A few quick questions about Heroic Siegecrafter.

[Pogolols]

So as my guild is progressing through Heroic Siegecrafter I've been presented with a few questions.
1)Does using Direbeast for belts kind of screw me over? It's up every belt, but does the movement make ToTH/Fervor> DB?
2)For burst damage, what should my stat priority be? I've read through the "bm bis list" thread and it seems like nobody can really prove which stat weights are definitively better.
3)When jumping to the belts I send my pet to attack the boss to dismiss it, but sometimes he just wont go? It seems like there is a certain range that the pet has to be within or he will just stand by me. Is this the case? Or can someone tell me whats causing this? Should I manually move my pet into the range then send him to attack? Is there a better method for dismissing pet?

That's all I can really think of for now. I've heard BM is the best for belts because of BW being up for every belt(except 1 for, seems like around 4 the CD comes up about halfway through the belt and makes it not worth using, I use my stampede here to make up for that) but would SV come out on top here? I'm comfortable playing both and have the trinkets to play either. If someone can make a convincing argument to say SV > BM for belts I'm all ears(I'm really worried about just having RNG screw me over and have low ES procs and have a belt get through).

[Deleted]

I did it as SV since during belt 4-6 I didn't always have time to get my pet dismissed/despawened for it to be on the belt, and I notice quite often that my pet didn't attack all the time on the belt due to movement. And you can kill the weapons on the belt fast enough without any LnL proc, if you bring two people up (And even then you should pretty much only have to use CDs when your partner can't get up or failed to get up as a backup).

[Pogolols]

Sorry I should clear up this would be 25HM, and I use dash manually to ensure my pet has its max up time on weapons. Not sure if that would change anything you said though Joyful.

[mediic]

1.) I only play SV on the belts, thought I often have issues where my pet or stampede can't keep up with the weapon so I would probably favour TotH over DB as BM.
2.) Any gains you would get from finding an optimal stat priority for weapon burst would be insignificant compared to other factors in the fight.
3.) If the boss is roughly 100 yards or further away your pet simply won't respond to an attack command, not sure why. That's part of the reason we decided against positioning the boss on the far side of the room. You mention sending the pet at the boss to dismiss it (out of range despawn), there is another way if you're unaware. If your pet is attacking the boss or a missile, or en route to do so, when you land on the belt you can press your pet passive button and it will teleport to your side.
If your guild is insistent on positioning the boss so far away that your pet won't attack it, your best option may be to simply dismiss pet in between waves.


I won't say SV > BM, but I will say SV is very good for the belts. Might be a little harder for you given your boss positioning, I was always able to cast a BA on boss before getting back on the belt so I would usually start off with a LnL proc. Try it for yourself and see how it compares.

[Glurp]

db works fine on the belts. you should just use whatever talent you normally do for single target.

[rustyboy]

From my experience doing 10m HM

1 - TotH > All, especially as BM.

2 - For BM I've found Mastery > Crit > Haste (60%+ Mastery/50%+ Crit) to be the best for pure burst on the belts. I am able to solo a belt (10HM Post Nerf 9.6m Health) using Rapid Fire, Blood Fury, Rabid, Synapse Springs (Not Including Stampede, Potion, Assurance of Consequence Proc). In 25 man as BM you could easily use Crit > Mastery > Haste and for Survival I would suggest Crit > Haste = Mastery.

3 - When you jump off the belt, summon your pet and send it to Siegecrafter. When you get back on the belt use the /petpassive command in a macro and your pet will teleport to your side. If your pet de-spawns from going out of range just re-summon.

Considering you are doing 25m HM and you will have many people on the belt you could easily go Survival, but if you want to be more consistent then BM is the way to go. If your BM I would use a Ravager pet and if your Survival I would use a Dragonhawk unless those debuffs are being covered with every belt by other classes.

[kidsafe]

DB and TotH is a matter of preference for BM. Considering you're also going to be under BW for much of your time on the belt, TotH doesn't save you that many Cobra Shots.

[Dhryke]

1. I personally use DB, but like Tobin just said TotH is a good option as well.
2. What is your ilvl, or give us an armory link.
3. As soon as I land from disengaging off of the belts I manually summon my pet. If you wait for the game to do it, it'll take an extra second or so. During this extra time you can either send your pet at the boss(this is what I do) or manually dismiss it.

As far as BW is concerned, I try to use it a little bit earlier on the early belts, as they don't last nearly as long and it gives a second or two more for the CD to complete for the later belts. Not much of a difference but I like the flow of it. You can also Rapid Fire every other belt, and use your second potion for ones where you need the extra push.

I started progression as SV but switched to BM before we got the kill.

[Pogolols]

1. I personally use DB, but like Tobin just said TotH is a good option as well.
2. What is your ilvl, or give us an armory link.
3. As soon as I land from disengaging off of the belts I manually summon my pet. If you wait for the game to do it, it'll take an extra second or so. During this extra time you can either send your pet at the boss(this is what I do) or manually dismiss it.

As far as BW is concerned, I try to use it a little bit earlier on the early belts, as they don't last nearly as long and it gives a second or two more for the CD to complete for the later belts. Not much of a difference but I like the flow of it. You can also Rapid Fire every other belt, and use your second potion for ones where you need the extra push.

I started progression as SV but switched to BM before we got the kill.

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...%96go/advanced

I'll try using the BW a little earlier. I've thought about it but never tried..

[rustyboy]

DB and TotH is a matter of preference for BM. Considering you're also going to be under BW for much of your time on the belt, TotH doesn't save you that many Cobra Shots.

TotH allows you to continue bursting after your BW drops so you end up only casting maybe 1 CS and on many belts never.

More AS means more chances to proc Cobra Strikes which in turn causes 90% of all Basic Attacks (w/ Blink Strikes) by my pet to crit (250k on average). Sure if you doing 25m HM you can use Dire Beast and you will be fine as most guilds will send up enough people to kill it in time, if you want to do more damage you take TotH.

Dire Beast will give you 5-600k damage on a belt, with TotH my AS does 1.4m with an average hit of about 180k. So all I need is 4 extra AS from TotH and I'm doing more damage.

[kidsafe]

On our last kill I fired 4 AS on the first weapon, which I solo.
I fired 7 on the third weapon, 2 on the fifth weapon and 5 on the seventh weapon (which I basically solo'd)
There's no way with TotH I actually fire 4 additional Arcane Shots in a vacuum.

This is a 10-man where I share 3, 5, 7 with a ret paladin.

[Noima]

I use surv for the belts in 25m HC every week, mainly because I don't have TED and I'm lazy and cba to reforge.

On most of the belts the weapon you're attacking isn't the first out and you should have plenty of time to be able to pre-drop traps ready for the weapon you're intending to kill. Frost will give you a LnL proc garuanteed to get the ball rolling while you wait for your BA to give you more. I use fervor as well, but I guess that talent is just personal preference, there isn't much difference between them all.

[Thursley]

Be careful doing things like this when the weapon you want isn't attackable yet, I think they can proc your trinkets and waste the uptime. At the least, only do it a second or two before you would be able to attack the weapon you want to kill. This is particularly important if you're using TED because of how its buff decrements.

Even manually summoning a pet can proc a trinket for some reason. I normally swap pets for each belt (so I can use rabid every time), and I discovered this issue last night after attaching an audio cue to the proc from the TED I got last week. Pretty frustrating to disengage up to the belt, summon a fresh pet, and lose out on the first 5 seconds of TED because the weapon you want to attack isn't in range for a while.

[Pogolols]

Be careful doing things like this when the weapon you want isn't attackable yet, I think they can proc your trinkets and waste the uptime. At the least, only do it a second or two before you would be able to attack the weapon you want to kill. This is particularly important if you're using TED because of how its buff decrements.

Even manually summoning a pet can proc a trinket for some reason. I normally swap pets for each belt (so I can use rabid every time), and I discovered this issue last night after attaching an audio cue to the proc from the TED I got last week. Pretty frustrating to disengage up to the belt, summon a fresh pet, and lose out on the first 5 seconds of TED because the weapon you want to attack isn't in range for a while.

Is there a macro that you know of that will summon a different pet each time or do you do that manually?

[Thursley]

I just do it manually, as long as you're keeping up with the weapons well enough there's plenty of time between spawns so clicking different pets on your action bar instead of having a keybind isn't a problem.

I don't know why a /castsequence macro wouldn't work though. Something like /castsequence Call Pet 1, Call Pet 2, Call Pet 3 I suppose? Just make very sure your previous pet has despawned completely before trying to summon the next one with the macro.

[Rife]

From 25 man:

Start with your pet dismissed, disengage onto belt and summon pet.

You should be jumping into the pipe every second belt and don't need to worry about your pet on these as it'll get ported properly up onto the belt.

You should dismiss your pet on every odd numbered belt so your disengage onto the belt won't leave it stranded.

Summoning a new pet every odd belt means you can have rabid up more often.

If you have multiple Hunters you should think about staggering your stampedes and big cooldowns.

You should think about leaving 1 or 2 hunters on the platform during lust on the pull for more boss DPS because trinket procs will see the first belt die very quickly and being able to get onto the second belt quickly by taking the pipe allows you to DPS the weapon before it officially gets onto the belt.

If you're BM with heroic AoC you can have BW up for every belt and Rabid up for every second belt at least.

You can disengage into the lane between the fire when it's up and then time your pipe jump with deterrence so you can entirely avoid the fire damage when it's out.

You can avoid dying a lot on progression by getting on the belt when a wipe is inc.

Have a few different hunter pets from your hunters to get more buffs/debuffs.

[rustyboy]

On our last kill I fired 4 AS on the first weapon, which I solo.
I fired 7 on the third weapon, 2 on the fifth weapon and 5 on the seventh weapon (which I basically solo'd)
There's no way with TotH I actually fire 4 additional Arcane Shots in a vacuum.

This is a 10-man where I share 3, 5, 7 with a ret paladin.

I get 10-11 Arcane Shots on every belt and I solo belts 1, 4 & 7.

Arcane Shots from a Solo belt 4.

22:25:42.403 Arcane Shot Deactivated Missile Turret 4 *133083*
22:25:45.447 Arcane Shot Deactivated Missile Turret 4 *187381*
22:25:46.504 Arcane Shot Deactivated Missile Turret 4 *225523*
22:25:47.790 Arcane Shot Deactivated Missile Turret 4 *192666*
22:25:48.950 Arcane Shot Deactivated Missile Turret 4 *205228*
22:25:50.049 Arcane Shot Deactivated Missile Turret 4 *234852*
22:25:51.997 Arcane Shot Deactivated Missile Turret 4 *246553*
22:25:53.041 Arcane Shot Deactivated Missile Turret 4 *230687*
22:25:53.972 Arcane Shot Deactivated Missile Turret 4 79864
22:25:54.861 Arcane Shot Deactivated Missile Turret 4 *151021*

10 AS in ~12.5s for ~1.9m damage

Arcane Shots from a shared belt 2 with no CD's other that BW.

22:24:23.489 Arcane Shot Deactivated Missile Turret 2 93563
22:24:24.308 Arcane Shot Deactivated Missile Turret 2 *183149*
22:24:25.231 Arcane Shot Deactivated Missile Turret 2 100727
22:24:26.227 Arcane Shot Deactivated Missile Turret 2 99112
22:24:27.236 Arcane Shot Deactivated Missile Turret 2 88885
22:24:28.298 Arcane Shot Deactivated Missile Turret 2 85795
22:24:30.614 Arcane Shot Deactivated Missile Turret 2 *215649*
22:24:31.614 Arcane Shot Deactivated Missile Turret 2 106684
22:24:32.693 Arcane Shot Deactivated Missile Turret 2 81572
22:24:37.637 Arcane Shot Deactivated Missile Turret 2 62120
22:24:38.718 Arcane Shot Deactivated Missile Turret 2 61888

11 AS in ~15.2s for ~1.2m damage

[Deleted]

Tried heroic 25M Siegecrafter today for the first time and was assigned to go with both belt groups the whole fight. Landing on the belt wasn't a problem, the problem was the rest, so I'd like to ask few questions about this encounter.

1) At what part of the belt does the weapon normally die? We didn't have so great dps and we usually killed it quite close to the end, which opens the next issues:
2) Do the fire lasers on belt activate in specified order (for example the leftest one, then the second from right etc) or is it random?
3) Is there any kind of trick to manage those lasers? Even as such highly mobile class I had problems running through the lasers - wasn't sure if I'll be fast enough to get those on the sides, so I waited for one of the middle ones to deactivate while the weapon went almost out of range etc.

I realize it will just come with some time and training naturally, but I'm kind of puzzled why everyone talks about disengaging as the hard part while I had more problems staying alive at the belt.

[kidsafe]

Tried heroic 25M Siegecrafter today for the first time and was assigned to go with both belt groups the whole fight. Landing on the belt wasn't a problem, the problem was the rest, so I'd like to ask few questions about this encounter.

1) At what part of the belt does the weapon normally die? We didn't have so great dps and we usually killed it quite close to the end, which opens the next issues:
2) Do the fire lasers on belt activate in specified order (for example the leftest one, then the second from right etc) or is it random?
3) Is there any kind of trick to manage those lasers? Even as such highly mobile class I had problems running through the lasers - wasn't sure if I'll be fast enough to get those on the sides, so I waited for one of the middle ones to deactivate while the weapon went almost out of range etc.

I realize it will just come with some time and training naturally, but I'm kind of puzzled why everyone talks about disengaging as the hard part while I had more problems staying alive at the belt.

1) Where the weapon dies depends entirely on CD usage by the group. Sometimes we kill the weapons shortly after it passes the first set of beams. Sometimes after it passes the third set.
2) The gap progresses from right to left and loops back. If the gap was last on the far left, it will appear again on the far right.
3) When you go up on the belt for any particular set of weapons, the timing will always be the same. The best thing to do is to position yourself as close to the gap you intend to take as possible and wait for it to open, then run through immediately. Belt 1 will always be the same on any pull. Belt 2 will always be the same on any attempt. Different numbered belts will not be the same as each other.

[Deleted]

1) Where the weapon dies depends entirely on CD usage by the group. Sometimes we kill the weapons shortly after it passes the first set of beams. Sometimes after it passes the third set.
2) The gap progresses from right to left and loops back. If the gap was last on the far left, it will appear again on the far right.
3) When you go up on the belt for any particular set of weapons, the timing will always be the same. The best thing to do is to position yourself as close to the gap you intend to take as possible and wait for it to open, then run through immediately. Belt 1 will always be the same on any pull. Belt 2 will always be the same on any attempt. Different numbered belts will not be the same as each other.

Thanks a lot.