Possibly no flying throughout entire xpac.

[Nayaga]

But we DID benefit from it. To an extent.

I will not benefit from flying being removed.

[Dragoncurry]

Interesting.

How? Until VR was implemented I think their bottom line benefited. And because you can bypass leveling now, it seems that their goal was met. unless I am missing something (which is possible). How do you think we saw a benefit?

I used to be on Bloodscalp, and leveling was a nightmare for me cuz it was so BOOOORING with no one around. After CRZ, level 60+ my rogue could gank some people throughout Hellfire and in Cata, and for the first time since Tarren Mill, we had some pretty intense WpVP in hellfire with people bringing 90s in and raiding Honor Hold and it got slightly more enjoyable.

- - - Updated - - -

I will not benefit from flying being removed.

So go fly in Northrend, and benefit away.

[bryroo]

So go fly in Northrend, and benefit away.

So basically you got your way and everyone else can piss off, eh?

Enjoy your expansion I guess.

[Nayaga]

So go fly in Northrend, and benefit away.

I will not benefit from flying being allowed in Northrend since there is nothing there to benefit me. When WoD comes out, I will be in WoD zones, image that!

[quras]

You guys have good reasons to hate TI. TI is mad worthless lorewise, the rares are not only randomly rare but they also have no lore behind them nor any strategy as they are zerged down for the most part, the quests are boring, the platforming is nothing special and most of all you're right, it does NOT add compelling gameplay. GRANTED.

However, what you all are misunderstanding at a very fundamental level is that Timeless Isle is one giant experiment about a questing style that could apply really well to something that DOES matter lorewise. Imagine for a moment, an Icecrown where you have to progress through the zone as we did with the Argent Crusade, with lore relevant rares appearing every X time to assault the base, to hinder certain objectives, etc. These provide very relevant gear for alts. Imagine, some platforming in the caves where the Faceless Voids are where death is a real possibility and where if you died, your corrupted versions or corrupted versions of other players could combine into a recurring "elite" creature you face, similar to that in Timeless Isle. HOWEVER, because the zone is much larger than Timeless Isle and these events occur throughout the entire continent, a swarm of players won't be rushing in to save your ass, it'll be a few. Now, just imagine that there's no flying but there are minigames where you can use flying mounts, similar to that in the Storm Peaks where you're wrestling with the proto Drake or climbing to Thorim's tower or maybe some airship battles. For those on PVP servers, the chance of World PvP increases due to more exposure, and the same faction dueling thing includes PvP on unbalanced realms. There's a lot of real possibilities there.

Understand that this potential all steps from the boring heap of ass that is timeless isle. Compelling gameplay CAN come in ground content, and can come from things we learned in TI. The quests CAN be improved from what they have in TI, and so can the rare mobs. The lore CAN be compelling if it's not boring TI lore.

You make a good point but Sweetpeaz post below is right. Along with everything you just said is imagination and "what if"

I don't spend $50 on a 10 year old game for what if's jsut so they can remove solid game features that are enjoyable and have been since they were implemented 7+ years ago. If flying was indeed this problem, TBC and WoTLK would have turned out vastly different.

The problem is blizzard push for TI content and the hopes and dreams what it looks like in wod will be different. I no longer believe blizzard is capable of that creativity or pacing in content. Live is taking a hit because blizzard cannot produce solid, lasting content and I'm to believe they will make TI style content in wod meaning full for months after I hit max level all so they can remove flying.

Thats not a move worth investing $50 in.

Look, I get that. But any direction that has the potential for success should be embraced.

If that held any truth flying would never be considered for removal given how it helped successfully pushed wow to 12 million subs while cataclysm and mop did nothing but bleed subs. Potential does not mean successful.

I'm a firm believe that you do not remove something from a mmo game that makes you stand out in the crowd of MMO games.

Otherwise, we will have the same old shit,

If that same old shit is successful, helps boost your sales not only in continued subs but through your cash shop, you expand on it. You don't neuter it.

and as you have said, it's evolved to a point where it is not the same as it was a long time ago, and the changes have not necessarily been for the better. You can either remain here or keep evolving. I choose the latter. Sure, Blizz may miss the mark. But it's better than sitting on something that you believe is already missing on most fronts.

The game should continue evolving. What we are seeing is some DE-evolution going back to the days of vanilla. Those were not good times when it came to travel. I'd like for nostalgia to not involved in the development and design of a game we all hope is looking forward but at this monent I can't see that it is. Thus it gets no support from me.

[gamingmuscle]

As this guy has proven throughout countless threads, his posts are backed up by solid facts and statistics that you can find in Urasim's Encyclopedia of Opinionated Facts and Conjectures.

His post isn't fact, but it is reasonable. You could probably design content such that ground only travel would be as "quick" as it is now with flight. Travel distances would either have to be smaller or more quest overlapping and less chaining. Course that same content would be quicker with flight...so in an essence you could argue that it is slower. But I doubt that is why flight removal is a consideration. I can't see travel speed being more than a small factor in how quickly we consume content. Really the larger limiting factors are things like limited # of dailies can be completed or currency caps, hard gating (legendary quest), and reward depreciation.

[urasim]

If that's the only thing you're brain can comprehend then you have no reason being here.

Despite how fast one mount is compared to another, quest grinding, mat farming, etc etc, can be designed to be just as quick with ground mounts. (god i feel stupid having to explain this). Blue posts have even stated this fact many many times. Wake up and quit playing stupid.

That isn't the only thing. I was just point out how silly your argument is. There are other factors that make ground mounts far slower than flying mounts. Things like traversing through hazardous terrain, terrain that has tons of mountains or bodies of water, and tons of trash mobs in your path, etc...

Flight paths are not straight lines in WoD. We have proof of that. Each zone will have max level content. Flying mounts would be the best(fastest) way to get to each of these areas if they were available to players. Claiming otherwise is stupid.

We will see more of WoD in the coming weeks that will prove even more so that flight paths are not straight, that terrain and trash mobs are in the way, and that high level content is spread really far apart with no direct flight path to each area.

[quras]

SNIP...

Despite how fast one mount is compared to another, quest grinding, mat farming, etc etc, can be designed to be just as quick with ground mounts. (god i feel stupid having to explain this).

You should feel stupid because blizzard will not remove flying to slow content consumption and then just add back in multiple ways to make it just as fast all so they can make you do TI-style content.

It will not happen so don't fall for some PR BS.

You are probably one of those that believe blizzard when they said they were putting in flying at patch 6.1

Guess what, that didn't happen. Don't believe the PR BS.

God I feel stupid for having to bring you to reality.

Blue posts have even stated this fact many many times. Wake up and quit playing stupid.

Blue post imagined up some stupid scenario of getting into a castle and killing mobs and there have been countless posts on how that same scenario could be created and leave in flight. Allowing multiple ways to complete a quest depending on your flavor which is what MMORPGS should be doing.

Not this garbage blizzard is pushing with no flying thinking TI-style content is some salvation for their poor content delivery.

[Ordinator]

That isn't the only thing. I was just point out how silly your argument is. There are other factors that make ground mounts far slower than flying mounts. Things like traversing through hazardous terrain, terrain that has tons of mountains or bodies of water, and tons of trash mobs in your path, etc...

Flight paths are not straight lines in WoD. We have proof of that. Each zone will have max level content. Flying mounts would be the best(fastest) way to get to each of these areas if they were available to players. Claiming otherwise is stupid.

We will see more of WoD in the coming weeks that will prove even more so that flight paths are not straight, that terrain and trash mobs are in the way, and that high level content is spread really far apart with no direct flight path to each area.

You're under the impression that content in WoD is like content in MoP and that's the only thing you have to go on. It's entirely obvious the only thing you base anything you say on is your imagination of not being able to fly in MoP. I can promise that you have no idea what you're talking about.

You're asking that giant mountains and large bodies of water to be not daunting and just something to fly over. What a boring way to look at these things. You're basically the definition of why Blizzard is removing flying. If WoD is too inconvenient for you to play, I'll happily wave goodbye to you and everyone else who has been ruining this game for years now.

[Infernix]

You're under the impression that content in WoD is like content in MoP and that's the only thing you have to go on. It's entirely obvious the only thing you base anything you say on is your imagination of not being able to fly in MoP. I can promise that you have no idea what you're talking about.

You're asking that giant mountains and large bodies of water to be not daunting and just something to fly over. What a boring way to look at these things. You're basically the definition of why Blizzard is removing flying. If WoD is too inconvenient for you to play, I'll happily wave goodbye to you and everyone else who has been ruining this game for years now.

"Anyone who doesn't like the game like this can LEAVE! You won't be missed!"

A year later...

"WHY ARE ALL THE QUEUES SO HIGH? WHY IS THERE SO MUCH STUFF IN THE IN-GAME STORE? WHY IS MY SERVER SO DEAD???"

pro-tip: when people are already abandoning the game at the rate of a million people per year and you're dealing with a year-long content drought and the prospect of a shitty expansion at the end of that drought, the last thing you really should be doing is pushing people to leave.

Because they will. In huge numbers.

But hey, the game can survive on 500k players, right? Everyone else can suck it up and go play other games. It can't possibly effect the game quality and pace of development and new content release, right?

[urasim]

You're under the impression that content in WoD is like content in MoP and that's the only thing you have to go on. It's entirely obvious the only thing you base anything you say on is your imagination of not being able to fly in MoP.

WRONG! Do you not understand that we have the alpha and soon beta? We can see the evidence right now. Is there a reason why you're ignoring it?

I can promise that you have no idea what you're talking about.

Oh, yeah? Can you prove it? I can prove my points by pointing you in the direction of reality. We can view WoD content right now. Or, maybe you're blind?

You're asking that giant mountains and large bodies of water to be not daunting and just something to fly over.

WRONG! I am showing you that your argument about content being just as fast is BULLSHIT.

If WoD is too inconvenient for you to play

Can you point out where I said it was too inconvenient? I only made those points because you seem to be living in bizzaro land where faster is slower and slower is faster. I only countered your post with what is actually happening in real life. Maybe you should look into the game you're defending.

[Ordinator]

WRONG! Do you not understand that we have the alpha and soon beta? We can see the evidence right now. Is there a reason why you're ignoring it?

I didn't know end game content and the entirety of Dreanor is playable right now.. Oh its not. Quit acting like you know anything. The alpha offers nothing of value on this subject. And you saying "I see alpha coverage so I got facts" won't work for you.

- - - Updated - - -

Can you point out where I said it was too inconvenient? I only made those points because you seem to be living in bizzaro land where faster is slower and slower is faster. I only countered your post with what is actually happening in real life. Maybe you should look into the game you're defending.

Every single post from you is you crying that the game is going to be too hard, too slow, to inconvenient. Literally any post i quote of yours will be in this formula.

[urasim]

I didn't know end game content and the entirety of Dreanor is playable right now.. Oh its not. Quit acting like you know anything. The alpha offers nothing of value on this subject. And you saying "I see alpha coverage so I got facts" won't work for you.

The endgame questing area in the starting zone that isn't near a flight path can be viewed on streams. I guess you missed it. Blizzard stated that endgame content will be in each zone, and the stream proved my point that it is out of the way. You don't have any points anymore. They're all counted with the evidence from the alpha. You lose.

- - - Updated - - -

Every single post from you is you crying that the game is going to be too hard, too slow, to inconvenient. Literally any post i quote of yours will be in this formula.

You make a claim here. Now back it up by posting that I think it's too inconvenient.

I have many posts saying that I want the queue system gone. Which means I want the game to become much less convenient. Try again.

[nizzlain]

I feel like they couldve done a much better job with this whole flying stuff. Does anyone else remember WAY back in BC where when you were flying around and there were cannons on the ground? They would shoot you and almost kill you with 1-2 shots. You actually had to dodge them. Or even better, lets make flying dangerous. Add flying dragons (or w.e, just using dragons as a example) that will get you if you get too close. Sortve like a flying Fel Reaver from Hellfire. Actually make flying dangerous. BUT instead Blizz takes the good ol lazy route and simply "remove the problem" instead of doing something unique and fun.

[Ordinator]

The endgame questing area in the starting zone that isn't near a flight path can be viewed on streams. I guess you missed it. Blizzard stated that endgame content will be in each zone, and the stream proved my point that it is out of the way. You don't have any points anymore. They're all counted with the evidence from the alpha. You lose.

They don't have a flight master in one questing area in one zone in alpha. HOLY FUCK THIS EXPO IS DOOMED. No. You're the idiot using alpha as evidence and you lost a long time ago.

Remember when i said every post of yours is you crying about being inconvenienced and you said that's not true. Keep proving me right.

[urasim]

I feel like they couldve done a much better job with this whole flying stuff. Does anyone else remember WAY back in BC where when you were flying around and there were cannons on the ground? They would shoot you and almost kill you with 1-2 shots. You actually had to dodge them. Or even better, lets make flying dangerous. Add flying dragons (or w.e, just using dragons as a example) that will get you if you get too close. Sortve like a flying Fel Reaver from Hellfire. Actually make flying dangerous. BUT instead Blizz takes the good ol lazy route and simply "remove the problem" instead of doing something unique and fun.

Honestly, I wouldn't mind more canons. Or, a lengthy legendary quest to get flying back at release. Hell, I wouldn't even mind completing all quests, instances, scenarios, and normal version of raids to get flying back. If I can complete all content, why can't I have flight back?

[Shimple]

People get really butthurt when it comes to things like this. Try it and if you don't like it then quit. We probably won't miss you.

[urasim]

They don't have a flight master in one questing area in one zone in alpha. HOLY FUCK THIS EXPO IS DOOMED. No. You're the idiot using alpha as evidence and you lost a long time ago.

Remember when i said every post of yours is you crying about being inconvenienced and you said that's not true. Keep proving me right.

You have yet to prove that I am concerned about being inconvenienced. I'm only countering your statements about content being just as fast. I never said that I hate being inconvenienced. I even showed that I want more inconvenience added to the game.

I proved that you're wrong, and you insult me instead of trying to prove that my statements are wrong.

[Ordinator]

You have yet to prove that I am concerned about being inconvenienced. I'm only countering your statements about content being just as fast. I never said that I hate being inconvenienced. I even showed that I want more inconvenience added to the game.

I proved that you're wrong, and you insult me instead of trying to prove that my statements are wrong.

Saying "i'm countering you" and "I proved that you're wrong" doesn't make any of that true. You've proved nothing. You're watching alpha streams. That's it.

[gamingmuscle]

Saying "i'm countering you" and "I proved that you're wrong" doesn't make any of that true. You've proved nothing. You're watching alpha streams. That's it.

So it's 0-0 even game... lol