Clucky Telluric Currents for Holy priests

[nobodysbaby]

Holy
•Chakra: Chastise Increases the damage done by your Shadow and Holy spells by 50%, grants a 10% chance for Smite to reset the cooldown of Holy Word: Chastise, causes Smite and Holy Fire to cost no mana and refund 0.75% of maximum mana, and transforms your Holy Word spell back into Holy Word: Chastise.

So, we will have to change to Chakra red and dps for manaregen. This was something of the worst I could imagine for "active manaregen model".
Let's compare to other classes regen:

Discipline
•Atonement no longer works with Penance.
•Penance now costs 2.9% of Base Mana, down from 3.1%. Now also restores 2% of maximum mana when damage is done. (for each tick I will add, so 6% - cost for Penance)

No stance switching, short CD and optional to use Penance as heal or manaregen at any time.

Monk
•Crackling Jade Lightning (Mistweaver) now costs 21.3% of Base Mana. Now is a 4 sec cast, down from 6 sec. Now also refunds 2% of maximum mana if channeled for entire duration.

Holy Paladn
•Divine Plea (New) Instantly regain 4.5% of maximum mana. Paladin - Holy Spec. 3 Holy Power. Instant.

No limitations or restrictions what so ever! Cost is 3hp but I can't see there is no CD to this any longer?

Restoration Druid
•Innervate (New) Causes the Druid to regenerate 2.50% of maxmimum mana every 4 sec for 8 sec. This effect is cancelled if the Druid spends mana on a healing spell. Druid - Restoration Spec. 30 yd range. 2 sec cast.

Again, no need to stancedance and DPS. (Seems they removed the CD on Innervate to??? Really? Or did they forgot to add CD on it?) So all they need to do is stop healing for 8 sec to regenerate mana, dps is optional. Edit: There is also synergy with Dream of Cenarius. Wrath isn't a healing spell, so you would be able to take that talent and spam Wrath while the Innervate buff is up and get the Atonement-like light healing from it.

Restoration Shaman
•Telluric Currents - Your attunement to natural energies causes your Lightning Bolt spell to restore 1.25% of your maximum mana instead of costing mana.

Use Lightning Bolt whenever you see fit. No need to switch to dps Chakra and no limitations. On top of it, LB resores twice the mana Smite or Holy Fire in red Chakra

Seems to me again Holy Priest will have the most clunky active manaregen. We have to first do a Chakra change into dps, then dps for mana while being able to do only weaker healing while in red Chakra. If we want to go back to healing we can change back after 10s, but then we have no chance to throw in a dmg spell to regain mana.

This is crap to me. We are already limited in AoE Chakra and ST Chakra-stances. Another restriction is NOT what we need...

EDIT "Clucky"="Clunky", but it could fit with Clucky to... hm, yeah, maybe that's the better word

[Vouksh89]

I sincerely doubt any of these numbers are permanent. Hell, it's not even into Beta yet. They've done no number tuning yet, just getting the code mechanics in place.

I'm willing to bet a good portion of the mana costs, cast/channel times, and cooldowns aren't final.

By all means, tell blizzard your feedback, but don't try to compare classes or numbers. And wait till you can actually play the beta. A fair amount of the game mechanics are changing from what we're used to.

[PosPosPos]

Holy Paladn
•Divine Plea (New) Instantly regain 4.5% of maximum mana. Paladin - Holy Spec. 3 Holy Power. Instant.

No limitations or restrictions what so ever! Cost is 3hp but I can't see there is no CD to this any longer?

You have obviously 1) 0 experience playing a holy paladin 2) done 0 research regarding what it takes to generate 3 holy power 3) what other (far more efficient and effective) spells we can cast with 3 holy power.

Not saying that red chakra active mana regen isn't terrible, but thinking that you have the shortest end of the stick when reality is far from it is poor form and pure ignorance.

[Dierdre]

Although I agree that holy mana regen sounds the least appealing of all, with the new healing model and encounters designed around this I'm sure you'll have the chance to switch into regen mode without anyone dying. Healer team relay races will likely be a thing too, alternating between healing and regen.

[nobodysbaby]

You have obviously 1) 0 experience playing a holy paladin 2) done 0 research regarding what it takes to generate 3 holy power 3) what other (far more efficient and effective) spells we can cast with 3 holy power.

Not saying that red chakra active mana regen isn't terrible, but thinking that you have the shortest end of the stick when reality is far from it is poor form and pure ignorance.

As I see it this is much more flexible than switching to dps Chakra and cast DPS spells to regen. But that is all my oppinion! Feel free to have yours. Spending HP on mana when theres no significant dmg going out doesn't seem like a very big sacrifice sompared to the downtime in healing to dps for mana. Do you play Holy Priest? I play all healing classes but Monk.

[PosPosPos]

As I see it this is much more flexible than switching to dps Chakra and cast DPS spells to regen. But that is all my oppinion! Feel free to have yours. Spending HP on mana when theres no significant dmg going out doesn't seem like a very big sacrifice sompared to the downtime in healing to dps for mana. Do you play Holy Priest? I play all healing classes but Monk.

Yes, I play Holy Priest. I agree that red chakra is bad. It's still better than paladin divine plea.

Flexibility has no bearing on whether a class mechanic is effective or efficient.

[nobodysbaby]

Yes, I play Holy Priest. I agree that red chakra is bad. It's still better than paladin divine plea.

Flexibility has no bearing on whether a class mechanic is effective or efficient.

Taking a quote from US healing forums: That costs them a strong AoE heal or their only HoT. I don't see that as a primary technique. What I do see is abuse of Holy Avenger - a full HA used solely to build and spend HoPo on Divine Plea will resotre 27% of a mana bar over 18s and do good healing throughout as well.

And yes - The Chakra stances makes me really SICK. Druids have Atonment if needed during their Innervate periods. Holy Priests just dps, nothing but regen mana and it will take a lot of time to regen meaningful amounts with 0,75% per Smite/HF.

This is the worst crap since the introduction of Chakras imo. Trying to make the stances meaningful? Even more annoying I would say. Totally agree with Jahzrun in his interview on Icy Veins. Chakra is something most Holy Priests hate, yet they cling on to it like they did with so many other Holy Priest things, like click-well.

[Isheria]

Macroing your smite and holy fire to chakra: chastise is not exactly difficult nor clunky since it's off gcd which everyone will do or already does. Also losing 10% of healing based on current scaling is almost nothing, you can still heal and quite effectively, it's not like now were you lose 25%. This mechanic existed before in the form of a talent during MoP beta anyway it's not exactly new but it got swiftly removed cause it was too good. If anything holy has it way too good, not only you do 50% more dmg while regenning mana you also cast gcd cast time abilities and 1 instant which can also heal if choosing the appropriate talent.

[nobodysbaby]

Macroing your smite and holy fire to chakra: chastise is not exactly difficult nor clunky since it's off gcd which everyone will do or already does. Also losing 10% of healing based on current scaling is almost nothing, you can still heal and quite effectively, it's not like now were you lose 25%. This mechanic existed before in the form of a talent during MoP beta anyway it's not exactly new but it got swiftly removed cause it was too good. If anything holy has it way too good, not only you do 50% more dmg while regenning mana you also cast gcd cast time abilities and 1 instant which can also heal if choosing the appropriate talent.

Well, glad to see you like it Isheria. I sure don't like mixing dps into my healing rotation.

[Deleted]

Restoration Druid
•Innervate (New) Causes the Druid to regenerate 2.50% of maxmimum mana every 4 sec for 8 sec. This effect is cancelled if the Druid spends mana on a healing spell. Druid - Restoration Spec. 30 yd range. 2 sec cast.

Again, no need to stancedance and DPS. (Seems they removed the CD on Innervate to??? Really? Or did they forgot to add CD on it?) So all they need to do is stop healing for 8 sec to regenerate mana, dps is optional. Edit: There is also synergy with Dream of Cenarius. Wrath isn't a healing spell, so you would be able to take that talent and spam Wrath while the Innervate buff is up and get the Atonement-like light healing from it.

What's the difference? They still can't heal. And you can still stack FDCL while you're gaining mana.

[Deleted]

Taking a quote from US healing forums: That costs them a strong AoE heal or their only HoT. I don't see that as a primary technique. What I do see is abuse of Holy Avenger - a full HA used solely to build and spend HoPo on Divine Plea will resotre 27% of a mana bar over 18s and do good healing throughout as well.

You can't actually do this. Holy Avenger only generates Holy Power when you use a generator and

Holy Shock has a 6 second cd and costs 3.1% of total mana
Holy Radiance costs almost 10% of total mana
Additionally Divine Plea takes a 1.5 sec gcd...so do you really even want to use it in HA?


Divine Plea, while it looks amazing for classes that don't know paladin mechanics is actually insanely bad in the current alpha. If the reverse was possible, ye sacrifice 4.5% mana to gain 3 Holy Power(preferably without the gcd) I'd do that all day long. As it is now, we don't have an active mana regen source.

[PosPosPos]

Taking a quote from US healing forums: That costs them a strong AoE heal or their only HoT. I don't see that as a primary technique. What I do see is abuse of Holy Avenger - a full HA used solely to build and spend HoPo on Divine Plea will resotre 27% of a mana bar over 18s and do good healing throughout as well.

3 point LoD/EF is worth more than 4.5% of total mana. In case *someone here* has never read through paladin logs and took a peek at their healing breakdown.

Holy Avenger is too valuable as a burst throughput cd to use as a mana regen mechanic. You are either delusional or ignorant. Or both.

And yes - The Chakra stances makes me really SICK. Druids have Atonment if needed during their Innervate periods. Holy Priests just dps, nothing but regen mana and it will take a lot of time to regen meaningful amounts with 0,75% per Smite/HF.

Dream of Cenarius requires druids to drop other key throughput talents like NV and HoTW(both of which are far better in their own right, which if you actually played a druid would know).

This is the worst crap since the introduction of Chakras imo. Trying to make the stances meaningful? Even more annoying I would say. Totally agree with Jahzrun in his interview on Icy Veins. Chakra is something most Holy Priests hate, yet they cling on to it like they did with so many other Holy Priest things, like click-well.

Something can be both meaningful and annoying at the same time. One doesn't preclude the other. You should be campaigning for QoL chakra swapping changes, not flat out buffs to a mechanic that isn't as bad as you make it out to be.

[nobodysbaby]

You can't actually do this. Holy Avenger only generates Holy Power when you use a generator and

Holy Shock has a 6 second cd and costs 3.1% of total mana
Holy Radiance costs almost 10% of total mana
Additionally Divine Plea takes a 1.5 sec gcd...so do you really even want to use it in HA?


Divine Plea, while it looks amazing for classes that don't know paladin mechanics is actually insanely bad in the current alpha. If the reverse was possible, ye sacrifice 4.5% mana to gain 3 Holy Power(preferably without the gcd) I'd do that all day long. As it is now, we don't have an active mana regen source.

Would you prefer the "Telluric Currents" switching to red Chakra?

I don't get it. I do not get why they want healers to start dps for mana NOW? I can understand sacrificing something... but forcing us to dps is fail IMO.

[PosPosPos]

Would you prefer the "Telluric Currents" switching to red Chakra?

I don't get it. I do not get why they want healers to start dps for mana NOW? I can understand sacrificing something... but forcing us to dps is fail IMO.

As a hybrid Disc/Holy player, yes, it's fine. Not perfect because of the way chakra has to be macroed, but at least I don't need a major glyph slot(something of which is extremely valuable to resto shamans) to have access to my primary mana regen mechanic.

[Deleted]

Would you prefer the "Telluric Currents" switching to red Chakra?

I don't get it. I do not get why they want healers to start dps for mana NOW? I can understand sacrificing something... but forcing us to dps is fail IMO.

Well yeah I mentioned a few times that I'd prefer dpsing( we can't even do free dps, we're the only healer class for which it costs mana) for mana instead. This creates mana out of thin air(opposed to DL which creates mana out of spending more mana then what you get) and a good player can be really aggressive and generate a lot of mana when he has an understanding of encounters/damage patterns.

I understand you don't like the playtyle, but its much much better then you know :P

[Deleted]

Would you prefer the "Telluric Currents" switching to red Chakra?

I don't get it. I do not get why they want healers to start dps for mana NOW? I can understand sacrificing something... but forcing us to dps is fail IMO.

I don't get you.
Discipline priests need to ditch their best healing spell to gain little mana.
Holy paladins need to ditch 3HP to gain 4.5% mana.
Resto druids need to stop healing for 8 seconds (plus 2 seconds cast) to gain 5% mana. When they cast some heals before 4 seconds of their Innervate "buff", they will gain exactly 0 mana and just wasted their time trying to gain that mana. If they cast some heals after 4 seconds, they will gain only 2.5% mana and again wasted their time.
Telluric Currents seems too strong.

Your stance dancing: you are not forced to dps for 10 seconds. You can heal, all it will do is - you will heal for 10% less.

[nobodysbaby]

3 point LoD/EF is worth more than 4.5% of total mana. In case *someone here* has never read through paladin logs and took a peek at their healing breakdown.

Holy Avenger is too valuable as a burst throughput cd to use as a mana regen mechanic. You are either delusional or ignorant. Or both.



Dream of Cenarius requires druids to drop other key throughput talents like NV and HoTW(both of which are far better in their own right, which if you actually played a druid would know).

You are absolutly right about NV/HoTW... Not something I would sarcifice to "Atonment heal". But alteast druids arent forced to dps to regen mana.... And as a HoT based healer its quite alright to load up with HoTs and regen. Casting some Wrats if you want. No Stance dance, no CD (if I got it correctly).

Alright, I believe you about the Holy Avenger. That was something I read on the US forums and it sounded really good. But I still think it's more flexible to choose if you want put your 3hp into mana for when dmg is low. It's also instant, a choice you make, and for low dmg, it's a good choice to have instead of sitting on the HP or spending it on mostly overhealing. Holy Priest have to sacrifice both -10% stance and dps downtime. 0,75% mana for HF/Smite, that will take some time to regen mana.

It's Beta, and it's good to discuss these "funny regen mechanics". (or not so funny).

I think there are better and more engaging ways to deal with mana than all this....

[Deleted]

And by the way, LB for shamans restores exactly the same mana as smite for you. 5% in 10 seconds because LB cast isn't 1.5 sec cast, but 2.5.
I feel bad for resto druids.
Tell me again, why are you mad?

// Let me fix that - you gain 5.25% instead of 5% because of instant Holy Fire.

[PosPosPos]

You are absolutly right about NV/HoTW... Not something I would sarcifice to "Atonment heal". But alteast druids arent forced to dps to regen mana.... And as a HoT based healer its quite alright to load up with HoTs and regen. Casting some Wrats if you want. No Stance dance, no CD (if I got it correctly).

Alright, I believe you about the Holy Avenger. That was something I read on the US forums and it sounded really good. But I still think it's more flexible to choose if you want put your 3hp into mana for when dmg is low. It's also instant, a choice you make, and for low dmg, it's a good choice to have instead of sitting on the HP or spending it on mostly overhealing. Holy Priest have to sacrifice both -10% stance and dps downtime. 0,75% mana for HF/Smite, that will take some time to regen mana.

It's Beta, and it's good to discuss these "funny regen mechanics". (or not so funny).

I think there are better and more engaging ways to deal with mana than all this....

When we 3 HP EF during periods of low damage, we do passive beacon healing to the tanks. Which throws that "DP is good during periods of low damage" argument out of the window.

[Deleted]

But I still think it's more flexible to choose if you want put your 3hp into mana for when dmg is low. It's also instant, a choice you make, and for low dmg, it's a good choice to have instead of sitting on the HP or spending it on mostly overhealing.

The issue is you'll need to get those 3 HP back and that costs more mana than what DP returns.DP is never mana positive atm. The conversion ratio of DP is so bad right now that its more mana efficient to stay on 5 Holy Power for 20 seconds and DO NOTHING when damage is low instead of turning 3 HP into 4.5% mana and getting the HP back through Holy Shocks.