Putin puts troops in western Russia on alert in drill 1.1

[Cybran]

When did Australia join the EU?

I have a headache... meant Austria.

[Deleted]

http://www.forexlive.com/blog/2014/0...t-3-june-2014/

Also it's slightly off topic, but it underlines the motives behind the current Ukrainian government. The bald little shit Yatsenyuk wants the EU Commission to block the construction of the South Stream pipeline that would lower the gas prices for a number of member countries including Italy, Australia and Bulgaria. The project is very important for southern Europe and many (including me) remember the winter of 2009 when he had no gas and heating for over a month, because of Tymushenko.

It underlines the bullshit decisions of the EU to allow North Stream, but block the similar project in the South.

Why on EARTH should europe do that?

[Creotor]

http://www.forexlive.com/blog/2014/0...t-3-june-2014/

Also it's slightly off topic, but it underlines the motives behind the current Ukrainian government. The bald little shit Yatsenyuk wants the EU Commission to block the construction of the South Stream pipeline that would lower the gas prices for a number of member countries including Italy, Australia and Bulgaria. The project is very important for southern Europe and many (including me) remember the winter of 2009 when he had no gas and heating for over a month, because of Tymushenko.

It underlines the bullshit decisions of the EU to allow North Stream, but block the similar project in the South.

This really isn't off-topic, considering what's been discussed in this thread so far. I could hardly believe that shit myself. They don't want to lose the monopoly on gas transit so Yatsenuk is openly asking for the South Stream to be terminated. Fucking retarded.

[Kellhound]

This really isn't off-topic, considering what's been discussed in this thread so far. I could hardly believe that shit myself. They don't want to lose the monopoly on gas transit so Yatsenuk is openly asking for the South Stream to be terminated. Fucking retarded.

Makes perfectly good sense from a Ukrainian point of view.

[Cybran]

Makes perfectly good sense from a Ukrainian point of view.

It only makes sense from the point of view of the oligarchs and politicians from Tymosheko and Yatsenyuk's party who steal money thanks to the pipes. Everyone else gets robbed.

[Kellhound]

It only makes sense from the point of view of the oligarchs and politicians from Tymosheko and Yatsenyuk's party who steal money thanks to the pipes. Everyone else gets robbed.

No, it is in the best interest of all Ukrainians that all/most gas flows through Ukraine. That does not mean it is in the best interest of Russia or the EU as a whole.

[Cybran]

That does not mean it is in the best interest of Russia or the EU as a whole.

Russia will sell the gas regardless. It's the southern EU countries that will get shafted the next time Ukraine can't pay and all of the gas is stopped for months.

[Creotor]

Makes perfectly good sense from a Ukrainian point of view.

Obviously, but since when is monopoly on a product is something consumers are willing to get behind? It's like Verizon saying "Let's get rid of all other cellular communications providers. Trust us, Verizon is the best, most reliable choice. We won't fail you, just trust us."
I'm sure there are some people in EU who would actually go "Heck yea, we can leash Russia this way, we should totally do it!", but I'm guessing those aren't normal people.
It'd be one thing if they did this quietly, under the table (still just as bad), but to openly request that is indeed retarded.

[Kellhound]

Russia will sell the gas regardless. It's the southern EU countries that will get shafted the next time Ukraine can't pay and all of the gas is stopped for months.

Thus the incentive to make sure Ukraine can pay.....

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Obviously, but since when is monopoly on a product is something consumers are willing to get behind? It's like Verizon saying "Let's get rid of all other cellular communications providers. Trust us, Verizon is the best, most reliable choice. We won't fail you, just trust us."
I'm sure there are some people in EU who would actually go "Heck yea, we can leash Russia this way, we should totally do it!", but I'm guessing those aren't normal people.
It'd be one thing if they did this quietly, under the table (still just as bad), but to openly request that is indeed retarded.

The request was likely an internal political move, no more no less.

[Creotor]

Thus the incentive to make sure Ukraine can pay.....

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The request was likely an internal political move, no more no less.

I happen to think it was an act of a person or a collective that have no idea what to do.

Earlier, Yatsenyuk said something along the lines of "We're aware that the $268 gas price was a bribe to the previous government, but we wish to keep that price. We won't pay $500 ($485). That's a political price, not a market one."
So... he doesn't wish to pay the new price because it's "political", but he's more than willing to pay the other "political" price.

They're also promising to sue Russia for $300 billion dollars because of Crimea being taken. At the same time, they keep harping on on how they'll get Crimea back. So, it seems like they want the money for Crimea being "occupied" temporarily or they've made their peace with it being gone and just want to get rich. The former doesn't make sense because that's a ridiculously high number, the latter - because they're still saying they'll get Crimea back (not happening, but w/e they want to believe, /shrug).

[Charge me Doctor]

Well, from what i read, he sounds like he wants to "accept" this "bribe" of 268$ gas price instead of paying normal market price

[Cybran]

http://www.vesti.ru/doc.html?id=1649078&cid=9

Just to bring home the point of how unnecessary this civil war is. The video shows parents blocking the Western Ukrainian barracks from shipping their conscripted children to the war in the east. People complain about lack of training, equipment and also that the authorities are falsifying the death documents of the killed soldiers in order to avoid paying compensations to their families.

It's really disgusting.

[Shalcker]

Yay for free passage of arms and men and armed men from Russia to Ukraine.

Well, since Kiev refused to deescalate, no other options remained.

[TooMuch]

You got to love propaganda: Ukrainian army reports 300 dead separatists in the fights near Slovyansk, while the separatists claim to have killed 2 and wounded 45 soldiers. That said, any life is one too much.
Barack Obama promised military goods (night vision goggles, bullet proof armor etc) for 3.6 million euro.

[Cybran]

You got to love propaganda: Ukrainian army reports 300 dead separatists in the fights near Slovyansk, while the separatists claim to have killed 2 and wounded 45 soldiers. That said, any life is one too much.

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/06/05/wo...osts.html?_r=0

The military reversals came as Oleksandr V. Turchynov, Ukraine’s acting president, arrived in eastern Ukraine, the first visit of a member of Ukraine’s government to the eastern regions where separatists have seized government buildings and large stretches of territory. A spokeswoman for Mr. Turchynov, Anna Vakhotskaya, said she could not give details about where he was or what he was doing, citing security concerns.

The gesture did not seem to even register with people in Luhansk, who were occupied with burying their dead from an airstrike on Monday. More than 100 mourners stood in a crowded green cemetery by the grave of Alexander Gizai, a respected community leader who was killed in the strike. The death of Mr. Gizai, who ran a local youth club, angered residents.

The Ukrainian government is lying out of it's ass, so no one takes them seriously anymore. People are pissed at the indiscriminate attacks on civilians.

Also remember what Poroshenko promised after he got elected? To go to Eastern Ukraine first. Instead he went to Poland to kiss foreign ass.

[Deleted]

Cybran they are doing buisness with us and allowing market penetration, you think peoples lives matter? £££££$$$$ bro.

Look at eygpt's election results and syrias. Both are a complete farce but which one is doing buisness with us. Thats right. Democracy and freedom have nothing to do with our relations with governments.

[Deleted]

Cybran they are doing buisness with us and allowing market penetration, you think peoples lives matter? £££££$$$$ bro.

Look at eygpt's election results and syrias. Both are a complete farce but which one is doing buisness with us. Thats right. Democracy and freedom have nothing to do with our relations with governments.

Change that democracy to democracy™ bro, or else the US government may sue you.

[Cybran]

The Ukrainian army is bombing hospitals. They have already proven that they are completely incapable of dealing with the situation. Food and Medicine in the eastern part of the country is running out. There will be a humanitarian crisis in the next few weeks. The Ukrainian government is throwing 18-19 year old with a couple of months training at the front line.

The whole thing is a mess perpetuated by Kiev and their Washington "advisors".

[Shalcker]

Mark my words, the following is going to happen:

Within 1-2 weeks, Russia will say that they will start their humanitarian operation regardless of UN approval, and move their "peacekeeping" troops over the border into Ukrainian area, stating as reason that Ukraine clearly can't even guarantee the safe passage across the border for ethnic Russians. This is preceded by acclaimed strike on some civilians who are crossing the border.

Border that is no longer guarded by Ukrainians? Unlikely...

Ukrainians already did strikes on "some civilians" anyway, they started weeks ago.

Within 3-5 weeks, Russian "peace keeping" troops are common sight in the areas that are currently claimed by the separatists, conducting their "peace keeping" operations, during this time kidnappings of reporters and OSCE personnel will not stop. At some point on this time line there will be acclaimed strike conducted by Ukrainian ATO troops that kills/leaves wounded several Russian "peace keepers", Russia will throw a bitch-fit and threaten to close the gas lines to Ukraine, followed by increase of "peace keeping" troops in Eastern-Ukraine.

We can close entire Easter Ukrainian airspace without ever moving outside our borders - our S-400 systems have about 300-400 km effective range, enough to cover all rebel areas + Kiev... and by specs S-400 takes 8-13 minutes total to deploy.

Iskander missile launchers can also reach all known areas of conflict from our territory.

And obviously we'll turn gas tap off if Ukrainians do not pay the rest of their debt by June 9 - which is just 5 days from now.

Within 6-8 weeks, Russia will claim that Ukrainian government is incapable of dealing with the situation and parts of Eastern-Ukraine claim independence/ask to be protected by Russia.

They already did that, no need to repeat this part, all we need is to officially acknowledge their independence.

I think your variation is a bit too predictable and way too direct; we had a lot of pretexts already, and we still haven't invaded.

[BreathTaker]

Yay for free passage of arms and men and armed men from Russia to Ukraine.

A little correction: to independant Donetzk and Luhansk republics, not Ukraine.