Are you going to miss your flying mounts for 1 patch?

[Deleted]

My druid, rogue, hunter and in most cases my mage will skip content much less all the people that will just ride by everything.

So, thats a poor excuse. Content will be skipped one way or another.




Then design a way to make it less convenient. Kinda like how they do riding. Not doing so and removing flying is so they can design less.



Yea it is. Blizzard themselves said removing flying allows them to create smaller worlds, thus doing less work, Designing less space and things in that space.

You are ignoring the truth cause you just don't like the thought of it.

Skipping content is one thing - directly enabling it when you are the developer, is sheer resource suicide. You can't possible attribute it to being a bad idea without saying "Because i like flying".

There is a way that is less convinient in the game already with ground mounts. It's called Flight Paths. Very restricted and controlled evniorenments ; but it's what it does - it flies , and takes you to point B from point A. It was there for a reason.

And why do you think that creating smaller spaces is good? Because of resources and producing content at a more steady pace, which has been their goal all along - because that is what people are most clammering about, not lack of flight during 1 patch.

Feel free to point out a single thing i've been "ignoring". I've literally accounted for every single point you've made - I've countered every single point and it still stands solid. I have no bi-as ; because you don't see me going projecting my will onto stuff. I simply reason.

[Disc-]

I have a Swift Zulian Tiger your argument is invalid.

If i get tired of that i have plenty of other choices.

[Deleted]

Removing of flying mounts completely. Only allowing ground mounts.

Not a middle ground AT ALL.

See, I can do that too.

Off-topic: People who are calling flying overpowered need to be shot of a cannon. Also, it seems that the pro-ground mount crowd will not see reason and understanding in the fact that they are removing choice completely so I personally am bowing out of this thread. It's pointless. Will continue to read for laughs though.

Flight paths. That is a middle ground. You can go ground, or take flight in a very restricted controlled fashion.

But that's the issue - You are not arguing out of facts or reason. Because facts and reason dictate that it's a bad idea, and that other systems were in place for a REASON.

Simply going "People who are calling flying overpowered need to be shot of a cannon." - is the OPPOSITE of using facts and reasoning. It's being extremely emotional.

[quras]

Skipping content is one thing - directly enabling it when you are the developer, is sheer resource suicide. You can't possible attribute it to being a bad idea without saying "Because i like flying".

TBC and WoTLK in which we have had the largest game population says different and thats when flying was still fairly new.

It's not flying thats the problem. It's lack of interesting development and poor story. IT's taking good features out randomly for multiple madeup reasons to just add them back months later making all those reason pointless.

There are a whole host of WOW problems but flying isn'y one of them.

There is a way that is less convinient in the game already with ground mounts. It's called Flight Paths. Very restricted and controlled evniorenments ; but it's what it does - it flies , and takes you to point B from point A. It was there for a reason.

There is a way that is less convenient than all that, walking but we don't do that either.

Lest not kill game evolution cause you want to use a lesser means of travel.

And why do you think that creating smaller spaces is good?

It's not good, thats my point. It's developers that admit no flying allows them to do less.

Because of resources and producing content at a more steady pace, which has been their goal all along - because that is what people are most clammering about, not lack of flight during 1 patch.

Goal and yet not accomplished. Hell, were about to have 10 months on no new live content now. They have made that promise since Wotlk and it still hasn't happened.

Lack of flight at max level is not what people are clamoring about either. Especially not in some great number.

Feel free to point out a single thing i've been "ignoring". I've literally accounted for every single point you've made - I've countered every single point and it still stands solid. I have no bi-as ; because you don't see me going projecting my will onto stuff. I simply reason.

and I've countered every reason you imagined up, so whats your point? There is no bias here cause I like ground mounts but like my hunter, I'm not going to use my axe and then bitch about not being able to throw it when I have something that works better.

Flight paths. That is a middle ground. You can go ground, or take flight in a very restricted controlled fashion.

Taking gamers out of the game with automated flightpaths is not the way to help this game.

[NightZero88]

Flight paths. That is a middle ground. You can go ground, or take flight in a very restricted controlled fashion.

Flight paths are not a middle ground. Flight paths only take you from where Blizzard wants to take you to where they want you to go. It's like saying taking a zepplin is the same as a flying mount.

But that's the issue - You are not arguing out of facts or reason. Because facts and reason dictate that it's a bad idea, and that other systems were in place for a REASON.

Actually I am. You are not. I'm saying leave flying mounts because then everyone has a choice. You are saying removing flying because it hurts my immersion and I don't want to be left behind in a race I don't care about and have 0 will-power to stop myself from clicking my flying mount.

Simply going "People who are calling flying overpowered need to be shot of a cannon." - is the OPPOSITE of using facts and reasoning. It's being extremely emotional.

It's not emotional at all. Saying flying is overpowered just sounds dumb. It sounds dumb because it's not something that can be overpowered or underpowered. Are zepplins more OP than flying mounts because they can cross oceans? Using the words overpowered or underpowered when referring to traveling is just...well it just baffles my mind.

[ferosanvilmar]

So though all of leveling though WoD, we won't get to use our flying mounts for one whole patch, needing to wait next patch to be able to use them.

I don't have a big issue with this, but one thing I realized is how all the work I put into getting some flying mounts, many of them I won't get to use on draenor for several months. Sure I could just go back to azeroth and fly around with them there, but who really wants to spend time in old content when theres new content to do?

Are some so attached to there mounts that being prevented from using them in new content a big deal to them?

Gives me a good reason to ride around on my Vicious Warsaber that I just got this season from 3v3 arena...no worries. If I start leveling my alts prior to the 1st patch for Draenor, I have several other cool mounts like the Ultramarine Qiraji Tank, Amani bear, Attunemen's mount, Wooly Rhino, etc. I never use those except running around in BGs and they are all very cool mounts (some rare, some just cool looking).

[rebecca191]

They are removing flight for a patch in the beginning of an expansion, because they don't want players to fly in current content - as that skips content.

It's been stated time upon time upon time upon time upon time by blues on the forums.

And it was a make-shift solution to put in anti-air enemies, it didn't exactly SOLVE the problem. Which is the convinience of flying.

It's not a lack of developer effort - You are intentionally defending a subject with bi-as.

I try much harder to skip content when I am forced to be on the ground. I loathe ground travel so very much that I get whatever I am doing finished as fast as possible. When I fly I don't rush as much, I admire scenery and stop to look and do random achievements and such.

[Bigbazz]

I find that some people are so consumed by the passion and belief in their own opinions that they fail to see or understand the design philosophy that Blizzard has with the restriction. They want to restrict you into playing the game in a certain way (on the ground) so that you experience the game in the way they intend. They are obviously trying to get back to the roots of WoW in feel, and they obviously have good intentions with it.

I do wish that some people could take a step back from their obviously correct opinions and views and just try to take a look at it from an outside perspective, it's a minor inconvenience that they think is good for the design of their game and their content. You can argue all you want but the only negative effect it is going to have on any of you is a minor inconvenience, you may think that it will slow you down in your efficiency to perform menial tasks, but if they are designing around flying mounts not being available they can certaintly take that into consideration.

I honestly have no particularely strong opinions either way but I hope they don't buckle under the pressure of these inconvenienced vocal minority.

[rebecca191]

It is not a minor inconvenience to me. I hate being on the ground so much. It sucks all the fun out for me and what is the point of a game if not to be fun? For me it is game breaking so I will not be playing. I am not masochistic to spend time on a game that isn't fun.

[Deleted]

TBC and WoTLK in which we have had the largest game population says different and thats when flying was still fairly new.

It's not flying thats the problem. It's lack of interesting development and poor story. IT's taking good features out randomly for multiple madeup reasons to just add them back months later making all those reason pointless.

There are a whole host of WOW problems but flying isn'y one of them.



There is a way that is less convenient than all that, walking but we don't do that either.

Lest not kill game evolution cause you want to use a lesser means of travel.



It's not good, thats my point. It's developers that admit no flying allows them to do less.



Goal and yet not accomplished. Hell, were about to have 10 months on no new live content now. They have made that promise since Wotlk and it still hasn't happened.

Lack of flight at max level is not what people are clamoring about either. Especially not in some great number.



and I've countered every reason you imagined up, so whats your point? There is no bias here cause I like ground mounts but like my hunter, I'm not going to use my axe and then bitch about not being able to throw it when I have something that works better.



Taking gamers out of the game with automated flightpaths is not the way to help this game.

So you're just making up scapegoats now ; instead of any actual data or facts. That's cool. Not that i am gonna stoop to that level.

But hey, if you believe TBC and Wrath was so glorious because of flying, suit yourself.

It's not about lesser means of travel. It's about more means of immersion and less promotion of lazy.

You simply believe it's bad ; doesn't make it bad. Especially since you have biased motives.

I guess you must be oblivious to how many are just sitting in SW doing nothing, then going "there is no content for me to do". Wouldn't have this issue if you have to travel and do stuff in the world. But hey, i suppose that's lost on you.

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I try much harder to skip content when I am forced to be on the ground. I loathe ground travel so very much that I get whatever I am doing finished as fast as possible. When I fly I don't rush as much, I admire scenery and stop to look and do random achievements and such.

You are an individual who has a right to own your own opinions. That's about it.

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Flight paths are not a middle ground. Flight paths only take you from where Blizzard wants to take you to where they want you to go. It's like saying taking a zepplin is the same as a flying mount.



Actually I am. You are not. I'm saying leave flying mounts because then everyone has a choice. You are saying removing flying because it hurts my immersion and I don't want to be left behind in a race I don't care about and have 0 will-power to stop myself from clicking my flying mount.



It's not emotional at all. Saying flying is overpowered just sounds dumb. It sounds dumb because it's not something that can be overpowered or underpowered. Are zepplins more OP than flying mounts because they can cross oceans? Using the words overpowered or underpowered when referring to traveling is just...well it just baffles my mind.

It's a means of traveling with flight. Stop twisting reasoning willingly.

You are arguing to not remove flight, because it benefits one side greatly - while keeping illusion of choise. Lack of actual facts and objective perspective.

And lack of objectivity, is being emotional. But nice try, i suppose.

[Fenixdown]

I'll buy TWO of every pet if it means one less person whining about something they haven't even experienced yet.

No, you're absolutely right. I never once went to Timeless Isle.

Try again.

[rebecca191]

Yes. And my opinion is this game completely sucks when flying is heavily restricted, therefore I will not financially support it nor waste my time on it. It is not an inconvenience it is an entire expansion with no current content that allows the play style I enjoy, then to add insult to injury - if I sit the first patch out and try to return and view the content I missed as new, I still can't fly because the flying quest chain is to require a time investment.

Also immersion is a lousy argument because it is so personal. Some feel more immersed on the ground, some in the air, and for some it makes no difference because they either only get immersion from other aspects of the game or they don't tend to get immersed in the game at all.

Honestly the only argument that works is Blizz just feels like trying this design and it remains to be seen whether more or less people will like it compared to past design.

[Rosstafa]

Nope, as I'll be seeing more ground mounts that don't get as much use nowadays.

[Deleted]

Yes. And my opinion is this game completely sucks when flying is heavily restricted, therefore I will not financially support it nor waste my time on it. It is not an inconvenience it is an entire expansion with no current content that allows the play style I enjoy, then to add insult to injury - if I sit the first patch out and try to return and view the content I missed as new, I still can't fly because the flying quest chain is to require a time investment.

Also immersion is a lousy argument because it is so personal. Some feel more immersed on the ground, some in the air, and for some it makes no difference because they either only get immersion from other aspects of the game or they don't tend to get immersed in the game at all.

Honestly the only argument that works is Blizz just feels like trying this design and it remains to be seen whether more or less people will like it compared to past design.

It is easier to create an immersive world based on the ground due to how the game is structured to be on the ground. So, no, it really isn't a personal argument to wether immersion is important or not.

It is created by a lot of factors - But it's standing fact that practically being able to zoom by everything ; is a HUGE detriment to relevance of content and immersion.

The argument that with-holds still ; is that Blizzard feels it was a mistake, and in retro-spect it is. At least from a developers point of view. Given that you can almost calculatedly account for that people will merely fly past your content instead of actually going through it as is intended.

But i suppose it is the way of things to simply side with whatever you favor and then make arguments there of, instead of making arguments based on what they themselves (The designers) actually said a 100 times or more.

Ignorance truly is bliss.

[NightZero88]

It's a means of traveling with flight. Stop twisting reasoning willingly.

You are arguing to not remove flight, because it benefits one side greatly - while keeping illusion of choise. Lack of actual facts and objective perspective.

And lack of objectivity, is being emotional. But nice try, i suppose.

No, I'm arguing to not remove flight because it's pointless. You're arguing to remove flight so you can use your ground mount however you can use your ground mount now. Nobody is stopping you. I have my facts. Removing flying does not do anything for the game you couldn't already do. You want to immerse yourself in the world by being on the ground when you level? Have at it. Nobody is stopping you. How do you not understand this concept? It's as simple as can be. No, you'd rather force your opinion and way of doing things on me despite the fact that my way we can both do what we want. Who's got the lack of objectivity here? I'd say it's you.

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It is easier to create an immersive world based on the ground due to how the game is structured to be on the ground. So, no, it really isn't a personal argument to wether immersion is important or not.

It is created by a lot of factors - But it's standing fact that practically being able to zoom by everything ; is a HUGE detriment to relevance of content and immersion.

The argument that with-holds still ; is that Blizzard feels it was a mistake, and in retro-spect it is. At least from a developers point of view. Given that you can almost calculatedly account for that people will merely fly past your content instead of actually going through it as is intended.

But i suppose it is the way of things to simply side with whatever you favor and then make arguments there of, instead of making arguments based on what they themselves (The designers) actually said a 100 times or more.

Ignorance truly is bliss.

All of the above is 100% opinion based. You cannot say that flying over content does not make me feel immersed in the game. You're right, ignorance is bliss. Your ignorance that you are right even though you aren't. Try looking at things from another point of view besides your own for a change.

[Deleted]

No, I'm arguing to not remove flight because it's pointless. You're arguing to remove flight so you can use your ground mount however you can use your ground mount now. Nobody is stopping you. I have my facts. Removing flying does not do anything for the game you couldn't already do. You want to immerse yourself in the world by being on the ground when you level? Have at it. Nobody is stopping you. How do you not understand this concept? It's as simple as can be. No, you'd rather force your opinion and way of doing things on me despite the fact that my way we can both do what we want. Who's got the lack of objectivity here? I'd say it's you.

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All of the above is 100% opinion based. You cannot say that flying over content does not make me feel immersed in the game. You're right, ignorance is bliss. Your ignorance that you are right even though you aren't. Try looking at things from another point of view besides your own for a change.

And this is why you are emotionally reasoning. You are not even objectively answering my post ; instead you are trying to condense a "No you" into a clever format.

Blizzard themselves already named time upon time upon the reasons for why they want to constrict flying - It's not a case of me versus you. I personally don't give a sh't for immersion in that respect - but it's objectively false to simply acclaim that there is "choise" ; when the leisure of flying is so much superior in such a way that it no longer reflects a fair choice. Which i have already covered.

Which is also why you are YET AGAIN, using emotional reaosning - just disregarding cold hard plain facts of math going "But you have choice" - It's not about having choice. It's about having a BALANCED choice. Big difference. As currently standing ; you are arguing semantics.

Flying over content removes the fact of that you are walking in a majorty of the environments - I.e, you are simply flying past it. There is no point of discussion there to discuss if it's opinion or not ; it's plain fact that you skip a majority of it. A lot of the scenery can simply be skipped with the flying ; there of, immersion being depleted.

So, really - Bring actual arguments instead of veiled "no u's", please.

[moonripper]

I thought it was just flying going away for 1 patch, can't be bothered to find any proof, and maybe i'm just making it up, but pretty sure blizz said flying mounts will still be mountable, just can't fly.

[Jekyll]

ITT people who hates flying mounts but hate to use ground mount when they can fly.

[Thirstblood]

Ok wait... we can't fly ANYWHERE? Including Outland, Northrend, Kalimdor, eastern kingdoms and pandaria or only just WOD area?

[LazerCats]

I'm looking forward to them removing flying from WoD just to see who actually quits over it. It's a win-win for me, either all those people a) don't quit, and I get to laugh at them for sticking around, or b) they quit, and that's just one less voice complaining about every tiny inconvenience WoW imposes on a player. Sorry, if you want to teleport everywhere and one-shot a bunch of loot pinatas, take it to a private server, but I appreciate the game more when things aren't handed to me.