[Resto] Heroic Dark Shamans

[Aleks0410]

On Haromm group, what lvl 60 talent would you guys reckon to be the most efficient? Can't believe I'm thinking this but FoN seems like a good choice here. Usually I don't really like the talent, but I was watching this Resto Druid solo heal 2 tanks and himself with FoN, and it seems like such a solid option. The constant extra HT's going into the debuffed targets. Thoughts?

If we were to bring a 4th person up there, what would be the best option for a first kill? Another healer (we have another Resto Druid and a Resto Shaman to pick from), a Rogue or Lock?

Any general advice for this fight for the Haromm group?

Thanks

[Alltat]

On Haromm group, what lvl 60 talent would you guys reckon to be the most efficient?

Soul of the Forest. SotF+Rejuv is lovely for dealing with the Toxic Mist DoT. Most of the damage you'll be healing comes from that DoT always being on two people, so SotF is perfect. The tank damage is trivial in comparison.

If we were to bring a 4th person up there, what would be the best option for a first kill? Another healer (we have another Resto Druid and a Resto Shaman to pick from), a Rogue or Lock?

Put everyone who doesn't have to be at Kadris in the Haromm group. Kadris is messy and involves a bunch of AoE abilities. Haromm is highly controlled and is pretty much all single target abilities.

Any general advice for this fight for the Haromm group?

Mushroom bloom when the ash falls. Keep everyone at >90% health when possible to avoid Foul Steam/Falling Ash instagibs. Try to get some DPS in early in the fight, as the enrage timer is a bit tight and every little bit helps. Make sure no one drops any Iron Tombs in silly places when you separate them. At >50% health, try to drop most of your tombs in the area where you'll drop the first wall(s), as you won't be able to go there later and space can become an issue later on. Keep careful track of the Iron Prisons that are cast before you separate them: you can't get new IPs in the Haromm group after that, but any old ones will still tick. Put Ironbark on a tank on the pull, then save it for dealing with Iron Prisons until they're no longer a concern.

[zapsqq]

In my guild we run a BM/Prot paladin, feral druid, and myself up top(so any DPS that can heal themselves is pretty decent up top). I run SoTF for the fight with HoTW just for the little bit of extra HP that helps with falling ash BS. I glyph out of WG and glyph into Brez (just due to lack of better choice) for the fight. Like Alltat said, use shrooms for falling ash. I don't think having everyone up top that doesn't need to be be there is the best choice, if I had to heal more than 4 people I'd probably run OOM @ 12k spirit up top (maybe I just suck ^^). Ironbark and Barkskin on CD is your friend on this fight as any amount of dmg you can reduce the better.

[ryklin]

I use FoN and NV, works pretty well for when stuff goes south

I solo heal it with a ret pally or ele shaman (depending on the day), a prot pally, a prot warr, and a rogue, so you'll probably be fine taking more

biggest difference maker is deciding whether or not you'll be safe to bloom after metor to save mana
edit: as opposed to blooming before meteor to make sure people don't die

try to coordinate your side's cds, you can probably do every 3rd or 2nd meteor w/ just personals (ironbark on non-tanks can be very useful if needed)

early on we used purity before meteor falls, but it can be done very easily without


side note: bringing up more non-tanks may cause more tombstones to fall
not sure how it works, but if I'm at range alone 3 fall (2 on melee dps, 1 on me)
but if 2 are at range, 2 fall on the range
but with less people, only 1 falls, I haven't quite figured out how it works

so we have the ret pally run out on top of me whenever he's there to minimize tombstones
when taking more people up there, be VERY careful of foul stream, it will 1 shot people w/ the debuff

[Thandorr]

For our Shamans kill I used Tree. After they lusted and things were getting hairy, it was nice to have the burst healing being low on mana at that time. I was able to keep LB and rejuv on all 10 in raid and roll out free regrowths. Along with the usual Swiftmend and wild growth on CD there was a ton of burst healing while being the only healer still alive.

[Alltat]

I don't think having everyone up top that doesn't need to be be there is the best choice, if I had to heal more than 4 people I'd probably run OOM @ 12k spirit up top (maybe I just suck ^^).

Aside from Falling Ash, all the damage is target capped rather than AoE. As long as you can keep Foul Stream from hitting more than one person, there won't really be more to heal. Toxic Mist is capped at two targets.

[Aleks0410]

How would you guys reforge assuming you didnt have 5% haste up there? 5320 breakpoint?

[Aleks0410]

I find SotF much better on this fight.
We roll with 2 tanks, 2 melee and me. I agree with what Alltat says, although I prefer to use SotF on a full stack of lifebloom, preferably on myself when I have the debuff.
GL!

I just did quick testing in game. It seems you gain more healing from SoTF LB than SoTF Rejuv, unless I did something wrong? I guess the reason people use it with Rejuv is because you can't refresh SoTF LB without loosing the buff?

[asil]

my guild sends a tank/healer with kadris, everyone else is top (with me solo healing) we tried the whole all ranged bot, this way just seems 50 times easier, so it maybe worth trying if you're struggling on dark shamans. as for talents i've always used natures vigil on it.

tips for healing it? make sure bloom is up for every ash, genesis to top dots off after last ticks to prevent ash gibs.

[Aleks0410]

I was under the impression guilds were sending as little as possible to Haromm? But I read more and more comments about people have the entire raid up there except 2 people. How do you kill blobs on Kardris? And isn't it a pain to heal multiple people caught in the foul stream? Surely you can't only have 1 person getting hit by it with 8 people up there?

Also, more interested in lvl 60 talent Asil, I usually also have NV as my standard.

[asil]

I was under the impression guilds were sending as little as possible to Haromm? But I read more and more comments about people have the entire raid up there except 2 people. How do you kill blobs on Kardris? And isn't it a pain to heal multiple people caught in the foul stream? Surely you can't only have 1 person getting hit by it with 8 people up there?

Also, more interested in lvl 60 talent Asil, I usually also have NV as my standard.

i personally use soul of the forest, it just fits my play style, tree might be better if you're struggling during the lust burn.

anyone that gets the stream just moves it away from the group, the group is stacked very tightly, we do 3 rows up of tombs, start another row then move down the ramp, stream moves to the other side of the road group stays in shroom.

as for the blobs, we've done it with a prot paladin killing them, a prot warrior killing them, or a brewmaster monk kiting them.

that being said, i'm not going to lie to you, solo healing 8 people top can be fairly hard during the lust burn, if you don't time everything pretty well it's going to be a cluster fuck, you can also just 3 heal 3 tank it with 2 healers top, this makes it fairly easy.

any second healer would do, but obviously a disc priest or resto shaman would be best.

[Alltat]

How would you guys reforge assuming you didnt have 5% haste up there? 5320 breakpoint?

I wouldn't bother reforging for that one fight. It's not a particularly difficult fight to heal. 90% of the difficulty comes from dealing with mechanics, with the healing being mostly about dealing with the occasional burst AoE. As a healer, the fight is quite similar to heroic Sha of Pride.

I was under the impression guilds were sending as little as possible to Haromm? But I read more and more comments about people have the entire raid up there except 2 people. How do you kill blobs on Kardris? And isn't it a pain to heal multiple people caught in the foul stream? Surely you can't only have 1 person getting hit by it with 8 people up there?

We put one tank, one healer (a disc priest) and one or two ranged on Kadris and the rest on Haromm. You get quite a lot of time to move with the Foul Stream, so it's not really a problem. Since the current tank has to have his back facing the top of the ramp and everyone else has to spread out on the left or right side of the boss to drop tombs along the walls, whoever gets the Foul Stream can run in between those two groups and send the stream down along the ramp. It doesn't always work quite that perfectly in practice, but I don't think I've ever seen more than two people get hit by the stream even with seven people on Haromm. That's on 10H, obviously - I have no idea what works or not on 25H.

The key thing to note is that the number of Iron Tombs, Toxic Mists and Foul Streams don't increase depending on the number of people you have up there, so aside from Falling Ash damage (which has to be healed by someone anyway) there's no difference in difficulty between healing three people and healing eight people on Haromm.

[Purpleisbetter]

I used FoN + NV.

I cycle Barkskin - Iron Bark - Fortifying brew when i need personals on meteors and foul streams.

Just that, massive facerolling.

Our tactic is 2 tank and 2 healers up, rest is down.

[Aleks0410]

Ok, thanks for the tips so far.

Regarding reforging, I've now had 2 people telling me not to bother. Thats disturbing Aren't you potentially losing out on several thousand Mastery that could've helped heal up Mist targets? As I mentioned earlier, we haven't killed Shamans before so I'm looking to min max a bit here. Wouldn't it make sense to get rid of a bunch of haste, assuming you don't have 5% haste on Haromm?

Thanks

[asil]

Ok, thanks for the tips so far.

Regarding reforging, I've now had 2 people telling me not to bother. Thats disturbing Aren't you potentially losing out on several thousand Mastery that could've helped heal up Mist targets? As I mentioned earlier, we haven't killed Shamans before so I'm looking to min max a bit here. Wouldn't it make sense to get rid of a bunch of haste, assuming you don't have 5% haste on Haromm?

Thanks

i mean obviously you could reforge and gain output, but dark shamans isn't really a huge healing check, so it isn't something you HAVE to do.

the breakpoints are not going to make or break you on it.

[Alltat]

Regarding reforging, I've now had 2 people telling me not to bother. Thats disturbing Aren't you potentially losing out on several thousand Mastery that could've helped heal up Mist targets?

You could, but healing the Mists targets isn't all that hard. If you really want to then you could reforge, but the raid won't wipe because you didn't. The raid will wipe because you screw up on the mechanics and no reforging will save them.

If you're really that concerned, just have whoever brings the haste buff join you on Haromm. Unless your DPS are unbelievably bad at killing adds, there is literally no reason to have everyone down by Kadris. The down below is a mess where people have to run around a lot to dodge storms and adds and ash. With Haromm you mostly just stand there, then take a few steps to the side if something targets you.

[Jellog]

If it's still progression for you, then there really isn't any reason not to optimize yourself in any way you can. I just run with my normal setup (SoTF/NV) for Dark Shaman since there is usually 6 of us up there. I don't know if I necessarily agree that it's a trivial thing to heal. We've been farming it forever and it can still stress my throughput/mana. Who knows though, maybe we're just really awesome at taking lots of damage. Last time I looked I had the #1 RDruid parse on WcL/WoL for the fight and we kill it pretty quickly now and I don't do anything special to pad.

Make sure you're cycling Barkskin, Ironbark, Fortifying Brew for the Falling Ash. It helped our guild a lot to have someone calling out a three second warning before ash was going to hit. I always blow my shroom as soon as the Falling Ash damage hits. I could see blowing it right before if you think that someone might die to it. This is also one of the only fights that I pretty consistently use Genesis on. It can help a lot for healing people with Toxic Mist.

We have the person with Foul Stream stand still, and it is everyone elses responsibility not to get hit by it. It's pretty important not to mess this up because it will 1-shot someone with high stacks of the Toxic Mist debuff.

Another thing that's really important to mention is that you should make sure you push the bosses such that Falling Ash isn't hitting at the exact same time as the last tick of Toxic Mist. I think there's something else that we make sure doesn't line up with the Ash - probably Iron Prison. I'm not the one that makes those calls those so I'm unfortunately not going to be a ton of help in letting you know exactly when to push to certain percentages.

[Lavathing]

A comment about how many people to send where:

In my group, which is a 25m (although roughly the same thing holds true for 10m), we send 2 tanks, 3 healers, 2 RDPS (for tomb baiting), and ALL the melee up the hill with Haromm. Then we have 1 tank, 1-2 healers, and the rest of the RDPS down with Kardris. Like Alltat said, the abilities up top with Haroom are mostly target capped (except for standing in a stream), so putting all your melee up there (rather than having toxic storms spawning on them down on kardris) is much easier.

Basically, the ranged are on the ranged boss, and melee on the melee boss. The only exception is making sure you have the required number of players at range for Haromm's tomb ability.

I have a video from our guild that shows both PoVs (Kardris and Haromm): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LuTLszeAVMM

[Thalur]

In my group, which is a 25m (although roughly the same thing holds true for 10m), we send 2 tanks, 3 healers, 2 RDPS (for tomb baiting), and ALL the melee up the hill with Haromm. Then we have 1 tank, 1-2 healers, and the rest of the RDPS down with Kardris. Like Alltat said, the abilities up top with Haroom are mostly target capped (except for standing in a stream), so putting all your melee up there (rather than having toxic storms spawning on them down on kardris) is much easier.

Basically, the ranged are on the ranged boss, and melee on the melee boss. The only exception is making sure you have the required number of players at range for Haromm's tomb ability.

There is no need to have any ranged dps up with Haromm. If you have 3 healers at range, all three will get a tomb every time (and no-one else). Toxic Mists will hit 5 people regardless.

The default tactics are to have all melee on Haromm and all ranged on Kardris. But I guess many tactics are viable now with 20 ilvls more (even tanking both together).

[Lavathing]

There is no need to have any ranged dps up with Haromm. If you have 3 healers at range, all three will get a tomb every time (and no-one else). Toxic Mists will hit 5 people regardless.

The default tactics are to have all melee on Haromm and all ranged on Kardris. But I guess many tactics are viable now with 20 ilvls more (even tanking both together).

Thats what I was saying, and you'll notice I said I am 25m, I'm not suggesting this for 10m. We send up a RDPS to be safe if someone dies right before tombs it doesnt get in melee. But that is what I said, ranged on Kardris, melee on Haromm.