Possibly no flying throughout entire xpac.

[Maneo]

I also liked flying because it gave me a sense of character progression upon reaching the level cap, and I enjoyed being freed from the ground. It was a satisfying reward.

Also it added something else.

Previously I would go out and hunt down mounts when I got bored. During the end of MoP I was running about every raid/dungeon that dropped a mount. Now when I get bored I think about doing that, but realize why bother, can't use em they way the are intended (majority of flying mounts look dumb on the ground), so now I only farm Invincible

- - - Updated - - -

I haven't been here in 10 pages, are people still denying the existence of the garrison campaign quests?

They are there, however personally I have been done with them for sometime now, and there is nothing else coming in 6.1 in regards to new content except treasure hunter missions, and the bounty missions.

[Baconeggcheese]

Your debate, your argument, your position?

and what is my cause?

[Drytoast]

and what is my cause?

Ok...got it. When you've been caught contradicting yourself, you become obtuse.

[MoanaLisa]

Meanwhile I'd be doing more exploring if I could fly.

In a general sense the zones are smaller and the leveling experience (if finished) took you through a lot of it. So what exactly is there to explore at this point for most players?

I've been pretty open about my very casual way of playing (3-4 days a week at most) and I have plenty of things to do still but if I wanted to finish exploring Draenor, even on the ground it wouldn't take more than an hour or so to uncover the few subzones that I haven't been through.

[Sweetpeaz]

In a general sense the zones are smaller and the leveling experience (if finished) took you through a lot of it. So what exactly is there to explore at this point for most players?

I've been pretty open about my very casual way of playing (3-4 days a week at most) and I have plenty of things to do still but if I wanted to finish exploring Draenor, even on the ground it wouldn't take more than an hour or so to uncover the few subzones that I haven't been through.

It doesn't have to be exploration in that sense, it could be just a different perspective of the view. It could be anything. Heck....if it keeps your mind off of the startling lack of content alone, that's a good thing!!!!

[cuafpr]

I haven't been here in 10 pages, are people still denying the existence of the garrison campaign quests?

oh they are there and i just have to watch my toon get carried, an NPC enemy fly away, and see my "air force" in action in the last part of it... yeah my Garrison troops can fly but their commander can't.. wtf.

[pankind]

oh they are there and i just have to watch my toon get carried, an NPC enemy fly away, and see my "air force" in action in the last part of it... yeah my Garrison troops can fly but their commander can't.. wtf.

That's all well and good but it's far cry from "quests that don't exist" just sayin'

[bryroo]

In a general sense the zones are smaller and the leveling experience (if finished) took you through a lot of it. So what exactly is there to explore at this point for most players?

I've been pretty open about my very casual way of playing (3-4 days a week at most) and I have plenty of things to do still but if I wanted to finish exploring Draenor, even on the ground it wouldn't take more than an hour or so to uncover the few subzones that I haven't been through.

This is why I believe they have no intention of turning on flight in Draenor. With Blizzard demanding such a high investment to return ratio on their content I don't believe they'll waste resources on flight specific Draenor areas. If there aren't those areas why bother turning flight on and speeding up content consumption?

[Drytoast]

This is why I believe they have no intention of turning on flight in Draenor. With Blizzard demanding such a high investment to return ratio on their content I don't believe they'll waste resources on flight specific Draenor areas. If there aren't those areas why bother turning flight on and speeding up content consumption?

This is a great thread with regards to how it defines "stamina" of the player versus chores in the game. Blizzard in all their idiocy, failed to realize that the removal of QoL features without the increase of awards, upset the imbalance of their game play.

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/15699784744

And while I know this guy didn't include flight in his thread, it belongs in there, as allot of people have complained about lack of flight more so than any other topic regarding WoD. But he most likely left it out to get his point across and not have his thread devolve into a flight/anti flight argument thread.

[bryroo]

This is a great thread with regards to how it defines "stamina" of the player versus chores in the game. Blizzard in all their idiocy, failed to realize that the removal of QoL features without the increase of awards, upset the imbalance of their game play.

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/15699784744

And while I know this guy didn't include flight in his thread, it belongs in there, as allot of people have complained about lack of flight more so than any other topic regarding WoD. But he most likely left it out to get his point across and not have his thread devolve into a flight/anti flight argument thread.

I did read that thread and I agree with it. In an effort to keep things from feeling mandatory Blizzard has swung the pendulum to far in the other direction and left the end game lacking any kind of cohesion. Dungeons need a more concrete reward system for rerunning them and to possibly make them an alternative to players who want to stay out of raids. Old school rep grinds were just a terrible decision especially in lieu of daily hubs. I doubt Blizz will pay the thread any mind but it's nice he was acknowledged for an intelligent and well structure post.

As for nonflight causing burnout I'm not sure about that. I'm not convinced Draenor offers enough world at this point to get people out of their Garrisons on a regular basis even if flight were turned on. I can agree on players feeling the overwhelming amount of changes in WoD attributing to loss of stamina though.

It's hard to roll with the punches on design decisions when the reasons they give for them don't make much sense and when you're logging on and you've looking for a feature and you go 'why is that gone? it was fine before.' I can definitely see why that would wear down on a player on a daily basis.

I can't figure at why the don't just put JP or VP back in the game as dungeon rewards and allow purchaseable ilvl upgrades.

[MoanaLisa]

I did read that thread and I agree with it. In an effort to keep things from feeling mandatory Blizzard has swung the pendulum to far in the other direction and left the end game lacking any kind of cohesion. Dungeons need a more concrete reward system for rerunning them and to possibly make them an alternative to players who want to stay out of raids. Old school rep grinds were just a terrible decision especially in lieu of daily hubs. I doubt Blizz will pay the thread any mind but it's nice he was acknowledged for an intelligent and well structure post.

Yeah, it's the best read over there in a while. I'm a little jealous of it . I think there's also something to be said that they took the feedback generally for Timeless Isle which was largely unstructured, built the WoD zones around that idea including keeping everyone on the ground for the most part and then put an overlay of quests and a garrison on it. I have always questioned whether or not half a dozen zones that lack any structure once you finish the quests was a really good idea. Another example I guess of Blizzard's all-in or all-out way of doing things. The garrison was likely supposed to impose the task structure but building the thing up was too quick, simple management came too soon and when that got boring to do (which was rather quickly for most) the task structure for the game just disappears.

There's less there about flying than I like for the thread but the core decision to use TI as a template for nearly everything in the world affected a great deal; not always for the better.

[iperson]

I'm not moving the goal posts...good for you, you found 5. It probably even took you less time than 5 minutes as google search most likely brought up the results in less than a second...

So is your goal and enjoyment in controlling how people are suppose to play this game? Is that what you are getting at with the second part of this post?

You think people should get the best gear mailed to them when they hit level 100? If not, then why do you want to control how others play the game? There wouldn't be anything forcing you to use said gear. Just because someone out there would like it doesn't make it good for the game (and luckily for me the developers agree...)

[Drytoast]

You think people should get the best gear mailed to them when they hit level 100? If not, then why do you want to control how others play the game? There wouldn't be anything forcing you to use said gear. Just because someone out there would like it doesn't make it good for the game (and luckily for me the developers agree...)

I actually don't want to control how others play the game!



Luckily for me I don't feel the need to dictate that everyone needs to play a certain way for ME to have fun!

[Ordinator]

Honestly I think most people who lamented its introduction never thought for a second blizzard would actually remove it and were resigned to the idea that the cat was out of the bag and nothing could change it.

The fact that the pro-flighters have reduced themselves to memes is great for me because I don't want flight in current content ever again. I thought it killed the world not long after the newness wore off in BC. Unfortunately we have garrisons doing their part to keep people out of the world now, but hopefully Tanaan Jungle will get people out again, and from what I understand garrisons won't be back in the next xpac.

You've worded my exact outlook on the entire situation perfectly. Flying was cool at first I guess.. 8 years ago. Then I realized at what price it came. Then I just felt like I had to deal with it being a part of the game. Glad I was wrong and Blizzard realized flying was no good for current content as well.

[Baconeggcheese]

Ok...got it. When you've been caught contradicting yourself, you become obtuse.

I'd need to first have been caught contradicting myself for this statement to make sense.

Again, you taking a cherry picked sentence from a post out of context =/= me contradicting myself.

So anyway, what is my cause? What am I campaigning for here?

[Aeno]

Yes how dare my game be shown in its true light of Wait Time difficulty. I'm so glad no-flying added back the illusion that my time spent was difficult in some right. Now I can play and feel like I'm accomplishing something too!

[Deleted]

Luckily for me I don't feel the need to dictate that everyone needs to play a certain way for ME to have fun!

Flying would change the way everyone experiences the game, even those who don't want to fly. Thus in this sense you do. You can yet again parrot the "but you have a choice," however invalid that is.

[MatadorMedia]

This thread still going? Well, I missed flying when I needed to reach something like five feet above me and I'm like seriously, cmon, and then spent 30 minutes trying to find the way up. But that was leveling. Now I just do garrison stuff and raid, occasionally do Apex or rep bring but I just port out there so really flying wouldn't change much of anything now so I don't care if we get flight or not, really. I guess if I were on a PvP server it would matter more.

[markdall]

Hi! Just stopping in to confirm that yes, I do still miss flying in current content every single day and really hate Blizzard's decision to remove it back in Cataclysm, starting with the Molten Front zone.

We leveled up, we got mounts, we leveled more, we could f'n fly. We were heroes! Now we're ground pounding slugs again. Not cool, Blizzard. But hey thanks for the ugly statue of my faction, the faction I hate.

[rda]

Flying would change the way everyone experiences the game, even those who don't want to fly. Thus in this sense you do. You can yet again parrot the "but you have a choice," however invalid that is.

If you don't want to fly, go by ground.

We discussed that this is a valid argument in WoD, because flying in WoD does not provide much of an advantage. You and several others were saying this isn't the case, but that's pretty much the extent of what you and others managed to say - that this isn't the case - despite being asked numerous times (literally tens of times) to elaborate.