At what point does this game become pay to win

[Derpleton]

So having seen the store that is now in testing on the PTR that allows players to buy level 90 boosts, mounts, pets etc. I couldn't help but think how long it will be until this store gets bigger. And so I have to wonder where do you guys draw the line before this game is truly pay to win. Would it annoy any of you if Blizzard started selling things such Heirlooms and XP boost potions on this store, After all with the 90 boosts you can skip most of the leveling content anyway. Also by that logic would it annoy anyone if Blizzard started selling dungeon boss drops on the store from level 1-90? So once again where do you guys draw the line before a game becomes pay to win

[Volitar]

I would say I draw the line when the game actually becomes pay to win..don't get me wrong I hate the Blizzard store, I am of the opinion games should have micro transactions/e shops/whatever OR a subscription NOT both.

[Illiterate]

It became pay to win with sparkle pony

[jetersky]

I would draw the line at gear on the store, or gems/gem slots/etc... Anything that equates to a power bonus that isn't obtainable in-game. Anything other than that is mostly cosmetic or time saving, so who cares.

[Paula Deen]

So having seen the store that is now in testing on the PTR that allows players to buy level 90 boosts, mounts, pets etc. I couldn't help but think how long it will be until this store gets bigger. And so I have to wonder where do you guys draw the line before this game is truly pay to win. Would it annoy any of you if Blizzard started selling things such Heirlooms and XP boost potions on this store, After all with the 90 boosts you can skip most of the leveling content anyway. Also by that logic would it annoy anyone if Blizzard started selling dungeon boss drops on the store from level 1-90? So once again where do you guys draw the line before a game becomes pay to win

So having seen this thread that is now cancerous on MMOC that mentions the game is shit, p2w, etc. I couldn't help but think how long it will be until this thread gets locked. And so I have to wonder where do the mods draw the line before locking a thread? Would it annoy any of you if a Mod started locking all these threads with the exact same content? After all the threads are all the same anyway. Also by that logic would it annoy anyone if Mods started banning the people who post them?

inb4 infraction

[Yarathir]

Gear, gems, etc. on the store.


And especially when the gear on the store becomes superior to the ingame gear, and it is only available through the store.

[OneTripleZero]

Can I do something in the store that a) I can't do in game and b) gives me a competitive advantage when compared to someone who does not use the store?

That's the only definition you need. Anything less than that is not pay to win.

[Therealmagoo]

When it starts being pay to win i would hazard a guess. I dont care if they add it anyway , i hope they sell gear and what ever they feel like selling , even things you cant get in game that make you more powerful than anyone that didnt buy it.

[Socialhealer]

So having seen this thread that is now cancerous on MMOC that mentions the game is shit, p2w, etc. I couldn't help but think how long it will be until this thread gets locked. And so I have to wonder where do the mods draw the line before locking a thread? Would it annoy any of you if a Mod started locking all these threads with the exact same content? After all the threads are all the same anyway. Also by that logic would it annoy anyone if Mods started banning the people who post them?

inb4 infraction

i agree, it's just so "oh no not this shit...AGAIN" but it just proves the low level of intellect of the average gamer i guess, thinking a different looking mount or a 90 that everyone has 5 of is pay to win, i could of had 50 90's by now, what exactly would i be winning with all those, what is my big advantage because i've got some 90's (btw i have 6).

[Balgazarr]

Pay2win couldnt come fast enough, I actually enjoy playing the game not sitting in a dungeon/raid for hours on end trying to get gear. They could do away with gear altogether and I would be happy, just everyone equal stats no more raid heros.

[A Dark Knight]

It became pay to win with sparkle pony

true, we couldnt kill yogg 0 light without those ponies

[Yarathir]

true, we couldnt kill yogg 0 light without those ponies

You know the Celestial Steed gave everyone a +100% to every stats buff that helped them clear Yogg-Saron with 0 Keepers! A buff that stacked if multiple members had the Celestial Steed!

[Tucci]

How about we just stop talking about it because the more we talk about it, the more ridiculous ideas people come up with, the more those people push those ideas to Blizzard, cry, complain, bitch and moan until Blizzard decides to "try" more ideas. No one gave a fuck about models until Blizzard mentioned new models and then every other thread was complaints about how we don't have new models yet.

People are pretty much just bored. No one cared much that there weren't pay to win items on the Blizzard store, but now that Blizz is trying out purchasable 90's in the store, we get people coming up with more and more ideas every 5 min. and if they don't get responses or get shot down, they cry, complain, bitch and whine until they're "heard" by Blizzard. Blizzard then might think it's what the community wants because a handful of lazy, bad players decide they don't want to have to work for anything in the game and are more vocal about it than the ones that think everything should be balanced and equal.

To answer this question though, the point where the game becomes pay-to-win starts with the purchasable 90's. That's pay-to-win. I know a lot of people disagree but you can't get to max level to do end game content without.....leveling. It's part of the process. Now you can skip that part. It's not as bad as buying gear or items that enhance your character like gems or enchants, but it's still bad and it MIGHT open pandora's box if Blizzard isn't smart and careful about it.

For the record, I don't really care if an experienced or veteran player that's done the old grind tons of times buys a 90, I care about the noobs being able to and most of all I care about the door this could open.

[Deleted]

pay to win = outplaying fellow players with imbalanced items / stats bought with $ in PVE & PVP

and that will never happen. Even if they offer full heroic gear on day one. It'll just be bad for hardcore players since they are required to buy it. Then again... content would no longer matter and worst case the hardcores leave da ship.

[MerinPally]

When you can buy something on the store which is better than anything you can attain in game.

I don't like the Blizzard store - not as a concept, the ingame button. It never bothered me before. Literally that button is my only gripe - I appreciate the easier access but it's kinda pushed in your face. I want the store as a background option rather than something so apparent, staring at you.

[clevin]

Define win. Then we can have a discussion that's not just people wanting to bitch about the 90s. Until then, this thread should have been yet another comment on one of the other threads about the 90s.

[Peso]

true, we couldnt kill yogg 0 light without those ponies

For some the game may be all about collecting mounts. For them it's pay to win.

The problem is that pay to win is subjective.

[clevin]

For some the game may be all about collecting mounts. For them it's pay to win.

The problem is that pay to win is subjective.

You can't have an discussion if you can't agree what a simple term like 'win' means. Hint: it does not mean a few buyable mounts out of hundreds.

[shoc]

When you can buy an advantage over another player. Being able to buy a 90 doesn't really constitute pay-to-win, unless you consider hitting the level cap of the last expansion to be "winning the game". People would argue that being able to buy the previous tier of armour wouldn't be pay to win, but even that would constitute a large advantage over a sizable number of casual players.

Blizzard knows that the moment they put gear with stats on them is the moment a million players quit out of protest, and therefore they would never in their right minds do it. Even money hungry shareholders and executives could see that, they are businesspeople, not goblins lol

[Constraint]

It will only become pay-to-win when you can purchase entire, fully gemmed and enchanted sets of gear which is better than anything found in-game through regular methods, when you can purchase full achievement points, and titles/mounts/pets no longer available in-game, and several new ones which shall never be made available to the general customer.

Not sooner. Until then, you're just "paying to skip", or "paying for convenience".

Yeah. That.