Comments on flameglow make me laugh :D

[Deleted]

Or more simply, you need to get hit for more than 0.9 times a second for 25 seconds with damage being more than total absorb of IB. Now ofc this is only comparing the total absorb and ignoring that FG is passive, but it does sort of give you a picture how situational FG really is.

Aaaand my whole post got trivialized in a whim :P
But yea indeed, I just wanted to give values on top of that.

Also whoever is using it for HC Thok, you shouldn't. Even with 50k spellpower, 7500 per 450000 = 0.01666 almost 1.5% damage reduction. If you time Temporal Shield correctly you can get hit by 2 screeches while in it, giving you a very strong heal for the next 6 seconds (and during). Generally it feels as if your health does not get reduced under 60-70% health whenever you use TS.

And ye as mrgreen mentioned how boring will it be if every fight has continuous ticking damage?! Then it's going to be, if healing taken per second > damage taken per second then the boss dies. There need to be moments of burst where healing cooldowns can be used and personals have power. And In Warlords the ability to negate 15 seconds of damage every 90 seconds (which means an uptime of 16%) that Alter time is going to provide, whilst also not being on the GCD (as things show us) is probably going to be the way to go.

For Flameglow to work I would vote that it reduces damage taken by damage taken higher than 50% of the targets health by 50% while also being in an internal cooldown. It's use is going to be passive way to prevent dying or taking excessive damage. The numbers might need some balancing, but in it's current state it either needs a very boring healing model for healers (and let's face it WTLK wasn't the MOST fun to heal), + no real value in PvP. Simply the ability to have Evanence, Alter Time AND Greater Inv is providing us with the most powerfull defensive ranged dps cooldowns in the game. In 90 seconds We can have damage negated for 25 seconds ( GI 3 seconds, Ice Block or Evanence 8 seconds and AT 15 seconds).

What Celestalon said is correct, it does indeed shine with many small hits, just taking those small hits would make for a very boring expansion healing wise (in PvE)

[huth]

Taking IB in arena is usually a waste of a talent, and even worse, if you have a mage against you then you're just asking for trouble.

Spellsteal duel?

[Deleted]

TBH i would like to see this talent reworked in the manner like the other two talents on the row. To be active spell like IB and TS, not passive, but still work as it is - partial dmg absorb for its duration, but better numbers of course since it gonna have cooldown. I like the idea a lot more than the other two choices, but lousy implementation and even worse - no real use of it during the whole expansion.
Everybody like ot have "oh shit" button. It has been in the mage toolkit since, maybe, WotLK. That was Mana Shield for arcane, Cauterize for fire mage, all tho passive it was kinda exclusive to fire, because it was somewhat deep in the fire three, and Ice Barrier for frost. So why would you put a passive defensive talent, over which you don't have any control?

Like that it could be a lot more interesting spell, than some silly passive that absorb some silly amount of damage, with a silly rule of how much that amount can be. Right? Or not?

[Akraen]

Wouldn't it be like, super cool if we had a bunch of abilities that were useful in various situations, and we just used those abilities when appropriate? Then some abilities have shared cooldowns to prevent doubling up of OP stuff.

Then we could have talent trees which make certain abilities better and stuff, or offer tradeoffs between PvP and PvE so that PvP survival options can be offered without having burst be too high.

Oh wait we had that system already. Now we have lost a large portion of our abilities either entirely or we have to choose between things that were baseline, PvE abilities that are incredibly hard to balance, situational gains that require a reagent to manage and the tedium of buff reapplication.

Is this really better than how things were?

[Polarthief]

Then again it would be a bit silly if most fights would have fast ticking damage just for 1 talent to be usable more than once a tier.

Best course of action: Scrap it and put TS back in because TS was actually usable and a good choice when paired with IB because a lot of people picked one or the other. Why keep the talent no one picks vs a talent that got a lot of love and attention?

PS: Alter Time being new TS is so redundant and blech.

[Deleted]

I truly don't understand the point of that talent unless it's scaling off %, and didn't blizzard want to reduce passive damage reduction? It would just be silly to revamp this imo, I would have preferred having an improved Temp shield instead because that talent is crazy good.

[Polarthief]

I truly don't understand the point of that talent unless it's scaling off %, and didn't blizzard want to reduce passive damage reduction? It would just be silly to revamp this imo, I would have preferred having an improved Temp shield instead because that talent is crazy good.

15% reduction and healing back the damage done over 4s. It was strong but lasted so short. Hell even if they made it last 5s and gave it a 60s cooldown, I'd STILL consider it over IB for many things. FG over IB? Yeah no thanks.

[MisterMine]

Still pretty great on H Thok...

by pretty great i hope you mean "less useless than on other fights but still vastly inferior to both other talents of this row"

[Not Againnn]

imo, it should be like a passive version of temporal shield. like:

3% of any damage taken over 6 seconds is healed, with it being no more than 30% of ur total hp or something.

that isnt too broken.

basically any damage u take , 3% of it is put onto you as a hot that ticks for 6 seconds.

[Zoros]

I don't understand Blizzard on that one. Flameglow contradicts 100% their philosophy. They said that they wanted to get rid of all boring passive % talents, and they removed every "reduce damage taken by X%" "increase damage done by Y%" talent. Well done! Fantastic! But what about Flameglow?

Besides the lack of creativity on that talent is really disappointing. Come on! We are mages, masters of magic, it can't be that hard to create something useful and cool. At first I thought it was just a placeholder, they wanted to give Scorch to fire, move Blazing Speed to the first tier... And I thought "Great! Blizzard is solving some mage issues", but now they are proudly saying that Flameglow is here to stay, and I'm really confused. I was sure that Flameglow would be "spiced" on this expansion.

It's sad, because i really wanted a decent Ice Barrier alternative. I feel forced to play with Ice Barrier and I really dislike that spell. I continue thinking, that Mirror Image could be a good shield spell, damage could be redirected to the images, and even images could proc when casting our spells. It would be passive reduction, but more cool.

About Temporal Shield, I'm trying to understand why now after all the work done with this cool spell they are removing it. Maybe it's too similar with Alter Time? Don't Know, but even with Alter Time cooldown reduced, Temporal Shield seems better.

[Deleted]

Temporal Shield fits very well into the current healing model. From what I am seeing untill now I would expect IB > TS on all situations due to the niche it now occupies no longer being ... well existent

[Polarthief]

imo, it should be like a passive version of temporal shield. like:

3% of any damage taken over 6 seconds is healed, with it being no more than 30% of ur total hp or something.

that isnt too broken.

basically any damage u take , 3% of it is put onto you as a hot that ticks for 6 seconds.

This would further NERF Flameglow. Please no.



The real irony in Flameglow is that since Spellpower will be "worth more per point", if Flameglow stays 1:1 with Spellpower, it's going to get a RIDICULOUS (unintended) nerf come WoD since we'll have significantly less SP because 1:1 it's worth a lot more than live.

[mrgreenthump]

we'll have significantly less SP

It's not that really, everything is getting reduced a lot. BUT we will have significantly more HP(ratio) to counter the removal of PvP only stats.

[Polarthief]

Nonono, I didn't mean because of the squish, I mean, proportionally, we'll have less SP.

[mrgreenthump]

Nonono, I didn't mean because of the squish, I mean, proportionally, we'll have less SP.

Compared to HP yes. To damage, maybe not.. We simply don't know yet.

[Polarthief]

Compared to HP yes. To damage, maybe not.. We simply don't know yet.

Okay, I'm apparently REALLY bad at getting my point across, so let me try again.

Here's my rough estimates on my spellpower levels:

Live (from my Armory page): 39,429
6.0 (Post-squish 90%* squish) [Calculated]: 3,942.9
6.0 (Post-squish 90%* squish) [Reality; Estimate]: ~2,500

The ~90%* squish will squish everything by ~90%*, but gear will come with less than 10% of the spellpower because spellpower will be significantly stronger in WoD, point for point, vs in MoP. Most spells will deal 0 base damage and be purely based on Spellpower, so coefficients obviously have to be higher. However, because the FLAT NUMBERS are lower (despite being stronger), if Flameglow doesn't get its coefficient tweaked, then it's getting an unintended (and extremely unnecessary!) nerf because it already HAS no flat number, so Blizzard may unintentionally skip over it, but that nerfs an already underused-and-underpowered talent significantly.




* I don't know the exact squish, but for the sake of simplicity, let's just assume the squish is 90%. Even if the squish was 40%, we'd still end up with around 30-40% of our live spellpower instead of the post-squish 60%. Basically, while MOST stats are involved in the general ~90% squish, Spellpower is getting a roughly ~94-95% squish instead, and I believe Attack Power is the same, but fuck AP, we're Mages.

[hotmess]

My biggest issue with flameglow is you don't actually have a glow. I fully understand how useful it is, but I just wish we had some visual. If it's a constant orange'ish glow around us, or just some kind of glow/aura whenever we take damage.. just something that says "Hey, I have a shield or something!"

[BananaHandsB]

As a Warlock who has given up my defensive cooldowns in favor of passive damage reduction in most cases, Flameglow is a bad talent because it is far inferior to the other choices on that talent tier.

tuning not even close to done yet. Comparing with other talents is just silly at this point.

[nickseng]

Okay, I'm apparently REALLY bad at getting my point across, so let me try again.

Here's my rough estimates on my spellpower levels:

Live (from my Armory page): 39,429
6.0 (Post-squish 90%* squish) [Calculated]: 3,942.9
6.0 (Post-squish 90%* squish) [Reality; Estimate]: ~2,500

The ~90%* squish will squish everything by ~90%*, but gear will come with less than 10% of the spellpower because spellpower will be significantly stronger in WoD, point for point, vs in MoP. Most spells will deal 0 base damage and be purely based on Spellpower, so coefficients obviously have to be higher. However, because the FLAT NUMBERS are lower (despite being stronger), if Flameglow doesn't get its coefficient tweaked, then it's getting an unintended (and extremely unnecessary!) nerf because it already HAS no flat number, so Blizzard may unintentionally skip over it, but that nerfs an already underused-and-underpowered talent significantly.




* I don't know the exact squish, but for the sake of simplicity, let's just assume the squish is 90%. Even if the squish was 40%, we'd still end up with around 30-40% of our live spellpower instead of the post-squish 60%. Basically, while MOST stats are involved in the general ~90% squish, Spellpower is getting a roughly ~94-95% squish instead, and I believe Attack Power is the same, but fuck AP, we're Mages.

Didn't they say they haven't done a numbers pass yet? That could mean the current coeff on flameglow isn't accurate and it could get buffed

[Kuni Zyrekai]

Didn't they say they haven't done a numbers pass yet? That could mean the current coeff on flameglow isn't accurate and it could get buffed

Indeed. We're looking for design look and feel at the moment. So far the only real complaint along those lines is that it makes us lose our minor defensive cooldown.