PvP WW needing help with Warriors and Hunters

[Deleted]

Heya folks. I've recently decided to play some pvp and I'm enjoying WW a fair amount. I find myself managing to handle most classes fairly well, at least evenly most of the time. The two main exceptions are as mentioned, warriors and hunters. I just don't really know how to handle either one of them, and if anyone who's got a fair amount of experience in WW can post some tips/how to handle it, that would be much appreciated.

Arena predominantly. I play a variety of comps but specifically the issue is double dps comps i.e monk/hunter or monk/rogue where I end up in a 1v1 against warrior or hunter and well, at that point I rarely win. I'm sure I'm probably doing something wrong with at least teh warrior although I recognise hunters are kind of built to kite us forever. Halp.

[squid]

Halp.

While both hunters and warriors are very good generally speaking, WW can beat them more easily than most classes. I will assume you are taking Tiger's Lust, Chi Wave, and Healing Elixirs for these fights because TL and CW are pretty much mandatory, and the two talents that compete with HE do nothing against these classes. Running without Healing Elixirs will seriously gimp you here.

Warriors:
This should be one of the easier classes for you as a Windwalker, as almost everything you have counters their kit. The basic strategy is just spar with the warrior while he goes down and you stay up: your healing elixirs, expel harm, and chi wave will keep you ahead of his damage outside his cooldowns, unless you are severely undergeared. Use Chi Brew, Energizing Brew, and even low stack Tigereye Brews to proc Elixirs on cooldown. Recklessness is what will kill you here, so be prepared.
If he is specced bloodbath/bladestorm you can evade this combo by using Trans to teleport out of it, or Flying Serpent. If you have the advantage and he has stacked all his cooldowns feel free to use Touch of Karma here to put it all back into him, but beware decent warriors will not fall for this, and dont waste Karma if you can avoid the damage through movement instead.
If he is specced Shockwave, you will likely need to save Nimble Brew for a Shockwave when you are low or he has CDs up. Never Nimble a Charge; rarely Nimble a Fear from a warrior. It will either break from his damage or you can sit it, you have healing and he doesn't so sitting puts time in your favor.
Paralyse is broken by Berserker but use it anyway to unsync Berserker Rage from his other cooldowns, or to get some healing orbs in while he sits it. Remember Energizing Brew + Orbs is a useful heal on the run.
Grapple Weapon is of limited use against warriors because of their natural resistance to disarms, but it is still very useful for countering Die by the Sword. He can't parry without a weapon.
Lastly if you run Legsweep try to use it from behind to avoid being parried. Follow it with Fists of Fury for a good Stunlock.
Double Disable roots work well when you must kite. Root him before Flying Serpent'ing away to avoid an instant charge.

Hunters:
A much harder class to fight even as Windwalker, Hunters are very good in general. The strategy here is hit him in sets of burst opportunity when your CC is off cooldown, and remember that time is in your favor: Your defensives are shorter cooldown than his, you have healing and he doesn't. Rapidfire or being caught in the open for too long will kill you here, don't subject yourself to a constant hail of arrows without a defensive cooldown or some CC like Grapple/Legsweep.
Don't be afraid to use Fortifying Brew early when he has his Rapid Fire and offensive Trinket up, but if he stacks these with Stampede forgo the Fort Brew and Karma it back to him instead: calling off the Stampede is difficult for him and most hunters wont. Stampede can also be locked down with a Legsweep/Fists of Fury combo, but try to get the hunter in it too. Ring of Peace won't help very much. Your disarm will be key for countering his Rapid Fire, or Beastial Wrath. Try not to be exposed to these cooldowns: CC him or pillar. If his pet is following you around pillars, steadily blackout kick and Chi Wave it for a constant supply of Tigereye stacks and minor healing.
Nimble works well if they use Binding Shot and Narrow Escape (the stun and root) particularly if they use these together: Nimble will break one and half the other. Tigers Lust should be saved for breaking Narrow Escape, if you do end up rooted with Nimble and Tigers Lust on cooldown, compensate with Energizing Brew and spamming orbs on yourself or Paralysing the hunter.
Stun his offensive cooldowns or Masters Call (the "freedom" effect, sounds like a lock unlocking), Keep him slowed and rooted whenever you can.
The longer the fight lasts the more likely you are to win, you get two Karmas for every Deterrence I think.

Overall in arena remember to put Karma on the kill target not the target you are trying to stop damage from, use pillars, Flying Serpent, and Transcendence to your advantage (never waste a defensive cooldown when simple movement can save you), and don't let 2s turn into simultaneous duels: you and your partner need to assist each other to win.

[Rollatorklm]

i don't actually agree with squid on the note that warriors should be easy to beat, i personally find hunters way easier

Against an average warrior it is gonna be rather easy since he won't use his abilities to the fullest, but a good warrior can be extremely hard to fight
they have a lot of sustained dmg without popping any offensives, and if he gets your karma before he uses reck the fight is basically over if he knows how to counter your kite/gets lucky with stuns, as monks cannot FSK or roll when stunned mid animation, the safest bet to win against a warrior is to open with a para into a very quick stun ( he cannot parry or dodge your stun if he is paralyzed, works vs everything even rogues in evasion) remember to be fast with the stun since warriors can berserker rage it.

After you have him stunned what you wanna do is quickly use both chi brews (you can do this before the stun, not on Gcd) into a rsk for the debuff, then chi wave, jab and RJW into a fist of fury, this combo (if he doesn't trinket, which would be good for you if he did) should take him to around 50% or more if you're fully geared
After that its basically a run with cool downs, save your disarm for Die by the sword as squid said and try to setup another stun combo on him, if you get him in second wind range with no trinket up, you should win in that stun

Remember if you have a warrior in leg sweep on like 15% using a spear hand strike from in front of him will silence him for 2 seconds and make him unable to use rallying cry
Could give you that extra global to just finish him off

And as a general rule for monks, ALWAYS save either nimble brew or trinket to quickly karma, sitting in a stun with no trinket ready and karma off cool down is the biggest mistake you can make


Against hunters its fairly easy tbh
If you have pillars you should never be able to lose to hunters since you can just spam heal behind pillars / use chi wave on his pet for insane healing while he cannot dmg you
But if its an elwynn forest kinda fight you wanna save karma for his stampede (It does 4x the dmg outside of arena and battlegrounds) so if you karma his stampede it should very quickly get you to 20kish karma ticks on him (you have to play aggressive versus hunters since you loose when you run out of trinkets/cooldowns

As the fight starts you wanna use the same combo as i posted against warriors, though you do not have to be quick on leg sweep out of para since hunters cannot break it without trinket (or bestial wrath if they are BM) and if he trinkets it should be a free win since monks kill most classes in a stun lock combo, anyways

Paralyze into a stun lock, and a good idea to use against hunters is, just as you get the last tick of Fist of fury and there is 0.1 seconds left on your stun on the hunter, you're gonna want to use disarm out of that to stop the scatter - trap / kite scenario. Disarms last for a full 8 seconds against most hunters since they lack the disarm protection most classes have / get for dual wielding

out of the stun lock + disarm you should have him on around 40-60% depending on gear / how lucky you were with crits
Then begins the kiting
Notice that most hunters use either narrow escape (roots you when they disengage) or the sprint when they disengage that clears slows and roots
If you notice that he uses the root talent you can try to counter his disengage by rooting/stunning him just as he uses it which makes him waste his cool down and should make him use a panic deterrence (its for more experienced players to see when people are gonna use stuff like this, but its good practise for duels)

and a good note against people kiting, remember to use healing orbs when ur trying to follow them as your most probable on 100% energy when being kited and the extra healing is always nice, but don't spam heal yourself if you got him in a paralyze and your about to nuke as it will destroy your stun lock


to the last bit squid posted around arena
Be careful with karmaing the kill target if its a mage or there is a paladin on the team, a good idea with karma if your healer is cced is to karma pets and I'm not kidding

If you karma a mage he can just ice block it and instantly come out which is gonna make your life hell

If you karma his pet, he is either gonna have to kite you or dismiss his pet which fucks him up a ton since he has to cast a new one which you can interrupt and drag out the fight..
Ps. karmaing pets is insanely strong in duels against mages

[Enpoli]

Rather than start a new thread, anyone have some tips for fighting DKs? I swear they feel harder to kill than Warriors for me. They go stun immune and seem to parry absolutely everything. I've had DK's parry all 5 ticks of my FoF. I just don't get what I'm doing wrong. Most people seem to think DKs are fairly squishy.

[Illana]

para DK first before trying to do any stuns

run like a little bitch when he gets necrotics up

karma if he gargoyles

dispel disease on cd if he hasn't glyphed them to be undispellable.

[Rollatorklm]

Rather than start a new thread, anyone have some tips for fighting DKs? I swear they feel harder to kill than Warriors for me. They go stun immune and seem to parry absolutely everything. I've had DK's parry all 5 ticks of my FoF. I just don't get what I'm doing wrong. Most people seem to think DKs are fairly squishy.

A good dk can be fairly hard to beat, to win dks you can't really rely on FoF, you have to just do constant pressure and kiting tbh, while using ur stuns to slowly drain him of trinkets, he has 3, pvp trinket, desecrated ground and icebound, you can't really nuke until all 3 are down
A good way to stop dks is to time your disarm with their weapon enchant procs, its the easiest way to lower their dmg,

Outside of that, karma gargoyle and use your heals during brew, This is really important since you cannot out heal necrotic without tiger eye brew up

Its never gonna be a one sided fight against dks, if he simply parries 2 much/most of your rising sun kicks and he shells your karma its going to be very hard to win

But as illana said, dispelling dots on cd is also very effective

[Rucati]

1v1 in an arena a Monk shouldn't lose to anything unless they're a worse player. Kite, kite like a bitch, you'll win eventually.

Neither Hunters nor Warriors have good healing, or any healing really, while you do. Paralysis -> Stun -> DPS -> Disarm -> FoF -> Root, run away. Use your teleport effectively, get behind poles, and you'll never lose. Chi Wave off the Hunter pet if you're low, and spam healing orbs until you have enough health or your stuns are back off CD.

WW Monks are incredible in 1v1 situations if there's LoS around, don't be afraid to abuse that. It's incredibly annoying to fight against, and can be kind of boring to do, but you shouldn't ever lose to anyone 1v1. Also remember Storm Earth Fire, can be useful against Hunters if you can hit their pet around a pole and they don't notice (anyone 1600+ will notice, but it's still worth a shot)

[Enpoli]

Don't Chillblains persist through removals? I swear I can roll or Nimble and I'm still slowed by DKs. It's the only class that I've been kited by. Being more focused on healing during TEB should help, and I need to be more aware of when he puts necrotics up on me.

[Illana]

Why would you nimble chillblains >.>?

he probably spams howling blast on you so you can remove 4 with rolls, lust and kick but then he has more howling blasts for you.

[Enpoli]

I meant Tiger's Lust. Same deal though. I use something that is supposed to remove slows and I'm still slowed.