done. I felt the threat in previous expansions, coming from a WC3 player i loved the story in TBC and WOTLK .... OMG we were about to face Arthus? YeEeEeEe. Oh a big dragon ... who cares.

    5. The feel of mists - Not into this Asian theme, i'm into orcs, goblins and ghouls, skeletons, death, the feel of brute force and war on a battle field of bloody axes. Pandas thinking they're Bruce Lee is lame.

  20. #120
    1. Introduced way too much smart healing. Smart-healing makes the game decide for you and is a unrewarding addition to the game. There is no fun using an ability on cooldown because it automatically heals the most injured raid members and thus is very mana-efficient. If they are to stay smart heals should either have a much higher mana cost or be reduced in effectiveness so that healers have to make decisions again
    2. Made absorbs too dominant in MoP. Absorbs are just broken.
    3. Introduced all too many modes for each raiding tier. The current tier spans 4 different difficulty modes spanning a whopping 44 ilvls.

    But then they also made several good additions to the game.

    1. They greatly improved the tanking experience and actually gave the tanks a say in whether they survive or not by making the tanking playstyle much more interactive.
    2. They have streamlined buffs and standardized a lot of things since vanilla that needed to be done
    3. With MoP they have finally made the talent and glyph system exciting and it's really fun
    4. Since Wrath they have made catch-up mechanisms for each new tier so that you're not forced to do older tiers to get into new ones. For someone like me that plays on and off, sometimes taking several months off, missing a tier isn't punitive and I can get back into raiding quickly(I much prefer the dungeon style to the TI one).

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