Need Mage help for N Garrosh 10m

[NRL1515]

Hello dear masters of Fire, Arcane, and Frost:

I come to you seeking advice and insight with our mage in our 10m group. We've been working on Garrosh for almost 80 wipes now, and lately it doesn't seem like we're making a whole lot of consistent efforts night in and night out. I have a feeling our ranged group is lacking, and I want to know if there are any glaring issues with our mage that need attention ASAP.

Armory: http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...elina/advanced

Logs from night #1: http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/r...d59/details/5/
Logs from night #2 (ignore thok, blackfuse, and paragons obv): http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/r...tdu/details/0/

Our strategy involves the range trying to keep in a tight group as much as possible to drop desecrates on the outer edge of the room, and then to come in and stack with melee for MCs before moving out again for whirls and then the following desecrate. We used to have them kill weapons during phase 2 due to most people's inability to place desecrates NOT in the middle of the room, but we have dabbled with ignoring desecrates during p2 so we can focus more damage onto garrosh and just drill into people's heads that axes in the middle of the room are NOT acceptable.

At a cursory glace (and from input from others from other forums), I'm aware his living bomb uptime is low, and that there are parts of the fight where he doesn't seem to be very active. Now, he's had internet issues from time to time (which is a whole other issue and he will be replaced if it isn't worked out) which MAY attribute to all that, but I want to know if there's anything else I'm missing which needs to be fixed before we move on.

Thank you for your time, and I appreciate any and all help you guys can give in this matter.

[ChristopherD87]

No expert here, but here's my logs from garrosh (I'm in less gear than that mage) with no meta or cloak

http://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/...mmary&source=1

One thing I notice, he had 367 brainfreezes but only 296 FFb, should be equal and used every time or close to it.

Don't have time ATM to in depth look thru them, I can a little later, but that right there is a huge dps loss

[Deleted]

The Mage dps does look low, but the ranged in general is low.

With your raid set up you should have the melee run out for mc and whirls. Your current strat is a large raid dps loss, because you're catering to your low melee dps and not your 4 ranged dps.

And yes leave the desecrates in P2

[Phookah]

No expert here, but here's my logs from garrosh (I'm in less gear than that mage) with no meta or cloak

http://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/...mmary&source=1

One thing I notice, he had 367 brainfreezes but only 296 FFb, should be equal and used every time or close to it.

Don't have time ATM to in depth look thru them, I can a little later, but that right there is a huge dps loss

While the amount of FFB used was low, mages will pretty much NEVER get every FFB proc, and you shouldn't expect to. Telling people they should get every one is a bit of a fallacy. Around 95% is a good number to try for.

[NRL1515]

The Mage dps does look low, but the ranged in general is low.

With your raid set up you should have the melee run out for mc and whirls. Your current strat is a large raid dps loss, because you're catering to your low melee dps and not your 4 ranged dps.

And yes leave the desecrates in P2

I can see having the melee run out for whirl (our rogue does a very good job mitigating/reducing the damage he takes from it), but our DK takes a lot of damage to that. However, I talent Ring of Peace (I'm a BrM Monk) for this fight, and we find handling MCs gets a LOT easier if we have everyone stack up in melee - there's just a lot more interrupts to go around with the tanks in the picture as well. We went with that strategy because people just were not handling MCs correctly when we split up into two groups (melee and ranged).

Thanks so much for the replies; so far it seems our mage is on the right track, and isn't holding us back as much as other members are.

[ZalidtheBur]

Our strategy is very similar to yours. We drop the weapons at edge of the room and ignore them.

What we do though is this:
1. Range move to throne and drop 1st weapon there,
2. Boss is moved from centre to next weapon placement area and MCs are sorted during this move,
3. All nuke boss,
4. Boss is moved away by the tank to the next weapon placement area, and melee move to range during whirling.
Depending on which weapon is being dropped, melee sometimes have time to get to the boss in the small window between whirling and desecrate. Some can also mitigate the damage (rogue cloak of shadows) and stay in for whirling.
5. Range group drop the weapon,
6. Range run into melee for MC,
7. Go to step 4

This allows the range to keep nuking the boss almost full time. Only time they move is for the desecrate. Obviously they nuke the people MCd as well.

As to specifics about your mage. I'm not that sure about frost mage as I only play fire, but a couple of things stand out.
His Living Bomb uptime is not bad, though it could be a little better.
His Invoker's Energy is also not bad, but could be better.
I thought his Frost Orb use was terrible. But then I checked a log of our frost mage and he does not use it much, so maybe not a big deal.
His Mirror Image use is only half what it should be. Not a big dps increase, but does help.

I agree with what others stated. Your range dps seems low. Your group dps is about 280k less than what ours was last month when we got our first kill. More importantly is that it is about 140k less during p2 + p3. That's about 20k for each dps (keeping tank dps in mind).
Changing your strategy a little to the way we do it will help the range as they will not have to stop nuking due to moving away from whirl, as the boss is moved instead.
Hopefully it is just your need for higher dps that is holding you back as you've made no mention of issues during empowered whirling and interrupts, which most groups have more issues with. So GL

[NRL1515]

@Xerty: Thanks for the reply, we may have to switch our strategy a little just to eke out more dps from our ranged. We'll give that way a try (move the boss instead of having the ranged move for whirlings) and see how it goes.

[ArclightRL]

Looking at Cicelina's spells cast during your encounters and she's casting about 60% of the amount of ice lances I did at her ilvl.. She doesn't have the cleave glyph which would be a nice buff to damage which would reduce the amount of ice lances, but also her frozen orbs looks like it's not being kept on CD which is essential for forcing procs.

Your strat should be fine though, dotting up the des weapon and having a focus when needed should be fine

Also she is keeping on top of evocation very well and getting rid of procs asap which is essential

Not having a decent trinket would be a fair burn to damage though

GOOD LUCK!!!

[gallamann]

One thing that Garrosh does is allow DPS to pad their numbers in P1, get on you people about that. The Tank on adds should always be #1 DPS by a mile during P1. DPS using AoE attacks instead of single target are padding. As DPS in P1, priority is Wolf Rider, Garrosh aka SINGLE TARGET. The tank on adds, Iron Star and cloak AoE are sufficient to kill those adds, anyone like your rogue who is big time padding, is doing nothing but extending time spent in P1, aka they could have put more damage on Garrosh, shortened P1 and thus the number of weapons/wolf riders/engineers that need to be dealt with.

During intermission, have everyone spam instant on Garrosh the moment the last add dies, this will stop his rage gain faster and may be the difference between 25+ rage after 2nd intermission, at 25 or more rage you get empowered whirls. Another tidbit, the rogue can Shadowstep in to Garrosh before last add is dead, Garrosh will be immune to damage until last add dies but it put them into melee quick. Specifically for mage, in the one with medium adds, I throw a living bomb on all three and then AE, I am always the first person to last set of three on my side and stay range to DoT while tank arrives then step in to AE. On little adds one, I am always first to top (I mash my pet follow button while running) and drop a flamestrike which hits just as our tanks arrive with adds.

When Garrosh is about to head into intermission (like 3 secs before) call for anyone who can to DoT his ass, you can also get instants off as being pulled up on Garrosh. As a mage, I always try to Evocate right before he goes up so I don't have to during intermission phase.

P2, drop 1st weapon at throne and move right (or left), have the mage DoT one time with LB and the Warlock use their Havoc on the weapon. Mark one ranged, and make the rest of the range stay stacked on that person. Ranged with mark is responsible for shuffling the range group as close as possible to the current weapon (keeping in mind that DoT and Havoc Chaos Bolt are constantly shrinking it). This will always drop the next weapon right next to the current weapon, leaving more room to drop weapon. Any other damage on weapon is damage that should be on Garrosh.

When you come back from the next intermission, do the same thing, our group likes to go to left of throne for that set but you could just as easily pick up where you left off before intermission.

We do not move back to melee for MC's, however we are 4 ranged DPS so we have the interrupts and damage at both places. Mage can counter spell any MC to interrupt cast. Before P3 warlock can use Shadowfury to get both MC's if they are both at range or both at melee.

All ranged during P2 when there are no Empowered Whirls, should always be with 1 yard of each other, make people understand there is no reason to not be on the marked person during this phase. It makes healing easier and ensures proper placement of weapons.

As a mage, I like to save my orb for MC's, that ensures I have FoF procs, which allows me to quickly break one MC. If I know my Orb is on cool, I will hold on to a BF and any FoF I have just before MC comes out, again to quickly break that person out.

Empowered Whirls, we usually get 1 before P3 in engaged, its important people get their add and kill it away from other adds, then help on remaining adds. As mage I get about 5 yards from everyone, wait for purple shit under my feet, move, and use an instant on add (FoF, BF or IL) into LB, it may start to run if you used IL, don't panic just shove a frostbolt into in and it should come right back.

Once your in P3, let a tank kite the Empowered Whirl adds, pop hero moment Garrosh runs to middle, and burn. Any damage down there is taken off the amount he heals back up.

Edit - if your mage doesn't have it already, have them macro Counter Spell. My syntax below may be off not in game. It allows you to instantly interrupt, otherwise your waiting on last spell cast to complete.

/cancel cast
/cast counterspell

[ZalidtheBur]

/cancel cast
/cast counterspell

IIRC, its :
/stopcasting
/cast counterspell

[kjdocs]

I don't know if this mage logged out in a different set of gear, but missing enchants, missing gems, missing belt buckle, which means probably not reforged either.

Thats a problem and an indication of not much thought into this toon.