Slippery slope.

[Deleted]

So, I was banned off the WoW forums a while back for making some statements about the game and it's staff, that were incredibly harsh, yet the general connotations of what I was saying were true.

One of the things that I brought up was that the "MVPs" always, always, without fail were the white knights of blizzard. Everything they said was positive and just re-enforcing the decisions that Blizzard, as a company had made. (Even if there were obvious, and tremendous flaws in said decisions.) One of the things I said was that the MVPs suck up to Blizzard more than all those useless American streamers that want jobs at Blizzard, i.e Veev, Rzn, Swifty, Hotted, etc etc.

However, over the last couple months, I've been noticing, even those streamers have been mouthing off about Blizzard, saying they're making horrible decisions. (I don't actually know whether Swifty has or not).

BUT!

The thing that really, really astonished me was when I was browsing the forums this morning and I see that someone has made a thread regarding the "Shop Button" in-game, and the every increasing presence of them. Everyone was complaining, rightly so, if you want to buy something, there's already a button in-game and an entire site that is based around buying things for the games. Infact, unless I actually type in "wow-europe.com" into my browser, I can't get onto the WoW site without going through like 3 pages of shopping options. (Maybe this is my general lack of knowledge with the site, but the products are shoved right in front of you half a dozen times before you can even see the patch notes). I expected the thread to just be pages and pages of faceless players that Blizzard don't care about just complaining about this new button. But, lo-and-behold, the 5th post was from an MVP! Written in all it's shining green glory! And wow! Wow-o-Wow! It was not positive in the slightest.

ht tp : // gyazo. com /7e6c069bd34470ea08451ea555e24a93

He even said "Piss"! Can you believe that! An MVP! Now after all my countless forums posts that were edited by community managers for saying things like "scum" and "piss" then having said words replaced with an assortment of alphanumeric symbols, i'm sitting here thinking, he's not gonna have green writing for much longer. So, anyways, I scroll down a bit more!

ht tp : // gyazo. com /d6c887ffe0659a146471fa679fa8c71f

Can you believe your eyes? Another angry MVP? What is the world (of warcraft) coming to?

Scroll down a little but further and there's another angry MVP? Was this because it was a monday? Or have Blizzard finally gone too far?


ht tp : // eu . battle . net /wow /en /forum/topic /9413792129

This is the link to the original thread.


What I'm saying is, it's apparent that the community is angry with plenty of things right now. Both PVE and PVP. All I see is people complaining about not enough immersion, the race to end game, time sinks, class balance, silly pvp/pve changes. Isn't it about time that Blizzard started to listen to the community? Instead of implementing more ways for us to waste money, why don't they change things that need changing? Even there once knights in shining armour seem to be turning against the might that is Blizzard?

Any blizzard employee will probably turn around and say; "Well, we're near the end of the expansion, so any changes won't really matter now and from a financial stand-point we will gain more by pumping out WoD quicker than trying to fix the brilliance (sarcasm) that is the current game build". That is probably true enough, but I think fixing the game instead of bringing out another broken version of it would be alot better. Don't you agree?


Something that really stood out to me was the video that ZiQo made. Some of you may/may not have heard of him. He's a multi-glad, top ranked player on multiple classes, most recently mage. He, along with many other of the old-school "pros" have quit the game for the time being. In the time that he's quit he streamed himself talking about why the pvp game build has been broken since the release of MoP. Things like bugs that took months to fix, when things were proved to be broken, blizzard blamed the player's latency, how dispel changes destroyed a smooth flowing pvp build. Yes, he was rude, yes, he was angry, but everything he said was valid. Someone on tiwtter tweeted it to Holinka (Head PVP-Designer) and he tweeted back saying he can't be bothered to watch it. Yes, his exact words. This is the person who balances PVP can't be bothered to take advice from someone who's been playing at top level since the very first season?

I feel like the whole community is treated like this in respect to changes they want to see made to the game.

If you ask for changes you won't even be heard, not unless you've showered blizzard with atleast 4-5 compliments, bought them flowers, taken them to a movie, bought them dinner then dropped them home first. You have to do all that before they'll even hear you out. Then, you can't even state that what they've done is wrong, you have to make it sound like they've had the best interests at heart (I hope they do, although alot of the time I fail to see them) and that they just need to tweak the current system that they're using. The company has an ethos of a pre-pubescent girl in between the ages of 7 and 9. Why is the community not listened to? Why are blues so inactive on the forums (Eu particularly)? Why are micro-transactions shoved down our throat at every turn? How can the company let it's lead PVP designer be so blatantly rude on twitter? Haven't they realised the customer is always right, even if they're wrong? Why is customer service on the whole so bad? Why do you feel so elated after you speak to a customer service representative who actually helps you out and gives you some good advice/solves your problem? I feel as if, blizzard make us expect such a shitty response to any problems or queries we have related in anyway to their in-game or out-game policies that once we get something half decent we feel happy, whereas that should be the standard treatment to all of it's customers in the first place. (at the very least).






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Remove the spaces I've put in the URLs to view the links, something about not having permission.

[Darsithis]

MVP's don't work for Blizzard. They're humans entitled to their own opinion as much as a global mod (like myself) is entitled to one here.

[MerinPally]

If the MVPs are as much suck ups and useless as you say, why do you particularly care what they think about anything? Noone else does either. Why are the devs rude on Twitter? Because they answer the same 100 questions 100 times over every day and people make ridiculous suggestions and use words like "scaling" and suddenly think they're gods gift. The devs then say that's not how it works and they reply "oh blizz is losing it" or a comment about how useless they are. I'd tell them to fuck off too.

[Deleted]

MVP's don't work for Blizzard. They're humans entitled to their own opinion as much as a global mod (like myself) is entitled to one here.

I know they don't. I know they are. I know you are. But to say they're not biased would be silly, no? They don't want to loose their green writing, so why would they annoy the people that give it to them?

MerinPally:

Even if they do answer the same questions every day, that's no excuse to be rude, not in anyway. I'm sure if you were a customer representative at any company and someone called complaining that they had a problem with said product, then the next person called with the same problem and you told them to fuck off, you'd be out a job. Use some logic. I'm not saying they have to answer everyone, and the dumb suggestions are very apparent in their dumbness. However, if you're getting feedback from someone who knows the game inside out and has played it for a decade, you'd figure you'd have 10 minutes to spare for them, even if they are being slightly rude?

[Ryme]

MVP's don't work for Blizzard. They're humans entitled to their own opinion as much as a global mod (like myself) is entitled to one here.

True, but I would find it surprising to see you complain openly and be publicly critical of MMO-Champion. Similar sort of thought process going on here.

[Deleted]

True, but I would find it surprising to see you complain openly and be publicly critical of MMO-Champion. Similar sort of thought process going on here.

My point exactly, for MVPs to be criticising Blizzard on a public forum with 100(0s?) of views a day, something has to very wrong.

[Afrospinach]

I know they don't. I know they are. I know you are. But to say they're not biased would be silly, no? They don't want to loose their green writing, so why would they annoy the people that give it to them?

This is only a problem if you believe that they get some special voice toward the direction of the game, no? Last I checked they were not there for that reason.

[MerinPally]

Even if they do answer the same questions every day, that's no excuse to be rude, not in anyway. I'm sure if you were a customer representative at any company and someone called complaining that they had a problem with said product, then the next person called with the same problem and you told them to fuck off, you'd be out a job. Use some logic. I'm not saying they have to answer everyone, and the dumb suggestions are very apparent in their dumbness. However, if you're getting feedback from someone who knows the game inside out and has played it for a decade, you'd figure you'd have 10 minutes to spare for them, even if they are being slightly rude?

No I get that, but what they have been posting - whilst slightly rude - is not necessarily all that offensive and warrants kicking up a fuss. They have been a bit snappy but I'm not surprised. If you're going to repeatedly ask stupid questions then you should expect a stupid answer. If all these questions and answers were done in isolation then fine but they aren't.

[Krothar]

I genuinely forget MVP's are even a thing until I see one post.

[Funkyjunky]

One of the things that I brought up was that the "MVPs" always, always, without fail were the white knights of blizzard. Everything they said was positive and just re-enforcing the decisions that Blizzard, as a company had made. (Even if there were obvious, and tremendous flaws in said decisions.)

Apparently you where wrong.

[arcaneshot]

So, I was banned off the WoW forums

So why is it that when people preface their post with this I suddenly think that they're only posting here because they really want to post it there?

[Deleted]

This is only a problem if you believe that they get some special voice toward the direction of the game, no? Last I checked they were not there for that reason.

It's the principle that they're elevated above the rest of the community. They don't want it taken away.

Merinpally:

Multiquote is working, sorry, lol. I understand what you're saying, but the stupid suggestions are easily ignored. When it is good, constructive feedback, they should atleast have the time of day to atleast listen to it. Don't even have to do anything with it. Would be nice to see them just acknowledge that it's there and they've listened to it.

[Leih]

So why is it that when people preface their post with this I suddenly think that they're only posting here because they really want to post it there?

People post that because they are hoping someone will read their fresh and new ground-breaking thoughts and think "Oh hey, this guy is a genius! I'll take up his crusade and repost this thread on the official forums!"

[Giscoicus]

MVP's don't work for Blizzard. They're humans entitled to their own opinion as much as a global mod (like myself) is entitled to one here.

I would love to see a MVP not support Blizzards actions. They really do brown nose a lot Darsithis.

Here at least the mods will show negative opinions on some decisions by Blizzard :P not just supporting them.

[Lynarii]

If you're not seeing MVPs disagree with Blizzard, you're not looking hard enough. Seriously. When MoP was in beta, I recall Lissanna kicking up a pretty significant fuss over several of the things that Blizz did with druids. Some of the stuff she posted got fixed, some didn't, but she wasn't just blowing smoke up their ass the entire time. I was also just looking over a thread in the D3 RoS beta forums where a green posted a very long and disappointed post about the state of the legendary drop rates and build defining legendaries, which has also prompted the testing of a few adjustments to the systems there.

People aren't MVPs on the Blizz forums for being mindless cheerleaders, they're MVPs for being passionate and eloquent. When they disagree, and they do, they tend to post constructive feedback and not angry "Y Blizz suck?" rants like you may want to see, but don't mistake a lack of swearing, caps, and bad grammar for a lack of caring about mistakes Blizzard has made or is making.

[-Superman-]

I know they don't. I know they are. I know you are. But to say they're not biased would be silly, no?

I know it may come as a shock to some, but plenty of people, myself included, seldom see the "end of the world" bullshit that so many others seem to make mountains from the existing molehill. You believe the Cash shop button to be a mistake. I happen to enjoy the convenience of purchasing a new pet without leaving the game. You would also think purchasable lvl 90 characters to be a mistake. I see it as an opportunity for new players to jump in with friends, get a bunch of alts, and start enjoying what Azeroth has to offer.

What most people fail to realize is, RIGHT or WRONG, SMART or STUPID, HELPFUL or DETRIMENTAL, the end decision is Blizzard's as this is THEIR game. I do not care for some features, and I will voice my opinion about it. But, in the end, opinions are ONLY opinions, and the game is taking off in a new direction. We can all either A) Get with the program or, B) Find a new program. If you have Constructive feedback, Blizz will take it under advisement. If all you have is "ZOMG TEH CASH SHOPZ R KILLIN TEH WOWZ!", then yeah, they will pat you on your tinfoil hat and scoot you off to LFR.

[rda]

OP, your posts strikes a chord.

I don't have answers to most of your questions like why they are doing the shop in a sub-based game and why Holinka can't be bothered to even listen to constructive critique of PVP. That is, I don't have any *good* answers, I only have bad ones.

[russykh]

I honestly cant understand the thread you've linked. It's ridiculous because it should be fairly obvious why they've put a shop button there, and if anything it makes sense to have it there. If they are going to sell level 90's, then it makes sense to put at button that takes you to the place you buy them on the character select screen. It's common sense. It's not "forcing the store down our throats" or some of the other crap that people are saying, it's not massively in the way or obtrusive, it's completely ignorable if you dont want to use the store.

As for slippery slope arguments, we had those since the sparkle pony, and it's taken 4 years or so to go from that to a few more mounts and pets, and perhaps in the next year we can pay to level a character to the start of the coming expansion. Oh and a few cosmetic helm transmogs. They're really bleeding us dry with this stuff here!

Also, I'm not sure why you think MVPs are in Blizzs pockets, I've seen them say negative things about the games loads. Same with a lot of the streamers. In fact, I cant think of one that has been 100% pro Blizz, but I dont watch all of them. In fact, quite a few are negative quite a lot of the time. And blizz do hear/listen/interact with people who are negative or dont agree with them, often quite a lot. Ghostcrawler would often try and justify changes to people or give reasons why they were doing stuff, often to people who were really quite rude to him.

[Mirishka]

I appreciate being able to buy stuff in game - it actually annoys me having to go to the Blizzard store site, logging in, potentially using my authenticator, etc.

As for the MVP being mad, who cares? They're normal people, not Blizzard employees. Its not the OMG BLIZZARD IS MAD AT THEMSELVES! revelation you wish it was, OP.

[Deleted]

If anyone is going to agree with what Blizzard are doing, then it was going to be an MVP. The only one who I've seen very frequently disagree with current game build is Thorsanaxx, the PVP MVP, can't quite remember how to spell his name. MVPs saying something bad or disagreeing, imo is huge, as it so rarely happens. Most posts they have are just "GG guys, can't wait for patch! " or "Looks great "

Most of the others spend all their time in the forum lounges having a good time with community managers, who subsequently, have very little to offer most of the time.

(Other than informing us of connected realm updates, which I guess has it's uses)


My point about the store is, there's so many problems, why are they implementing store buttons. Even if that were to take them 5 minutes, which in reality it probably took them hours of work, the opportunity cost in terms of fixing current game build was too high.

And trust me, if you've watched some of the streamers I've mentioned a few months ago, during the summer, not one of them had a bad word to say about blizzard.


I agree it's blizzard's game, but every other company on the planet seems to operate with the understanding that the customer is always right and you have to please them, has this somehow escaped this huge multi-naitonal?


I don't believe the cash shop button to be the "end-of-the-world" type situation as you so eloquently put it. It doesn't even bother me at all. I know I'm not at all tempted to buy stuff from the store, there's nothing there that appeals to me and the only reason I've ever bought stuff from it is simply because I have some money sitting on my paypal I can't be bothered to transfer to my bank. It was just an example. M

My main concern is why do blizzard treat everyone with such disdain and sit there on their throne thinking that they're some sort of holy grail?



Russykh:

If what you're saying is true, then they are far to quiet and not vocal enough on things that matter, there's a huge manner of problems that seem to get over-looked because "ZOMG FEY DRAGON SO QT" or "IRON SKYREAVER WOW", that's what 2 mounts in 2 months? Seems like they're just trying to distract the community and the MVPs seem to be fine with this. They should be ignoring the good things that blizzard do so they're always striving to do better. Blizzard seem to be happy leaving their customers semi-satisfied, not going above and beyond.