Question about competitive personalities.

[Frozenbeef]

I only do things i know i can win at , i don't like the knock to the ego when i lose/ struggle

[catablitz]

It is weird that none mentioned the obvious. No matter how good or bad you are, competition makes you better. So, even if you are a winner or a looser, there is nothing wrong in keep trying. you can only get better.

[procne]

I'm often called competitive, which in all likelihood is true.
...
I hate losing more than I love winning.
...
I have a competitive personality because I pretty much never lose anything that is purely based on my skill.

Based on those 3 statements I believe you DON'T have competitive personality. You almost never lose, because when you do you give up this competition, because you hate losing more than you love winning, am I right?
If this friend of yours suddenly started winning then you would no longer want to play with him.

People who don't have "ability" to win, but try to be winners are the real competitive personalities. They do everything in their power to win. They are not stopped when they lose but they work continuosly to the top. Whether they have to prove to everyone that they are the best or simply have this goal to win - they will compete and work until they win.

[solvexx]

Based on those 3 statements I believe you DON'T have competitive personality. You almost never lose, because when you do you give up this competition, because you hate losing more than you love winning, am I right?
If this friend of yours suddenly started winning then you would no longer want to play with him.

People who don't have "ability" to win, but try to be winners are the real competitive personalities. They do everything in their power to win. They are not stopped when they lose but they work continuosly to the top. Whether they have to prove to everyone that they are the best or simply have this goal to win - they will compete and work until they win.

You misunderstand. The old saying "hate losing more than you love winning" purely means that you have a drive in you to win because you hate losing..
I guess it's an interesting phrase, one not really in use anymore.

[procne]

Maybe, but then you also can't understand why someone, who keeps losing, continues to fight. This implies you would give up.
Competitive people are not afraid of losing, they will lose 100 times and get up, until they finally win.

he wants to win and he keeps fighting. It may be futile if he doesn't have necesarry "talent", but who said competitive personalities are always logical and practical?

[Drunkenfinn]

Because giving up is worse than losing.

And if you're not trying to win whats the point in trying, even if you end up losing?

Personally I just get more motivated if someone beats me at something (though it does piss me off a lot when I do lose).

[mvaliz]

Ahhhh... /cracks knuckles

In my experience, there are two types of Competitive people.

1) Those who compete simply as a means to improve themselves
2) Those who compete to feel superior to other people/make themselves feel like a king.

One I respect, the other I despise with a passion.

The first one, when failing, says to themselves "wow... cool - lets find out what I did wrong and fix it!". In this case, they'd analyze what they did in a positive objective light, and perhaps walk up to the winner and even be able to ask how they did it as part of it as a means to improve their game.

The second one will either get VERY angry and start making irrational decisions, or worse - start lying and call the "winner" a cheater or they invent reasons why they were the better. You don't learn from that.

DBZ fans will see this as the difference between Goku and Vegeta, which is why Goku always ends up winning against him as Goku doesn't take it personal. :P

I remember one person saying "I'm happy when I'm winning. When I'm winning, I'm not happy" - if you do that, you'll spend the majority of your life totally unhappy as you can never win 100% of the time. Ever. And if you're unhappy, chances are you'll make more mistakes - which means you'll fail even more...

As for you OP - I'm not sure how that guy is reacting, but trying to get better at something because you want to is perfectly fine despite having a lack of skill initially. That's how you develop skills. Very VERY few people are "born" as some silly concept as a natural. Most people keep making mistakes over and over again as a means of perfecting technique (provided of course they're not taking it as a personal affront to their self-worth.) Perhaps he simply sees you as a benchmark.

The reality is that Michael Jordan has missed 10x more shots than he made throughout his career. The reason he's so good now was because he mastered over his failures and learned from them. The reality is that Michael Jordan was not a "natural" with skill... he developed it.

[Deleted]

The best practise is to lose. The more you lose the more you learn and eventually you'll win.

[Eternal Ice]

I'm often called competitive, which in all likelihood is true.
Whether it is playing WoW/CoD, or IRL sports such as Rugby when I was a kid to 10 pin bowling now.
I hate losing more than I love winning.

My girlfriend has a couple of friends who we often go out with, pretty much every Friday and Saturday nights.
One of them constantly tries to beat me at ten pin bowling, but loses each and every time.
We've gone about 25 times so far, and I have beaten him each and every time.

He gets grumpy after each loss, even more so now that I've gotten the hang of it, and I am starting to place respectable scores and he is still down at
about 120 on a good day.

I have a competitive personality because I pretty much never lose anything that is purely based on my skill.
He always loses, and yet he always tries to be competitive.

My question is simply: Why do people who don't have the ability to win, try to be winners?

Might sound snarky, but it is, what it is.

Maybe he actually is more competitive than you?

In WoW, who is more competitive? the guy that only queue in premades for random battlegrounds and even try and bring more members than the allowed by the system so he can have a guaranteed victory, or the guy that competes at high ranking levels in arena? Whereas the first guy may be afraid of losing and only participates in PvP if he have a huge advantage over his rivals, the second one enjoys challenge, enjoys going against players more skilled than him and is not afraid of losing because even if he loses, he'll keep trying and becoming better.

Your friend keeps competing against you because that's what a true competitive person does. Maybe he enjoys the challenge? you on the other hand:

I hate losing more than I love winning.

I have a competitive personality because I pretty much never lose anything that is purely based on my skill.

Which is bad, I don't know you, but chances are that if you hate losing you are not going to try and participate in activities in which you aren't good, which can lead to stagnation.

[diddle]

Better to be a good loser than a bad winner.

There's nothing wrong hating losing and liking to win, it's how you present yourself.

For example, your grudge holding friend seems like a brat.

- - - Updated - - -

My question is simply: Why do people who don't have the ability to win, try to be winners?

Might sound snarky, but it is, what it is.

Somehow missed that critical snippet on my first read.

Sounds like you are kind of a condescending douche, more immature than your friend.

Are you saying that people are either born with talent or not, and you are foolish for trying to better yourself if not born with talent?

Don't be such an asshole.

[plat0nic]

Lol OP you're such a douche. Go play something like Golf or something you Aren't naturally good at and then ask yourself the same dumb fucking question.

[Manhands]

Maybe it's all an act. Maybe he's letting you win because he recognizes how good it makes you feel. Jokes on you, brah.

[mvaliz]

Maybe it's all an act. Maybe he's letting you win because he recognizes how good it makes you feel. Jokes on you, brah.

You know... I'd say that's probably not what's happening, but I have to admit I do that often myself - particularly if that person is having a bad day. :P

I remember one girl who was so upset when we were having lunch and she couldn't pick up her sushi with her chopsticks and got mad. A few minutes later in the middle of talking to her, I picked up mine and deliberately (but not obviously) flubbed them so it fell onto my shirt. She smiled and said "Good, at least I'm not the only one that doesn't suck at it today!"

Worth the cleaning bill. ^_^

[Damerflinn]

What if I told you that playing games does not make you competitive, even if you enjoy winning? You are competitive when you compete against someone who is in the same range-skill as you, or above you, which determines you to surpass them ( in other words, you produce a challange )
Beating a "noob" is not competition. It's mockery.

This post hit the nail on the head. You are not actually competing. You are flaunting your ego. If you were actually competitive you would be doing what this friend of yours is doing. Competition is only competition if there is at least a close level of skill. If you severely out skill your opponent that is not competition it is showing off for the sake of your own ego.

It's much along the lines of people who play WoW, and run around the lower level zones camping people who simply can not fight back, and then justify it as PvP. They don't do it because it is PvP, because it isn't, they do it because it inflates their ego, and brings them some sort of emotional justification.

[Stir]

I've never said that I never lose at anything.
I am not an idiot, I am well aware of the fact that I am not the best at everything in the world.
I am not the best at anything in the world.. Unless sleeping is a sport, I could probably win that.

I am just putting forth the fact that I find it interesting that people have competitive personalities when they aren't winners.
A friend of mine often groups men in to two groups: Alphas and Betas, or leaders and followers.

The traditional sense of an alpha male is stupid, you can be an alpha of academia, or anything you choose. You don't have the have ripped abs, and be amazing at lacrosse to be an alpha. You just need to be a winner at what ever you choose to do in life.

But yet, the bloke gets angry and upset when he loses to me, when he clearly isn't a winner at any form of sport.

First off: Lose the attitude. Seriously. The whole 'classing' men in alphas and betas will turn you into an arrogant sod, and some people might take a lot of offense at it... In your face. It's also not a very healthy social outlook. This friend of yours who does that should not influence you with this nonsense.

Second: It's about the game. Even if it isn't about winning or losing, it's still about playing the game. For you it is all about winning. For this friend of yours, it might just be about playing the game and nothing more. But if you always lose, you're not playing the game. You're just losing. To someone who's just a plain bad sport.

Basically: Your behaviour is egotistical. Self-centered.

Instead of trying to win, you might want to try to relax and see where simply playing will get you.

[mvaliz]

This post hit the nail on the head. You are not actually competing. You are flaunting your ego. If you were actually competitive you would be doing what this friend of yours is doing. Competition is only competition if there is at least a close level of skill. If you severely out skill your opponent that is not competition it is showing off for the sake of your own ego.

It's much along the lines of people who play WoW, and run around the lower level zones camping people who simply can not fight back, and then justify it as PvP. They don't do it because it is PvP, because it isn't, they do it because it inflates their ego, and brings them some sort of emotional justification.

I remember Kevin Smith was talking about a documentary about Wayne Gretzky. When Wayne was on the street playing hockey with friends when he was young, after the game ended - he walked inside his parents home, grabbed another stick and some equipment and walked outside again. When his grandfather asked what Wayne was doing, he said "Our goalie was absolutely terrible out there, so I'm going to teach him some techniques".

Kevin Smith commented that is what you see in Canada, and if the same thing happened in America - the guy wouldn't have helped the goalie, he would've just beat the crap out of him for "failing the team".

[plat0nic]

Not really fair =/

[Felya]

Sometimes losing is the best path to winning...

[Damax]

I remember Kevin Smith was talking about a documentary about Wayne Gretzky. When Wayne was on the street playing hockey with friends when he was young, after the game ended - he walked inside his parents home, grabbed another stick and some equipment and walked outside again. When his grandfather asked what Wayne was doing, he said "Our goalie was absolutely terrible out there, so I'm going to teach him some techniques".

Kevin Smith commented that is what you see in Canada, and if the same thing happened in America - the guy wouldn't have helped the goalie, he would've just beat the crap out of him for "failing the team".

I wish there was a like button like on facebook for this post. Its not so much about the country bias in it although probably slightly true both situation happens on both side anyway imo. I remember when I was young and playing fighting game with my brother even though he was older I was always beating the crap out of him because I was better at learning and doing special moves which was (99% of our metagame)... one day I taught him special moves and he began to win some games and he eventually taught me stuff (combos and more metagame stuff)