Heroic siegecrafter 10man belt question

[Deleted]

We play Mines Tactic.
I have to kill Laser all the time :|

Wait, what? You're killing lasers on belt and dealing with mines and missiles at the same time?

No offense, but without having seen the strat in action, that's the most bone-headed kill order on belt I can think of. If you're doing mines on platform killing missiles on belt is more or less mandatory, and vice versa.

[captaincoffeecup]

Currently working on heroic siegecrafter 10man and as the hunter I'm going up on each belt. My question for other hunters doing the belt in 10man is are you soloing all belts? Some? Or always going up with someone else?
Also wondering if anyone that's on belts full time would mind posting some logs of a kill or two so I could have a look.
I'm confident on the first belt but after that it gets a bit sketchy, we've been killing mines mines laser mines and usually wipe around the time we are on the 4th-5th belt.

We started progress on this boss on Sunday and in 44 pulls I have learn't that Stampede is the most bugged and unreliable piece of shit, and that pets are unbelievably unreliable. No matter whether I de-spawn my pet, dismiss my pet before I disengage at least 50% of the time my pet either sits there licking his balls or chases after the weapon but struggles to attack it.

If it wasn't this unreliable I could solo maybe three of the belts at 569 ilvl as BM, but I have had such bad luck that I've switched to SV. My output is lower and I can maybe solo the first belt if the stars align, but after that it is too RNG for my liking. As such we're sending two people up each time, myself and then rotating between a Rogue and a Shadow Priest.

FYI we are killing Mines at the minute.

[mediic]

We started progress on this boss on Sunday and in 44 pulls I have learn't that Stampede is the most bugged and unreliable piece of shit, and that pets are unbelievably unreliable. No matter whether I de-spawn my pet, dismiss my pet before I disengage at least 50% of the time my pet either sits there licking his balls or chases after the weapon but struggles to attack it.

If it wasn't this unreliable I could solo maybe three of the belts at 569 ilvl as BM, but I have had such bad luck that I've switched to SV. My output is lower and I can maybe solo the first belt if the stars align, but after that it is too RNG for my liking. As such we're sending two people up each time, myself and then rotating between a Rogue and a Shadow Priest.

FYI we are killing Mines at the minute.

My pet never gets stuck with the method I use, but I'm with ya on the pets/stampede not being able to keep up with the weapons some times. Very annoying.

My method for avoiding getting the pet stuck relies on having the boss tanked close enough that it won't despawn if I send the pet to attack (more of a 10man strat).

Pet passive stance always. Pet attack boss (anything on the platform works) in between each belt. Press petpassive again once on the belt. Pet will teleport to you.
If you forget and pet is stuck on the pipe, target boss, petattack, petpassive.
If the boss is tanked on the far side of the room I believe the best method is to dismiss between belts and recall it once on the belt.

[captaincoffeecup]

My pet never gets stuck with the method I use, but I'm with ya on the pets/stampede not being able to keep up with the weapons some times. Very annoying.

My method for avoiding getting the pet stuck relies on having the boss tanked close enough that it won't despawn if I send the pet to attack (more of a 10man strat).

Pet passive stance always. Pet attack boss (anything on the platform works) in between each belt. Press petpassive again once on the belt. Pet will teleport to you.
If you forget and pet is stuck on the pipe, target boss, petattack, petpassive.
If the boss is tanked on the far side of the room I believe the best method is to dismiss between belts and recall it once on the belt.

I always roll with my pet on passive and have tried every single method listed on the forums yet still have had problems. Thats why I gave up and decided to go SV. If it were more reliable then BM would be so overpowered (esspecialy with a 4/4 HC AoC trinket...).

[Reinholder]

I've been disengaging on the odd number belts and taking the pipes on the evens. Taking the pipes I've had no pet issues, but disengaging on I've had to dismiss my pet, disengage on, then recall my pet and that works fine.

[captaincoffeecup]

I've been disengaging on the odd number belts and taking the pipes on the evens. Taking the pipes I've had no pet issues, but disengaging on I've had to dismiss my pet, disengage on, then recall my pet and that works fine.

Then you are a luckier human being than I! I pipe the odds and Disengage the evens and simply cannot believe that if I were to do the opposite then everything would be fine and dandy. Don't get me wrong, when it works it really works, but thus far in my experience it doesn't work reliably. When we have it on farm I don't mind so much, but when it is a progress fight it just isn't worth it, especially when it is you that is causing wipes to ccur because you didn't kill the weapon. With SV my pet's damage is so minimal compared to mine that if he chases the weapon and doesn't attack it doesn't matter; if he sits on the edge of the pipe it doesn't matter etc.

This is the very first time I've thought to my self "if only there was a petless Hunter spec/talent...". And I am not a fan of the Lone Wolf thing.

[Nnug]

Pet assist+ attack boss when on ground, disengage onto belt, once you land pet passive, it will teleport to you.

If you do this right, your pet will not glitch ever.

[mediic]

Pet assist+ attack boss when on ground, disengage onto belt, once you land pet passive, it will teleport to you.

If you do this right, your pet will not glitch ever.

Agreed on that point, the problem at least for me is the pet/stampede lagging behind and not doing damage. I play SV on the belt so pet isn't a big deal but when I'm relying on stampede it kind of sucks.

[Nnug]

Why play SV? Even without stampede, with fresh rabid + BW each belt I can easily do 7-8m damage

[Xeromus]

When i DE off the belt in the small window you have to resummon a pet, i summon one on the deck then dismiss it immediately, then summon new one again on the belt (only downside is summoning a pet has like a 100000x increased chance to proc ted -.-)

[Nnug]

Pet assist+ attack boss when on ground, disengage onto belt, once you land pet passive, it will teleport to you.

If you do this right, your pet will not glitch ever.

Just do this, and also when you disengage off of the belt summon a different pet for Rabid.

[Agilent]

Its the best tactic for our group. We tried different tactics back when we progressed there, but since we have some people with movement problems, that happend to the best for our group.

We do the exact same thing. I dont see much because im on the belts but they just CC (Our mage plays frost this fight) blow them up instantly. I dont know why but this was easier to deal with than laser.

I also think they nerfed the health on mines on 10 man if im not mistaken

[hareu]

About 4~ months ago I'd go on every belt, soloing every other one and 1 person coming up for the ones I don't solo.

allowed for an incredibly quick kill on the boss.

[nukias]

How often do you guys accidentally kill yourselves with disengage?

[DJNatsu]

We usually kill mines then kill lasers on 6 & 9.

[Reinholder]

How often do you guys accidentally kill yourselves with disengage?

I've disengaged off the belt and straight in to a fiery death on the platform but I haven't died from disengaging on to the belt if that's what you mean?

[Paulosio]

We use the no mines strat because it makes the fight SIGNIFICANTLY shorter, hence why we are only doing 5 belts.

My guild does that and I wish we hadn't. It does make the fight a lot quicker though and it's probably less of an issue with current gear and upgrades than when we did it a few months ago.

We did Mines Mines Magnet Mines Magnet Mines >> till dead. Sooo much fire and stuff when you don't let a magnet through.

I was the main belt person for my guild. I did the fight as BM although the other specs are ok too. You can solo the 1st belt no problem at all without using stampede. I normally killed it by half way. It's easy because your trinkets will proc and you will have heroism. I also solo'd the 4th belt using my stampede cooldown which you will have if you didn't waste it on the 1st belt (succeeded as surv and BM but BM was more reliable). If you aren't planning on soloing belt 4 then survival will be just as good tbh.

Talents:
Level 15: Crouching tiger hidden Chimera.Deterrence is really nice for situations where you need to run through fire or land in missile strike and so the reduced cooldown can be a big help)
Level 30:Anything
Level 45:Spirit bond. The passive heal was almost enough to keep me topped with basically no heals. You take occasional medium sized damage and no really big spikes so ironhawk isn't that useful.
Level 60:I went for Fervor as I was worried about issues with direbeast not working due to the belt movement.. Not saying it's definitely optimal but it worked for me
Level 75: Blink strikes. The cooldown on AMOC just didn't suit the situation of belts every 40 seconds and I would rather have a bit of a damage boost on every belt than a big boost on 1 or 2 where I didn't need it anyway.
Level 90:Glaive toss.

I also use the following macro:

/tar disassembled crawler mines
/tar deactivated electro
/cast [pet] Dismiss Pet
/petpassive
/cast [@pet,dead] Revive Pet; [nopet] Call Pet 1
/petattack [target=pettarget,noexists]

Obviously you will need to edit or remove the two /tar lines to suit whater you are killing on the belts. With my guilds strat this macro always targets the correct thing. You might also need to change the call pet part to a different number.

If your pet is out it will dismiss it which you will want to do before disengaging onto a belt or you risk not having your pet to help on the belt. If your pet isn't out it will summon it. When you go onto the belt via a pipe your pet will temporarily auto dismiss itself and using the macro makes it reappear more quickly and then sends it to attack whatever you have /tar. If both items in the /tar line are on your current belt then it prioritises the 2nd /tar. So for example on belt 5 there are mines AND a magnet so the macro priorities the magnet because that's the 2nd /tar.

- - - Updated - - -

How often do you guys accidentally kill yourselves with disengage?

If you have the glyph of disengage you shouldn't ever have issues with failing to get on the belt with disengage. You might fall off the pipe occasionally while running up it though. I never disengage off the belts except for the 1st 1. Exiting via the pipes is far more reliable as it doesn't put you in the path of empowered laser fire trails. Exiting via a belt also puts you close to the pipe to enter the belt via jumping into it.

- - - Updated - - -

How are you getting 7 belts when you are soloing so many?

Well not using bloodlust at the start of the fight when the entire raid have their dps trinkets and pre pots up and when there is very little movement probably makes a huge difference to how fast the boss dies. Using bloodlust at the start and just sending 1 extra person up onto belt 3 where he was using it would result in a faster boss kill.

[rustyboy]

About 4~ months ago I'd go on every belt, soloing every other one and 1 person coming up for the ones I don't solo. allowed for an incredibly quick kill on the boss.

I doubt anyone did this 4 months ago consistently, more health on the belt adds and guilds with a solo healer were still looking at kills around the 8th-9th belts. That would mean soloing more than 4 belts, maybe if you were killing it in 7.

How often do you guys accidentally kill yourselves with disengage?

Ways to reduce damage

- Learn how to walk up the pipe and Disengage, you take no falling damage
- Take Spirit Bond and use the Animal Bond and Disengage Glyphs
- Wait until after Overload before going back to the main platform
- When you have Empowered Laser without the belt debuff you can disengage off the platform with 3s to go on Assembly Line, Deterrence in the air, Summon your next pet on the main platform and jump into the Pipe without taking any damage at all.
- When you have Empowered Magnets Disengage directly in front of the main pipe you use to get onto the belts, the Saw Blades never go there and you can even walk forward in between the saw blades to send your pet to the boss if your out of range.

I've been disengaging on the odd number belts and taking the pipes on the evens. Taking the pipes I've had no pet issues, but disengaging on I've had to dismiss my pet, disengage on, then recall my pet and that works fine.

&

When i DE off the belt in the small window you have to resummon a pet, i summon one on the deck then dismiss it immediately, then summon new one again on the belt (only downside is summoning a pet has like a 100000x increased chance to proc ted -.-)

Send your pet to the boss when you get back on the main platform, if its still alive when you get on the belt press pet passive for the teleport. If it de-spawns because it goes OOR attacking the boss just re-summon it on the belt.

First with Trinkets
Second with Stampede/RF/Rabid
Third with BL/Pot
Fourth with Trinkets

I solo myself 1 2 4 6 7

Any Logs of you doing this consistently and if you are doing this without a kill then you may need to find a new guild >.<.

Fast Kill = Mines, Mines, Laser, Mines, Mines, Mines, etc

Slower and Easier Kill = Missiles, Missiles, Missiles, Missiles, Mines, Mines, Missiles, etc

Your kill is so slow because people are constantly having to move and boss damage is being directed to the mines, you should really choose one way or the other. Your guild should be using Lust with all CD's for the first belt as you can do so much more damage to the boss at this time compared to any other time even if you consider soloing an extra belt. It's like 30-40% compared to 6%-15% during the other phases.

Soloing Belts

Anyone can solo a belt on 10 man heroic with a trinket proc the issue is consistency. What's the minimum buffs/procs/cooldowns you need to kill a belt (9.6m), I've had many attempts in a row where I have been able to solo belts #1 and #2 because my TED trinket decided to proc again on belt #2. Then on others I've used every cooldown without a trinket proc on belt #2 and just missed it by a 1-200k, either because my stampede did nothing or various other reasons. If your guild is tanking over the far side of the room you can lose raid buffs as well which can have an effect being able to solo a belt. Even then if your taking the whole belt to kill it then sometimes that can cause more issues getting on the next belt depending on your strategy.

If your doing progression on the belts you need consistent attempts and I'm not sure if relying on RNG to some point is going to help. If you have two hunters on the belts and the boss is being tanked far away from the belt then there's no reason not to two man from belts 2+. If you have two DPS alternating then soloing a belt here or there is going to help and without a doubt belts 1,4 & 7 can be solo'd 100% of the time. I'm sure that will change once everyone is 4/4 in almost full BiS gear.

[Reinholder]

Any Logs of you doing this consistently and if you are doing this without a kill then you may need to find a new guild >.<.

I haven't found any logs of people soloing all belts yet but I'm keen to see some examples also.

This was the fastest logged kill I could find (so let's assume that DPS is not an issue at all for these guys) and they still appear to have 2 people up on a couple of the belts.
http://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/...1&type=summary

I'm guessing it's something we'll see soon though because there'll be more people in fully upgraded BiS gear but prior to the patch I'm just having a hard time seeing it as something that could be done reliably and consistently.

[Deleted]

Ppl who claim they solo every belt are doing normal siegecrafter?