Possibly no flying throughout entire xpac.

[Tekkommo]

Yeah, rested every night. I didn't hit 100 in 1 day. I actually took 7 days. 3.5 months in Beta burned me out. Then again, I was 95 before I ever left Shadowmoon Valley. When I enter a zone, while leveling, I do a FULL Loremaster clear, bonus objectives and all. One less thing to fly back for later. Had you done every quest and bonus objective with some rested XP, you would have capped at the start of Spires, the first zone I hated without flight.

I just remembered due to server issues I didn't complete the starter area.

[-Superman-]

You can do pet battles for XP and mine nodes etc for extra XP. I think Walter did some characters almost entirely on Pet battles.

Correct. Without flight, I leveled 4 more from 90 to 100 with pet battles alone. I was not about to subject myself to the same 4 zones all over again... and again. Had I been given flight at Max, or in 6.1, I could justify questing on alts since I could fly on my main.

[Deleted]

I am sorry, I don't understand. Could we maybe talk more directly about the game features / complaints / whatever actually happens and use less "would be" / "if they were to hold true"? Thank you.

That's what I'm talking about. If we were to go back to the old way of things, then I would expect to have flying in the future for all parts of the game, not just for end game. I'd expect it for leveling too. I would not see the problem with it. Don't get me wrong I would enjoy the game far more if it were based around a purely ground experience. However if this were not the case and it was sent down another route then I see no problem in having flying during leveling too.

[-Superman-]

I just remembered due to server issues I didn't complete the starter area.

Sorry to hear that. I was lucky enough to be on an RP realm where there were no login issues. But, after 3.5 months in Beta, I was in no rush. I didn't even play on Launch day just cause I knew what Tanan would look like. Without flight waiting for me at level cap, I was really in no rush at that point.

[khalltusk]

Garrisons could have still remained in-game, but instead of providing most, if not all, gathering materials ~ it could have been just an small-boost and be an central quest-hub location which sends players around the continent for smaller quest hubs.

In current situation, herb garden and mine just provides way too much ore and herbs. Meanwhile in previous expansions, players actually had to go to the world and travel around the zones/continent for them. I'd so much prefer them to remove most, if not all, follower missions and turn them into daily quests for players themselves to do, instead of sending bots and simply waiting in Garrison for results.

As for Draenor terrain, sure couple times, mostly in Spires, I had to run around the mountain to find the correct path to reach the hidden treasure, but mostly it's easy to travel around.

Exactly my point. The Garrison gives you everything and requires a lot of attention (missions and the general items being produced). Its one of the reasons why no one would be out and about. So flying will only if it was brought back give a small boost to a few people. It really would not be the saviour of WoD.

I did not have many issues in Draenor navigating wise. I could understand if someone had to go around to get up a path. Thats just how it was designed. You're too used to an easy way around and are looking for the path of least resistance. Nothing wrong in that either. Luckily once you've leveled in a zone theres not that much to go back there for. Which is another entirely annoying issue.

I am all for giving us some daily quest hubs out in the world and fixing professions so they are actually good instead of this gutted mess we have now. Make it so the mine/herb garden are not entirely OP as well while we're at it. Flying really is a tiny "problem" compared to the other issues I see in game. While I enjoy it i'd rather we get other issues fixed and get flying back with a good long quest chain.

[Drytoast]

Exactly my point. The Garrison gives you everything and requires a lot of attention (missions and the general items being produced). Its one of the reasons why no one would be out and about. So flying will only if it was brought back give a small boost to a few people. It really would not be the saviour of WoD.

I did not have many issues in Draenor navigating wise. I could understand if someone had to go around to get up a path. Thats just how it was designed. You're too used to an easy way around and are looking for the path of least resistance. Nothing wrong in that either. Luckily once you've leveled in a zone theres not that much to go back there for. Which is another entirely annoying issue.

I am all for giving us some daily quest hubs out in the world and fixing professions so they are actually good instead of this gutted mess we have now. Make it so the mine/herb garden are not entirely OP as well while we're at it. Flying really is a tiny "problem" compared to the other issues I see in game. While I enjoy it i'd rather we get other issues fixed and get flying back with a good long quest chain.

I don't think flight restored would be the saviour. But I sure as shit am not walking everywhere.

Why?

Because FUCK blizzard. That's why. Make the content more interesting and maybe I'll wanna go play in it. If not, fine, I'll pay other gaming companies and have fun playing their games.

[khalltusk]

I don't think flight restored would be the saviour. But I sure as shit am not walking everywhere.

Why?

Because FUCK blizzard. That's why. Make the content more interesting and maybe I'll wanna go play in it. If not, fine, I'll pay other gaming companies and have fun playing their games.

I unsubbed due to no casual content really. Not much to do outside raiding. I could do the facebook mini game that is garrisons but it was not worth my sub money alone. Flight if re-added is a bandaid for a missing leg. The missing leg being the content we should have, more dailies some dynamic content like battlefield barrens had with Caravans being attacked that you can defend. Something cool _anything_.

We got 1 Daily quest and if youre lucky an invasion. Oh you got a garrison quest line? Cool but it was mostly going to the apexis daily areas..... beyond a snore fest. Flight would only have lessened my time doing them as I could hope around from objective to objective.

[caninepawprints]

#3 is just wrong. First, everyone is in their garrisons. Second, I would like to meet the person who can't figure out how to get around. And why should those people be babied and given a crutch because the terrain is just to confusing to them? The game is designed for ground mounts and you want flat plains every where so it's not to hard..

I'd have to disagree with you on this. I'm one of those players that complained about navigating the ground. No, it's not hard to get around, for the most part. But there are a lot of areas in the game where I can't figure out how to reach the cave, or my mount is getting stuck on obstacles that just don't make sense. I've submitted a Suggestion to Blizzard to make the terrain more friendly if they're going to restrict us to ground mounts in future expansions. It doesn't have to be flat plains, but not getting stuck on things and having an easier time finding your way to the caves would be nice.

[-Superman-]

I don't think flight restored would be the saviour. But I sure as shit am not walking everywhere.

I voted with my wallet and will wait to see if they put it back in 6.2. If not, the lack of flight (removal of my personal immersion) doesn't justify a sub cost. Not when I can easily play other games, F2P without having to worry about them giving you something for 8 years, then conveniently leaving it out of all future expansions.

[rda]

I voted with my wallet and will wait to see if they put it back in 6.2. If not, the lack of flight (removal of my personal immersion) doesn't justify a sub cost. Not when I can easily play other games, F2P without having to worry about them giving you something for 8 years, then conveniently leaving it out of all future expansions.

If you wait long enough - and by the looks of it, might be just one or two years - WoW might go F2P, too.

Just saying that in addition to "I am not playing and am just waiting for the next patch / expansion", there's a new waiting mode now - "I am not playing and am just waiting for when WoW goes F2P". Thanks to game time tokens.

[Drytoast]

If you wait long enough - and by the looks of it, might be just one or two years - WoW might go F2P, too.

Just saying that in addition to "I am not playing and am just waiting for the next patch / expansion", there's a new waiting mode now - "I am not playing and am just waiting for when WoW goes F2P". Thanks to game time tokens.

Far too many games are becoming more focused on dressing your digital barbie...We would have a team fortress 3 by now if there were no fucking hats revenue. Wow is becoming less of a game and more of a dress up irc chat.

I do believe that f2p is in WoW's future.

[kojinshugi]

No flying, no 5-man progression for alts? Not resubbing.

[-Superman-]

If you wait long enough - and by the looks of it, might be just one or two years - WoW might go F2P, too.

Just saying that in addition to "I am not playing and am just waiting for the next patch / expansion", there's a new waiting mode now - "I am not playing and am just waiting for when WoW goes F2P". Thanks to game time tokens.

My interest in WoW dwindled with the disabling of flight at Max level in current content zones. They couldn't PAY me to continue playing this lack luster anti-flight expac. If they want me, they know where to find me... spending my money in the SWTOR cartel shop.

[Lochton]

They intentionally made most zones with mazes to spin you around, confuse you, and force you to backtrack for miles just to get to something you could have flown 20 feet to. Artificial gating, and it sucks.

In Spires and Nagrand, just when you think you are headed in the right direction, you find out the path you should have taken is a half mile back, and it twists through mountain passes and forces you to hop from mass to mass to reach your target. With flight, there was no confusion. Lift off, find target, land. This hiking through the hills with sandals and granola is horseshit.

That is more reason why flight shouldn't be there. The zone was MADE, designed to not be one line, one road. It is a zone, it is made to feel like something. With a theory like so, would you expect flight in raids because you either have to backtrack or you got lost? The content was made for no flight, just like some old content was made for flight but could still be done on the ground as well.

So, you want flight to as well, ignore the work on zones? And your comment of just flying 20 feet straight line just makes a zone sound sad, that people skip the work put in it.

I supported your views of flight with the connection of Archaeology as well as herbalism and mining but because you are lost in a zone, suddenly a notch is removed. And well, tracked the zones over 10 times myself, I have not found a problem that couldn't easily be passed, even with short time flight (half uncontrolled (feather etc.) and even then, they aren't used unless time is the question (i.e. getting to BRF before raid time starts). Of course, now you can all talk about double sided etc but opinions shared is what a forum is for. Myself, I only really miss flight for getting to my raid and my archaeology - the rest is just not needed for me.

[Deleted]

That is more reason why flight shouldn't be there. The zone was MADE, designed to not be one line, one road. It is a zone, it is made to feel like something. With a theory like so, would you expect flight in raids because you either have to backtrack or you got lost? The content was made for no flight, just like some old content was made for flight but could still be done on the ground as well.

Except it's not one zone, it's an artificial maze and nothing like the old zones in Classic were. With a choice of where to go and when, without artificial borders ALL OVER THE ZONE instead of just on the very outlying, with usually only one tiny way connecting it into the next zone. Taking away flight and the way WoD was designed made several zones completely and absolutely kill the feel of an open and accessible world. (Looking at you especially Gorgrond, Spires).

So, you want flight to as well, ignore the work on zones? And your comment of just flying 20 feet straight line just makes a zone sound sad, that people skip the work put in it.

The work they had to admire several hundred times already? Really this is your argument? "Oh the poor devs put so much effort into making this rock, that looks exactly like the 20 other rocks and is most likely a slightly tilted copy paste of those".

- - - Updated - - -

Actually, it's just a maze. That's really all it is, a maze without obvious walls so it's more annoying. Now, if your idea of MMO fun is walking a maze you can barely see then this is the design direction for you But let's not pretend that what you're talking about is anything more than a maze, and you can get those for free on a Burger King tray mat.

Thinking about it, it's one of the things that put me off in a lot of other MMORPGs. When the "open world" is effectively just a maze, or one long tube and you linearly progress down it. Compared to that WoW had always had an open and connected world. The zones I dislike the most such as Spires and Gorgrond at the ones most guilty of this "easy" design they basically took from cheaper MMO's.

Compare it to Howling Fjord, Hellfire Peninsula, most Pandaria zones and even most classic zones from Westfall to Barrens even post revamp. They have always shown a consistent and accessible open world with a choice where to go to, to change directions at will and visit one of the other hubs. In WoD that simply isn't the case anymore. Alongside flight they also killed the feeling of an open World in many zones.

[Kazgrel]

To borrow the tactic employed by anti-flight "if you want to fly play a flight sim":

If I wanted to figure out a maze, I would play Zelda or flip over one of those aforementioned Burger King mats.

[Slant]

They intentionally made most zones with mazes to spin you around, confuse you, and force you to backtrack for miles just to get to something you could have flown 20 feet to. Artificial gating, and it sucks.

It's called artistic game design and funnelling players towards a certain behaviour or area or guide them on a certain path via level design is kinda the core of game design since Pong. You are really complaining about everything, aren't you?

[Kazgrel]

It's called artistic game design and funnelling players towards a certain behaviour or area or guide them on a certain path via level design is kinda the core of game design since Pong. You are really complaining about everything, aren't you?

There you have it, folks. Call of Duty is now considered "artistic game design". No wonder the games market has went to utter dogshit the past couple years (indie stuff notwithstanding).

[Deleted]

That is more reason why flight shouldn't be there. The zone was MADE, designed to not be one line, one road.

Yes, and it sucks. Obstacles everywhere. Confusing. That isnt fun. If that was the reason they removed flying, they made a real bad deal. And i cant really take that serious.

For me, that jump-a-rope content and the confusing mazes are no fun. Not useful in an MMO. And surely no justification to remove flying.

[jasdasm]

No flying is fine with me, can get some actual PVP in the world.

didnt know you could just enter Enemy Garrisons